Hydroponics again

[SwampDonkey]

I'm with you Ron, I don't put anything on for pesticides. All I add is a little manure or lime when needed.  There's a point where the scale of things has to be big enough to justify the pesticides. I can't eat all of what I have, nor give it away, so why increase yields and costs to benefit Monsanto and Dow? ;D :D

[Ron Wenrich]

Wow.  Another month.  Its been 21 weeks since I started.  The weather for September was dry and cool.  I was really glad I had things self watering.  I installed some grow lights and have them on a light sensor and timer.  I'm using florescent lights, so they don't use too much electricity.  I'm now extending my growing day by 4 hours, which is about the daylight length in July. 

I've noticed quite a bit of new growth on some of the plants.  Cukes are putting out new vines, although the flowering part seems to have diminished.  The peppers are going gangbusters.  My jalapeno is now about 5' high.  I'm using a ladder for harvest.  The tomatoes keep on coming.  Even the squash have sent out new vines, although female flowers are hard to find.  The melons have pretty well given up, with very little new growth.

Here's what the jalapeno and tomato looks like.

    

Here's what it looks like when I go inside the greenhouse.   You can see the ripe peppers and cukes hanging from the ceiling. 

 

The salad bar has a new look.  Gone are the bolted lettuce, and new plants have been put in.  There are also a few herbs that I planted.  With the cooler weather, the lettuce is looking much better.   

 

I'm pleased with the yield.  19 heads of lettuce, 236 tomatoes (mostly small on 2 plants), 38 peppers (2 plants), 87 jalapenos (1 plant), 7 melons (2 plants), & 2 zucchini (1 plant).  There's still quite a bit hanging on the plants.  I'm still getting strawberries, but they come in in small numbers.  Their size is getting better.  Daily water usage continues to be about 5 gallons.  I've been eating a lot of fresh produce throughout the summer and now the fall.  I've also stopped going to the farmer's market.  It'll be interesting to see how long it goes.  My guess is when the water gets cold, growth will slow down.  I'm not planning on putting in any heat.  But, it sure is toasty inside on those cool mornings. 

[SwampDonkey]

A 5 foot jalapeno.  Mine get maybe 2 feet. They bear lots, but don't grow real tall. I just picked 3 cukes and a couple ripe peppers last week. The blight got the maters now. My onions are pulled, and they was nice and big, but the carrots were a lost cause. Everyone says their carrots didn't do well this year. Can't figure out why though, they never elongated much. Something weird. I usually have deep rooted carrots.  :-\ :

[5quarter]

Great job on your indoor garden this year! You mentioned blossom end rot on one of your tomato plants. The plant isn't getting enough calcium. I always turn a handful of lime into the soil where I'm planting tomatoes, but I don't know how you would add calcium to you're system except to boost your watering, which may not add enough to make a difference.
  I'm interested to see how many weeks you can extend your season with the setup you put together.

Nice work!

[Ron Wenrich]

I'm not sure that calcium is the answer.  I get blossom end rot on one tomato plant, but not the other.  From what I've read, it may have more to do with watering than nutrition.  That would end up being more on plant location in the watering system. 

The watering system is a simple gravity feed.  You pump water to a high point, then allow it to go out lines with emitters regulating the flow.  The plant that gets the end rot is at the end of a line, and that could be part of the problem.  The other plant is at the beginning of a line. 

Another thing is the end rot problem is also on the east side where it gets strong early morning sun.  That sun is hot enough to set my fan off at times.  Maybe its creating a drying effect on the plant.  Next year, I'll place them closer together and see if that doesn't help the problem. 

[Ron Wenrich]

Now we're into the month of November.  From years past, I know that October was usually the end of things.  We had a hard freeze in the beginning of last week, and most of the outdoor plants have given up.  The only flowers that are still flowering are the snap dragons.  The rest of the plants have died off.

But, I'm still getting tomatoes.  They're still blooming and turning ripe.  Cukes are still coming in, as are peppers.  I think the yield is starting to slow down.  Some of the fruits are getting smaller, and its taking more time for them to increase in size.  I've taken the squash plants out.  They weren't doing anything.  The melons are there just to see what they will do.  They are blooming, but I'm not doing any pollination, so there is no yield.  Strawberries are still blooming, but it takes a while for them to ripen.

I added fluorescent grow lights that extend my daylight by 4 hours each day.  I'm thinking about taking that to 6 hours in the next week or two if things are still growing.  Daytime temperatures are about 20-25° warmer.  Nighttime seems to be just a few degrees above the low.  Coldest night of the year will be tonight.  We'll see how things work out.  After that, there doesn't appear to be anything that's too bad.  I believe I could boost things by heating up the water, but I don't want to go that route.  I changed water yesterday, and water temp was 55°.  That's at the lower end for plant growth.  We'll see if it warms any on its own.

