need advice about buying a new stihl

[barak]

Hello
I want to buy a new stihl chainsaw and I'm a bit confused.
I need the saw to work about twice a week for about 1 hour, and about every 2 or 3 months I need it for a 3-6 hours work.
I had an MS 180 which I bought 2'nd hand. It was awful; I couldn't work with it more than 20 minutes on a row.
I was told that the problem was that the MS 180 is from the compact series (Homeowner saws), and these saws are not built to work more than 2 hours a day, and even one time of long working period could destroy the saw.
I went to several dealers, and I got different answers from them.
The first one told me that I can use the MS 271, but the MS 250 would be more than enough for me because it can work many hours on a row day after day.
The second dealer told me that the best for me is the MS 270 or the MS 271. He told me that the MS 250 would be good too, and the MS 211 wouldn't be strong enough.
The third one told me that the MS 211 would be the best for me, and the MS 250, MS 270 and MS 271 would be all unnecessarily heavy and expensive for me.
Another two dealers told me that all of the saws from the compact series (Homeowner saws), including the MS 250, could be damaged from a work of few hours on a raw (more than 1 or 2 hours), and they recommended me to get one of the farm & ranch saws or better than that to buy a not stihl saw which is chipper and lighter than the 270/271. One recommended the Stiga SP 43 and the other recommended the Tanaka 4500.
As I said, I got confused. I want to buy a good saw that would be reliable, yet I don't want to buy an unnecessarily heavy and expensive saw.
Does anyone have a good advice for me? 

p.s.
A friend gave me an advice: "buy the MS 211 or the MS 250, and in any case make a 30 minutes break after every 1 hour of work" what do you think about that?

[DaleK]

What will you be cutting with it? Softwood, hardwood, lumber? I got a new MS 441 last fall, I'm happy with it but it may or may not be more saw than you want.

[NWP]

What will you be cutting with it?  Ex. Small trees/brush or larger logs. Is this somewhat production based use or stuff around the house?

Oh, and welcome to the Forum.

[barak]

I will be cutting woods for heating. Mainly small trees that fell down, but every now and than some big trees.
I have to say that my budget is limited, and I also prefer a not heavy saw if it is good enough.

[Ianab]

Well for a start, your MS180 had some sort of fault. Any saw should be able to run continuously. But on a small cheap saw like a 180 it's might cost more to troubleshoot and fix than the saw is worth.

How long it should last is another question. Use a homeowner grade saw like that all day for 3 months, and it's probably worn out. Using it only 2 hours a day max, it's should last for a few years. Those little "home owner" saws are really for gardening, cleaning up an occasional fallen tree or limb, pruning etc. A pro saw should run for years, even used all day every day.

Now what to buy?

For serious firewood cutting I would not go below the MS271. That's the smallest that Stihl class as "Farm and Ranch" in your market. Not as good as the pro saws, but if you want to spend the whole weekend lopping up firewood, it can handle it. Going bigger is probably overkill for what you are doing, but that's often a matter of perspective. My "small" saw is 60cc (MS310), and my "go to" saw is a 79cc Dolmar. But we often have bigger trees to deal with.

Other brands? Yes they are an option. Depends on the local dealer support usually. But lots of other companies make decent chainsaws, often cheaper than Stihl.

There should be no reason to "rest" a saw, although you might want to rest the operator. When you get tired, that's when you make mistakes

Ian

[Caloren]

Barak,
I use an MS310, an 028 and a MS 170. We own 16 acres in the Sierra's and I use the 310 and 028 to cut down the larger trees and the 170 to trim the branches. We have a lot of brush [second growth tan oak and madrone] and I have the 170 right on the ground clearing this stuff so all the dirt has helped me wear out a couple of bars. but the little 170 still runs fine after about 6 years of this use. I have cut down 12" diameter trees with the 14" 170 [ which is to big for the saw] just because the larger saws were way down the hill. When cutting fire wood [only 6 or 8 cords a year] I use the 170 up to 6" diameter, then use one of the other saws. To cut to the chase: I've used the 170 several hours a day with no problems. I use it twice as much as my other saws.
For light use like you describe I think you needn't worry about homeowner vs pro saw, but you say you have an occasional larger tree so the 170 - 180 might be a little too small. Choose a saw appropriate for the largest tree you will have to cut.
Ian makes some good points, and he has a LOT more experience than I do!  :
Loren

[drobertson]

I have to agree with the others,  if it were me, I would just grab a few and see how they feel to you, anything in the mid 20's should be fine, maybe with the 16" bar,  just find one that fits you, and the need,   david

[bandmiller2]

Is the price you pay for a saw an accurate way to determine quality and pro/nonpro.?? Frank C.

[Ianab]

Is the price you pay for a saw an accurate way to determine quality and pro/nonpro.?? Frank C.

To some extrent.

Like any saw that's $99.95 IS NOT going to be a "pro" saw.  :D

Size isn't an indication, as saws like the MS201 are a 35cc pro grade saw. But they certainly aren't cheap...

Ian

[JuniperBoss]

Well for a start, your MS180 had some sort of fault. Any saw should be able to run continuously. But on a small cheap saw like a 180 it's might cost more to troubleshoot and fix than the saw is worth.

