Multi stemmed trees

[Lnewman]

In improving my woodlot I have come across numerous trees that have two or more stems springing from the same root system.  Sometimes one is dominant.  sometime 2 or even more look good.  Most are red maple but there are some black locust and other species.   I have heard in the past advice to cut all but the dominant or future sawtimber stem, but I have also heard that cutting them may cause rot.  What do you recommend?

[Ron Scott]

Retain the best crop tree in place within the group, usually the best dominant tree. Use care to prevent any damage to the crop tree while doing the release work. Hand release usually works best for such situations.

[Lnewman]

What is hand release?

[beenthere]

I'd be thinking with a chainsaw in hand, rather than with something on the end of a boom.
Can be much more careful that way and not damage the saved stem.

[Ron Scott]

Yes, sorry I didn't explain it. Hand Work would be doing the work by a person using a chain saw to cut each individual tree rather than the Mechanical Method which would be using a tree harvesting machine such as a shears or hot saw feller buncher, boom harvester, etc. There would be less potential for damage to the released tree while removing the others in the clump. This would result in less potential for future rot and any rot would be retained in the lower butt log.

[Ianab]

The chances of rot developing mostly depend on how quickly the tree can heal over the wound you create. So getting rid of those other leaders early (while they are only small) and being careful about exactly how you cut them helps. Take off a 1" side leader, and it's healed over in a couple of seasons. Take off a 4" branch and it's going to take longer, leaving more time for decay to get a start. Using a good hand saw may be an option, pretty quick on small stuff, and lets you be very precise where you make the cut. A chainsaw can cause a lot of collateral damage to the bark of the stems you are trying to save.

Ian

[Lnewman]

What do you do if the stems to be removed are 9-10 inches or more?

[beenthere]

What do you do if the stems to be removed are 9-10 inches or more?

Make firewood out of them. ;)

[Ianab]

Make firewood out of them. ;)

That would be the whole tree...

If it's practical, cull the whole tree and leave the space for better nearby trees to grow. Taking off a large branch like that leaves a big hole, takes a long time to heal over, and there is a high chance that decay will get into the remaining stem. Also the remaining stem is probably growing crooked by this stage as well.

If you do this sort of pruning, I think it needs to be early, in the sapling stage.

Ian

[mesquite buckeye]

In Missouri, there are a fair number of 2 stemmed walnuts, one usually bigger than the other. When the smaller one is too small for a sawlog, usually it gets left, the otherstem cut as low as possible. In 20 or so years, the small trunk is often bigger than the original larger one, with little basal degrade.

The benefit here is twofold. The root system is already in place, and when the main trunk is removed, the smaller one has a place to grow into, with lots of shove. 8)

[Ianab]

Possibly works better with Walnut as it's more rot resistant and the wood is more stable. Even if the tree isn't perfectly straight you can still saw good boards out of it.

Ian

[g_man]

I have a similar question to Lnewman's. I cut a stand of old balsam fir out of an area that was surrounded by younger hardwood. Mostly Red maple, Yellow Birch, and Pin cherry. Most of the Maple and Birch are multi-stemmed. I started to thin the residual trees by cutting the pin cherry and leaving the best stem on the maple and birch. But it seemed to be getting to open so I quit and I don't really know if I should continue. I am looking for advise on how or if I should treat this area at this time.

In the first picture you can see cut pin cherry on the ground, how open it is becoming, and all the multi-stemmed sapplings/poles around. In the center is a Red Maple with a big stump. The second picture is of the stump showing all the cuts I made. Does this level of pruning make sense. Or is it to much and would be better to just cut them all. ??

Thanks



 



 

[Clark]

Lnewman - I assume from your description that you are talking about stumps that have sprouted two or more stems and now they are tree size and the stump may not even be present?  If yes then the other factor that hasn't been mentioned is species.  With certain species you can thin multi-stemmed  stump sprouts with no ill effect on the remaining ones.  Other species do not take well to that and fungus will enter the remaining stems.  Oak is notable amongst this later group and that is why foresters prefer seedlings from acorns and not from stumps.  My memory is getting foggy about the other hardwoods but I'm quite certain basswood can be thinned with no ill effects.  The maples and birches I can't remember.

g_man - I like what you're doing with your hardwoods.  It does look like things are getting quite thin there.  You might try thinning the birch and maple clumps first and then taking every pin cherry that is within X feet of a thinned clump.  I would say 5-6' should be good.

Some of those pin cherry look like they were tall, are they keeping up in height with the birch and maple?  Or do they soon fall behind?