So far, its 350 tomatoes, 65 cukes, 45 peppers, 120 jalapenos, and 22 heads of lettuce.   I also have some fresh basil and cilantro growing. 

[Roxie]

Thanks for the update!  Great job! 

[SPIKER]

I would maybe do a two or one day test with the lights, as you may end up paying MORE in energy that the FOOD value coming out.   Granted great food is worth it's weight in something but may cost more than good grocery store goodies when considering what you will get vs what little is still coming off the vines.

Mark

[thecfarm]

You are right Mark,but Ron knows what is on the plants and what has been fed to them too. That is worth alot. And saying I am learning and I grew these myself.

[Ron Wenrich]

2 fluorescent lights on for 4 hours per day won't break the bank.  If they were incandescent lights, I'd need more and burn more juice.  The trade off is how much energy was burnt to bring a tomato from parts unknown to my local grocer, then I jumped in my car and drove there to pick it up.  From an energy standpoint, I think I'm ahead. 

One thing I do know is that the yield on this model far surpasses my old gardening techniques.  I thought that plant food might be a big deal, but its not.  For the season, it might be $15.  I could go to catching rain water and I was even thinking that solar power was not out of the question.  Its just a matter of how much you want to invest. 

My initial investment was pretty good, but someone who scrounges around for material could have done it cheaper.  It will take a few years to pay back my investment.

I look at the price of lettuce at the local store, and I'm ahead about $100, and I still have crop.  I'd say that my total has been about $400.  Not a great deal, but its about a month's worth of groceries, or a summer's worth of electric.  And, I only had to walk out to my garage to get off the vine fresh. 

[thecfarm]

As with anything,be it chickens or a greenhouse,the first year is always the most expensive.  :D Seem like Brenda use to use a dark bulb and a white one. Seem that gave the plants the best of both worlds. I asked her,but she forgot where she got the information  from. Maybe the internet,it has to be true.  ;D

[Ron Wenrich]

The mid-November cold snap put an end to most of the plants.  Several nights were below 20°, and that froze most of the plants.  The only thing left is some lettuce and some herbs that are freeze hardy.  But, they aren't growing much.  I'll be cleaning out the rest this week and giving it up until either February or March.  A lot depends on the weather.  I might start some from seed before that.  I even toyed with the idea of growing some lettuce inside. 

I have harvested everything I can.  I put the green tomatoes in plastic bags to help ripen.  For the most part, that's been successful.  We're still eating our peppers.  I had to freeze the jalapenos.  I have reverted to buying some store bought cucumbers.  What a step down in quality.  I was used to going out and picking them whenever I needed one.  The store bought are limp and flavorless. 

I would say that it was a very successful year from a productivity standpoint.  I didn't have to weed or prepare the garden.  It didn't take up much room.  I had little pest problems.  Seems like earwigs were the worst problem.  About every 7-10 days I had to change water, and every night I had to take a 5 gal bucket of water out to the reservoir.  Sure frees up a lot of time.

[thecfarm]

Next year will be even better now that you know what to do and not to do.

[mad murdock]

Ron, I for one, am grateful to you for your detailed play by play!  You have given a decent blueprint for others to emulate.  With worsening conditions generally (without moving this to the restricted thread), I am going to get working on something this winter so that by feb/march time here, I can do the same.  I have a spot next to the house with good sun exposure, and already have some of the initial work done to put up framework and the greenhouse.  I will have to scrounge for the best deal on material for the enclosure, and make it so i can regulate airflow on hot days.  I am looking forward to seeing what can be done on this side of the woods Thanks again, for taking the time to post your progress along the way 8) :new_year:

[SwampDonkey]

Great thing about hobby gardening, is that the reward is a full belly.  ;D :D

And yes, you've probably learned a bunch, so results can only get better next time.  8)

[Ljohnsaw]

Thanks for the great thread - loved seeing the growth and harvest.  I'm going to set up an aquaponics next spring.  It may start out as just hydro as I work out the plumbing issues.  I've started a collection of 35 gallon plastic drums that I will split lengthwise, mount in a nice wood bench and fill with lava rock.  My goal is to use a solar powered pump by day with a/c backup at night for a gravity fed ebb and flow.

Here is what I got this summer from two pots (standard dirt) loaded with cherry tomato plants (4 each pot).  I got a harvest like this every 4 or 5 days for several weeks.


