Treating Lumber

Tree Feller · March 31, 2013, 10:13:03 PM

When I sticker-stack my hardwood lumber, I treat it with Timbor to discourage bug infestation. I use a pump sprayer and have been treating each board individually, both sides and ends, as it is placed on the stack. Working by myself, this takes a looong time. Treating one or two sawn logs isn't such a big deal but I recently stacked around 3k bf of Walnut and Oak. Is it necessary to treat each individual board this way or is it possible to simply treat the outside of the completed stack and still get adequate bug control?

WDH · April 01, 2013, 08:42:43 AM

I have wondered the same thing. I still spray each board top and bottom and both edges. It is a pain in the butt log. I bought a 25 gallon spray tank with a diaphragm pump that operates off a rechargeable 12V battery pack. It operates at 60 psi and is much much faster than a pump up sprayer or backpack sprayer. It was this one without the stand.

http://www.tractorsupply.com/en/store/fimco-25-gallon-atv-mounted-sprayer

thecfarm · April 01, 2013, 11:30:00 AM

Could the solution be used,mixed in the blade lube. To pricey for that I suppose,coverage??

Jay C. White Cloud · April 01, 2013, 12:04:54 PM

Hi Folks,

I am going to try when I have more time, to post some here for you to poke at, and ask questions. You can't use disodium octaborate tetrahydrate (the active ingredient) in Tim-Bor in or on your equipment. It is sodium based and could cause corrosion from what I understand from.

Regards,

jay

WDH · April 01, 2013, 08:41:57 PM

I have been using this sprayer for a year and a half and so far no issues.

Jay C. White Cloud · April 01, 2013, 09:40:36 PM

Sorry, WDH, I meant as a lubricant in a saw mill instead of water like Thecfarm had suggested. In sprayers is fine, that is the preferred application method.

WDH · April 01, 2013, 09:54:42 PM

Yeah, I could not see it working as part of the blade lube either.

Jay C. White Cloud · April 02, 2013, 08:48:15 AM

Treefeller, et al,

I am going to look deeper into this, as alternative application goes for you, with my contacts. In commercial pest control, this is a common use compound, often in different matrixes, and very effective, even against fungi. It was my preferred use type for schools and hospitals, as it is broadspectrum, and fairly innocuous to pets and humans, but effective to target species.

Regards,

jay

Tree Feller · April 02, 2013, 06:16:47 PM

Thanks, Jay.

red oaks lumber · April 02, 2013, 07:03:24 PM

why do you feel the need to treat wood? in my climate if you have good air flow during the critical period of drying you wont have any bugs.

Tree Feller · April 02, 2013, 07:42:29 PM

Quote from: red oaks lumber on April 02, 2013, 07:03:24 PM
why do you feel the need to treat wood? in my climate if you have good air flow during the critical period of drying you wont have any bugs.

I build furniture from my lumber. I don't want bugs like PPB's hatching out and emerging in someone's living room. I've never heard of air flow being an effective deterrant.

WDH · April 02, 2013, 08:00:19 PM

Steve,

The PPB's are the issue. They only get in the lumber once it is dry. They are a scourge.

red oaks lumber · April 02, 2013, 09:14:58 PM

i've been sawing and drying wood for ever and never had any bug issues but, before any wood is used i kiln dry it. having said that i have had hardwoods that have been air drying for 4 plus years with no problems.is it my northern climate?
maybe because no grits are present at this high of latitude :D no grits = bug free wood ;D

sorry danny

WDH · April 02, 2013, 10:02:42 PM

Yeah, I think that it is the climate. Too hot and humid here and the PPB's love the heat and the grits

. I have had them get into red oak, white oak, pecan (bad), persimmon, wlanut sapwood, and yellow poplar. I do not kiln dry, and I cannot take the chance that they are in the wood. Plus, even if you kiln dry, then stack the wood in a shed, they can (will) get in your wood down here.

You live in the cold, glaciated, frozen north with a growing season of 2 days and apparently no PPB's. I bet the mosquitoes are bad, though

.

red oaks lumber · April 03, 2013, 07:21:45 AM

as evening begins so do the mosqitoes.

chet · April 03, 2013, 07:22:26 PM

Red Oaks, is any of that wood you have air drying Maple? I am even further north than you, and can never totally air dry Maple and not have PPB's show up. I've even had them show up in the sapwood of Red Oak. :-\

red oaks lumber · April 03, 2013, 09:01:17 PM

some maple mostly white ash, red and white oak, basswood , birch. if i keep the bundles out in the good air flow i have no bugs, maybe i'm lucky but i think there is more to it than luck.
i custom dry for the public and have seen bugs in others wood but, haven't had any cross comtamination yet

WDH · April 03, 2013, 09:07:36 PM

You are living right :D. I think that grits corrupt the PPB's and make them harder to deal with

.

bama20a · April 06, 2013, 08:17:09 AM

I've got a question. Tree Feller you said you use Timbor to DISCOURAGE Bug infestation.
Will it kill the bugs that is already in the wood? If not what is a good product to use ? Thanks Mark,,,,,

Tree Feller · April 06, 2013, 02:42:17 PM

Tim-Bor is mostly a topical application as the borates don't soak very deeply into the wood. Another Texas sawyer that I consider a reputable source says that Bor-A-Care will actually penetrate deeply enough to kill existing infestations. I haven't any first-hand experience with it, though.

mesquite buckeye · April 06, 2013, 11:55:21 PM

Powderpost beetles only eat sapwood, so why bother spraying heartwood? Should only need to treat boards withs sapwood and only the sapwood parts. :P

Jay C. White Cloud · April 07, 2013, 12:04:57 AM

Mainly yes, not only, there are indications that some varieties of these will turn a timber to powder, under the correct conditions (low level of barn with livestock and high humidity.) You are correct that for the most part they only feed on the sap wood, but many will go all the way through. I am trying to put some up to date facts together on different chemical treatments. I am not a big fan of high heat kiln drying, but it does kill all beetles and larvae present.

mesquite buckeye · April 07, 2013, 12:07:10 AM

But can't the beetles reinfest under moist conditions? Kind of like the thinking that once lumber is kiln dried that somehow it is magically protected from getting wet again. Just thinkin'

WDH · April 07, 2013, 07:42:46 AM

Exactly, especially if stored outside like in a shed or a barn. Does not have to be moist. The lumber just has to be exposed to the outside environment where the beetles can gain access.

Tree Feller · April 07, 2013, 12:47:08 PM

Quote from: mesquite buckeye on April 07, 2013, 12:07:10 AM
But can't the beetles reinfest under moist conditions? Kind of like the thinking that once lumber is kiln dried that somehow it is magically protected from getting wet again. Just thinkin'

That's the reason for the borate treatment. Even though some kilns get the lumber hot enough to sterilize it, it absolutely can become infested or re-infested later.

I saw lumber for my own use for building furniture and some craft-type items. Some items I keep, some I sell and some I give away. It's primarily a hobby for me. I probably have enough Walnut lumber to last the rest of my life if it doesn't degrade from rot or critters. I have some labor invested in the lumber but not a lot of money as the logs were free. I want to preserve the lumber if possible but I also don't want to spend an inordinate amount of time on it as I have plenty of other stuff to do when home. That was the impetus behind the original question of whether treating each individual board was necessary when stickering lumber.

I've enjoyed the discussion, though.