going electric now

[KenPlum]

I haven't heard anyone mention the possibility that the motor should be explosion proof I work with motors all day and I know that they create a lot of spark and potential for a fire in confined spaces .  Have you looked into that aspect it would be beneficial especially if you plan on putting it in a shed or building. just a question you may want to know the answer to. pc_smiley

[Kingcha]

The mill will be under a roof but not an enclosed building.

[Larry]

Google NEC 430.52  That is the bible for sizing breakers for motor loads.  You will find a much higher amp breaker is allowed.  Just because a large breaker is allowed does not mean you have to use that size.  Your motor may start just fine with a smaller breaker.  Call WM and ask for their recommendation.

When I tried google a few minutes ago I found a pretty neat utube that explains the whole topic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_7FmwY442dQ

[Kingcha]

Thank you, Thank you Larry.   I will google as soon as I am done with this post and watch your video.

You will find a much higher amp breaker is allowed.  Just because a large breaker is allowed does not mean you have to use that size.  Your motor may start just fine with a smaller breaker.

again thank you, this is what I needed

[wesdor]

Just checked on my installation. We used 60 amp breaker and 25 feet of 6 gauge wire from box to junction box by mill.  Then 25 feet more from the box to the mill.

The 6/3 so wire was $5 / ft. 

So far everything has worked fine.  I just need more time to saw.   

[mometal77]

I have seen a remote shut off switch with an rf frequency on a 220 v electric motor.  Like on a friends electric sawmill he just has a 3 way switch reverse works great works pretty good. Easier than having a gen set and 3 phase. I sometimes google electrical forums with some great ideas as well. Mikeholt.. electricantalk ect...
Nice thing is electric is far more powerful than gas and with a brushless motor never have an issue and if you do far more easier to work on or replace over gas.  Nice thing about stationary mill's they never grows legs.

[Kingcha]

Thanks for looking wesdor.   I might bump up the breaker size, but after reading a little more I am pretty comfortable with my understanding of it at least. 

[thecfarm]

Electric is nice and quiet too.

[Magicman]

Wire size and breaker size should be matched.  #6 is rated for a 70 amp breaker and #4 is rated for a 100 amp breaker.  Another option that I would seriously consider is #2 aluminum.  It about ½ the cost of copper, and with today's connectors, the aluminum is not an issue.

[Fil-Dill]

I think those amp ratings for that size of wires may be only for free air installation.

[jim blodgett]

I have a 10 hp electric on a double pole 50 amp breaker.  Runs great.  All day for several days at a time when I get into a large pile of logs...ran it all day for a month or so a few years ago, no overheating, no breaker issues, no problems.

[Kingcha]

Jim did you run 6/3 wire and if so how long was the run?    Any of the run underground?   

[jim blodgett]

Just climbed up there and checked, from the breaker to the outlet it's 8-3 copper w/#10 ground NMB - solid stranded wire, maybe 16 feet.  From the mill to the male end (which, of course plugs into the outlet) it's #8 softwire, which I THINK means it's braided (but I'm not sure) - maybe 25 feet.

I hired an electrician to wire my mill shed originally and don't recall getting into the electrical mini panel that came with my mill so I'm pretty sure that's the way it came.  If it makes any difference, I bought the mill new, from Linn Lumber (after lots of reading, looking, narrowing choices to 2, then test driving the Linn and the comparable Woodmizer the same day).

I know Woodmizer is king and all that, and did consider that fact into my decision.  But in my mind the Linn had advatages that far outweighed the fact that Woodmizer was the more well established.  After 5 or 6 years of sporadic, at times heavy use, I don't regret my choice.

Shoot, forgot, came back to say no, none of my wiring is underground.  It's all overhead.

[Al_Smith]

A couple of points here .Regarding a demend meter you very seldom see one on a single phase service and certainly not on a residential service . With increased amperage on start up it's a trivial matter at best .Plus unless the motor were being constaintly switched off and on it's unlikely you would over heat the motor .I mean on a tablesaw it's done all the time and how many table saw motors get burned up ,not many .

Regarding dust ignition it can be a problem .An explosion proof moter costs a kings ransome if you've ever priced one .That's only the half of it because the rest of the installation also has to be rated group 3 class one exploson proof as well too comply.

A single phase motor has a start switch ,a three phase motor does not thus no open arcing .A three phase motor has more starting torque than a single phase .

So it's an option if a person wanted to delve into it to run a three phase from a rotary phase converter and probabley less expensive providing it was done with used parts .People like to argue  it costs more to run but I've been doing it for years and really can prove with an amp meter that kind of thinking is erronious .

There's several options here to solve the same problem .I' m just presenting one method .

[LAZERDAN]

I really have to agree with Al on this one , rotary phase converter is the way to go.  In my opinon it is the right way to go, you will find more options in the 3 phase world. Like Al says cheaper in the long run

[Al_Smith]

Well to begin with a 10 HP single phase is one costly motor .Used 3 phase motors usually go cheap .All a phase converter is in reality is another three phase motor and a couple of capactors and a start stop circuit .It's an induction generater ,there's nothing magic about it .

You have to factor in other things of course like a magnetic starter ,controls etc .You can't just start a large motor by plugging in the cord like it was a window fan ,toaster ,curling iron  or something .

[Kingcha]

Dang I almost want to go back to my original plan and buy my mill with a diesel engine.   Way less confusing

[york]

Well ya know what???i am getting talked out of going with electric power too-my old mill needs new power unit,because the diesel is tired,almost 20 yr.old and was not big enough anyhow....albert

[Al_Smith]

 :D It's not that confusing now .Go with the electric .It will always start if you've payed the light bill .

Some cold Jan. morning when you have to put a salamander heater on that diesel to get it started and pay 4 plus bucks a gallon to listen to that noisey thing you'll think back and say "why did I go this route ". ;D

[Al_Smith]

Besides all that that danged diesel needs the oil changed ,anti freeze ,parts ,etc etc etc .All that ever goes bad on an electric motor is the bearings about every 20 years .What 50 bucks and 4 hours work you're back in business for another 20 years .Pshaw you can dump 50 and change in just the oil and filters for that smelley diesel .

[Kingcha]

I guess you made the single phase route sound so bad and if I go electric that is the route I am going.

[Al_Smith]

I didn't say it was bad ,I merely suggested another route to go .

A diesel really isn't bad either nor is a gasser .Just depends on what you want to do with it .

The good thing about electric is when all your buddys want you to haul the mill over about three countys cutting up yard trees just because you're a nice guy .You can just merely state it's not possible .

[Kingcha]

I have no problem saying no, but I will still go electric.    No fumes, less maintenance and I am sure I have gotten enough info to correctly wire it. :P