Clark

[Ron Scott]

g-man,

It looks like you are doing some intensive weeding and release of the best trees that you have. I would try to stay within a 70-90 sq. ft. basal area range with the stems that you have,  working with your dominant and codominant trees of the favored hardwood species of maple, birch,etc. Some of the lower quality and conifer stems may also be included as wildlife trees and stand diversity so as not to open up the stand too much.  Also protect and retain any hardwood regeneration that you might start get.

There have been several Threads that fully explain basal area if you need to have further understanding of it in hardwood management.

[Lnewman]

Are all multistemmed trees caused by sprouting from a stump of a tree that was previously cut?

[mesquite buckeye]

Or some other type of basal damage like deer rubs and other debarking.....

Some trees are also naturally multitrunked.

[g_man]

Thanks for the help. The pin cherry were quite tall. Even with the maple and birch and not showing any sign of fading yet.
I like the idea of cutting the multible stems now and leaving the pin cherry to cut later or let die naturally. That might help entice height on the maple and birch and that way it won't get so thin.
I understand the concept of basal area and the a, b, c lines on the charts but I dont know how to measure it or have a mental picture looking at the woods what it is. I can figure the avg Dia and area of a tree and then figure how many square ft per stem.

[Clark]

A 1" wide piece of cardboard, wood, metal, etc. held 33" from your eye or a penny (.75" wide) held 24.75" from your eye will give you a 10 factor prism.  So aim for 7-9 "in" trees using a 10 factor.

I think you'll save yourself a lot of work just releasing the clumps.  I would strongly encourage you to release around each clump, too.  Growing crowns grow more wood.  After the clump is thinned you can probably take out 2-4 cherry that are rubbing the crown of the crop tree and you'll be good.  From the looks of your photo it seems like you've already got one quality log in the bottom of each crop tree so giving them more room shouldn't hurt.  If you do change thinning methods it will be interesting to see the differences down the road.

Clark

[Ken]

I would be more cautious with heavy thinning around the yellow birch.  They tend to sprout a lot of epicormic branches when exposed to more sunlight on the stem.  Although it looks pretty when it's opened up the pin cherry, if left to die naturally, will help to train the yb stems to grow straight . 

When thinning maple clumps quite often the tree growing in the center has a greater chance of not being susceptible to windthrow or ice damage as it usually does not have a lean to it.  When we do pre-commercial work we are always told to leave no more than 2 stems in a maple clump but when I am harvesting I always like to come up on a mature stem with several stems.

[g_man]

I have noticed that the YB seem very susceptabe to branching. Seems like they can shoot out a branch 6 feet in no time if there is some sun to get. If I have a YB tree that is already branched out does it do any good to prune the live branches to get a clean stem or does that just promote more vigorous branching ?

[thecfarm]

Red oak are real bad too. I leave them in the grown up pasture. Just like kicking a hornets nest with limbs now. But I'm leaving the oak for the wildlife. I am thinking about a pruning saw,but the money factor.

[SwampDonkey]

The epicormic branching is a problem in young hardwood if too open. When the trees are mature however, this diminishes. I've got some mature yellow birch here that are open and not a sprout on them, however beside them were younger trees that sprouted up. They later died from scald. Birch is real fussy when opened up too much, it will often die back in the top and if real thick grown, then opened up, but tall and skinny it will bend over when the sap flows and look like an ice storm hit it.  :

Multi-stemmed  hardwood I just look at as pulp and firewood trees. It helps to thin the stump, but I won't be holding out for any saw log or veneer to come off it in the future.

[Phorester]

Some things to look for when choosing which sprout to leave on a clump of stump sprouts: the tallest sprout is the most vigorous, the sprout lowest on the stump will develop the least amount of rot; the straightest sprout will produce the highest commercial quality tree.

Easiest choice is when the tallest sprout is also the lowest on the stump and also the straightest.  If none of the sprouts have all 3 attributes, then go for the best sprout that has 2 of these attributes.   If this doesn't exist, then go for the tallest (indicates the most vigorous).

For those 8" - 10" diameter sprouts your talking about, if you have only 2 of these big ones and they are equal in size, height on the stump, evenly spaced around the stump, and of equal straightness, I'd be tempted to leave them both so as to produce less rot. More than 2, I'd take them down to one.  At that size, I don't think enough rot would develop in the one you left before it grew to commercial size.

But first, I'd see if there is a single stemmed tree of appropriate species close by, and manage that one over multi-sprouted trees next to it.