 

After picking


 

[maple flats]

My wife is now getting into Hydroponics. For years she has stared her own seeds in the house at a south facing full glass door, then I put up a greenhouse when they are ready to put outside. Our greenhouse is 7 x 10 and we set it up on the back deck. We use a 1500 watt heater with thermostat to chase off the cold as needed.
This past 2-3 weeks she's been watching everything she can find on U-Tube about hydroponics. 3 days ago, I drilled some plastic tote lids (some are shoebox size and vary from 1,2 or 5   3" holes) and 2 are much larger totes with 6 holes in the lids. The last is a 2 gal bucket with 1 hole, designated for early tomatoes, the stem will be trained up the end of the rack and will then limited to no side branching and just over 4' tall, the height of the rolling rack being used. I ordered some rock wool cubes for starting the seeds, clay "marbles" to stabilize the plants and the suggested fertilizer to put in the water. The smaller boxes will be using a method, where the water under the plant starts out barely reaching the "net pot" and is about 1/4" inside. As the plant grows is uses water and the roots keep reaching down further until there is a huge root mass and lots of room for the air they heed on the roots. The larger totes she's trying to use an air pump and air stones to keep the water oxygenated. on these she will add water and periodically change the water and add new fertilizer as prescribed. I'll get some pics as this progresses.
My wife (and now my 5 yr old grandson) have green thumbs. They both save seeds from everything (almost) and plant the seeds to see what they'll get. We have had lots of various peaches (some good to eat, others get cut for firewood if they're not good) all kinds of flowers and lots of vegetables, again, some good, some go to compost. Even our 5 yr old grandson saves and plants seeds. Each thing he eats that has seeds, he saves them to plant.
This last year my wife worked her own 1.25 acre garden, plus she also worked a local community garden. At that garden (about 2 acres) she worked along with several other volunteers (and our 5 yr old grandson who actually worked each night the whole 2-2.5 hrs the rest worked). I asked my wife once if he was really any help and she said he (at 5 yrs old) worked better and harder and needed less watching over than many of the teen age and adult volunteers. Each day he asked grandma if the were going to the garden to work. That garden is solely to donate food to several local food pantries.
Back to the hydroponics, again, I'll get pics and post them.
Dave

[maple flats]

Our seeds have sprouted. When they get big enough to see in a picture I will take a pic or 2 and post.

[Ron Wenrich]

I used the rock wool method for seedlings.  I put seeds in the holes using a Q tip.  One pack of lettuce seeds go a long way.  I then put them in 3" pots using wood shavings as my medium.  Sawdust broke down and left too much dirt.  It worked out pretty good.  You do need to flush the system every month to get rid of salt buildups.

I'm not quite ready to start any seeds yet.  I might be able to get into the greenhouse in another month.  The cold snap we have right now has everything frozen up.  I figure late February may be the earliest I can start this year, unless it gets real mild.  I will also be gone for a couple of weeks in early March.

[maple flats]

I'll need to find the camera and get some pics to post. We now have plants of a wide range of sizes. It appears the Bok Choi is the biggest but many others are doing well too.

[SwampDonkey]

I suppose Ii could look it up, but what is Bok Choi? Is it a leaf vegetable or a root crop? What do you make with it? There are a lot of things in the store that I wouldn't know what to do with to make anything edible to my pallet. ;D

[giant splinter]

Bok Choi is the primary ingredient in ( Kim Chee ) a Korean staple and one of those things that takes a little getting use too. Kinda like once you get passed the smell you got it liked sorta thing.

[Ljohnsaw]

So I got my Aquaponics going now.  I started back in January accumulating stuff to build it, started construction in February and had it pretty much built by 2/13/14 and it looked like this:


 

Then I added the media (lava rock, aka Scoria) and a metal lattice and on 3/11/14 it looked like this:


 

I was starting the water cycle and also some plants indoors.  I transplanted and they were not doing too well.  I stuck some seeds in here and there and promptly forgot what was what.  A few of my transplants survived and were looking like this on 5/15/14:


 
You can see the cabbage up front with some broccoli trying to grow.  There are some short bush beans, leaf lettuce and tomatoes too.

Eleven days later on 5/26/14, it looked like this:


 

Overall shot, the broccoli in the foreground is a bit wilted - still getting the watering system to flow properly and we had a heat wave:


 

And finally, not the greatest picture, but on 6/19/14 its going pretty well:


 
The stuff trailing off the left end is some Butternut squash.  I've got about a dozen or so squash coming along.  My Zuccs and watermelon never appeared.  Have to plant some more seeds...

I add a little iron every 2 weeks to keep it looking good.  I bought a dozen feeder gold fish and put them in the main fish tank.  I few of them like to take the ride (despite my screen) through the outlet works into my swirl filter.  I net them and put them back but I have a couple of regulars that like the ride. :  I'm down to nine fish now but I didn't have any floaters. ???  I found one fish (alive) in the distribution tank that feeds the grow beds (he made it out of the swirl filter).  I added another screen to prevent that again.  But I think the missing three took a long ride down the pipes to the grow beds. :(