I can say from experience that a few hours with the 170 can and will, in fact, destroy the engine. Just that long cutting trees that are too big, or using it at high throttle for too long can mess it up bad. Ive heard this from several people. My own saw was destroyed after just an hour or two running at too high of a throttle for too long. Barak, do not buy any homeowner saw from stihl for firewood, especially big firewood. Get a farm and ranch saw, something bigger but still pretty small. An ms 290, which I myself use, is a great saw but you might even go a bit smaller than that. Like Ianab said, perhaps the smallest of the farm/ranch saws would fit you best.

[Furu]

The older 026 model replaced by the 260 then 261 was/is a pro saw both in name and in fact.  I have one that I have been using for smaller work for 20 years and it is a thing of beauty.  I use my 460 for the larger stuff.  Not certain but the 230, 250  were more the homeowner saws not meant for longer high use work and the 271, 290 were classed as a mid range saw.

[Ianab]

Well yeah, hours of serious cutting with a MS170 or 180 would be cruel and unusual punishment  :D

What I mean is it should run fine for light duty stuff. Limbing / pruning like it's designed for. Blocking up a big log? That is asking a bit much.

Ian

[JuniperBoss]

Oh, I see what you mean. It really is cruel and unusual punishment :D. Limbing, however, is fine and if you don't work it hard it can last for years.

[mad murdock]

Unless you are tied to a specific brand of saw because of local availability or dealer support, become colorblind, there are a lot of good saws out there and they aren't all orange and white, IMO.

[Ianab]

Thinking about it, cutting firewood can be harder on a saw than professional tree felling.

If you are dropping trees, the saw runs wide open for maybe 30 sec. Then it gets a rest. Then you go and limb and buck the tree. Shorts bursts of cutting. 5 min later you are walking to the next tree and starting again. But probably only 60 sec of full throttle cutting?

Now cutting firewood, you have a log sitting there, and you are sawing it into 12-18" chunks, one after the other. Full throttle 90% of the time for a whole 5 or 10 mins?

The MS291 - 391 range saws can handle this, at least for a while. "Home owner" grade saws? Cruel and unusual punishment" springs to mind again.

Ian

[ladylake]

Unless you are tied to a specific brand of saw because of local availability or dealer support, become colorblind, there are a lot of good saws out there and they aren't all orange and white, IMO.

Right, small Echo or Dolmar saws are built way better than homeowner Stihl saws for about the same cost. If you have to get a Stihl I'd get a used 026 or MS260 in good shape.   Steve

[s grinder]

Picked up a MS261 with a 16' bar just before Christmas,gave it a good weeks work last week helping out my friend in the tree removal business,nice saw but not cheap,also have a MS660 for my stump grinding business,like Inab said firewood,is tough on a saw,and so is cutting down stumps.

[barak]

Well the 261 is over my budget, the 271 is a bit heavy for me (I'm not a big Guy), the 250 is rated Homeowner... hard decision. Mybe I'll go for the "not a Stihl saw", but which one?
p.s. it is first time for me in this forom so thanks alot for all the help :laugh:

[lumberjack48]

You can take a 250 and work it 8 hrs straight, it don't need no breaks as long as its adjusted right and ran right by the owner.

The only thing that will burn a saw up is if the chain is dull or the carb set to lean and if theres a air leak. [ of course no oil in the gas will to ]

These dealers that are telling you, you have to give a saw a rest, i don't know what to saw, never heard of such a thing. :P

[barak]

According to what you say the 250 will be just good for me, as long as I will maintain it properly. Well that's what the two first dealers told me.
The advice about giving the saw a rest was given by a non pro friend... :

[lumberjack48]

The Echo and Dolmar are good saws, buy the one that'll give you the best warranty, and you feel you'll get the best service from.

[John Mc]

What ever saw you get, buy it from a real dealer who can service it (and knows what he is doing).  Many saws are coming from the factory set way too lean.  This helps them meet the EPA requirements, but can burn up a saw pretty quickly (especially on long, hard cuts).  Have the dealer check and adjust the carb mixture for you, and then bring it back in to be checked again after you've run 5 or 6 tanks of gas through it.

Use fresh premium gas (non-ethanol gas if you can find it), and a good quality mix oil. Once the gas gets more than a few weeks old, dump it in your lawnmower or car and get fresh gas for your saw. (You might get away with using older gas, but why take the chance? A chainsaw is a tough application for an engine. Use that stale gas in something that's not pushed so far to the limit.)

Keep the chain sharp - a dull chain makes both the saw and the operator work harder.

Failure to follow the above guidelines (and others may have more tips to add) will contribute as much or more to the premature death of a saw than the brand or model.  I'm not saying to buy a junk saw... get the best you can afford, but whatever you get, take care of it properly.

[gspren]

  There is always more than one way to look at it, 17 years ago I needed a saw and didn't cut much more than you do but I really like good tools so I got a 044 with a 20 inch bar. The neighbor thought I was nuts because he uses cheap saws but  now 17 years later he has bought 3 cheap saws and spent more money than I did and his newest cheap saw won't begin to cut like my old 044. The cost per year of a pro saw is often lower if you just take care of it plus you get the job done faster.

[ladylake]

  Don't go by the Stihl name, a MS250 is a cheap saw not the cheapest but not built near as good as a Echo or Dolmar in that size and price range plus the MS250 is real hard to work on, high priced parts, might not have a adjudtable carb or oiler.  Stihl makes real good Pro saws but real spendy.    Steve

[John Mc]

...The cost per year of a pro saw is often lower if you just take care of it plus you get the job done faster.

Agreed, those folks that don't take care of their tools properly, are probably better off with the cheap saw.  If you're going to junk a saw, it might as well be one that was junk to start with.