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Need a tractor - Need some answers

Started by Schramm, February 16, 2013, 02:44:08 PM

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Schramm

Well I quickly came to the realization that I am going to need a tractor to move things around so now I need some info from you guys on how you are moving your logs around.  I do not want to be stuck to always cutting ones that I can move with less effort.  I have the LT10 so I can do up to 24" logs but my best guess on a log that is 14" on both end in white oak and 10' long is 600+ lbs.  I have seen that many of you have a tractor and I was wondering how that works for you or if there is another way.  I have called Kabota and John Deere and got $16000-20000 quotes which really are not an issue as they both said that they would take my Corvette as a trade however I am wondering if there is another way without a tractor.  If I could outfit the tractor with a set of forks and other attachments then it would be worth the trade.

Rob

fishpharmer

I would consider investing in a log arch by our sponsor Logrite...

http://www.logrite.com/store/Category/log-arches

Not that a tractor would not be useful around a mill, it would.
Built my own band mill with the help of Forestry Forum. 
Lucas 618 with 50" slabber
WoodmizerLT-40 Super Hydraulic
Deere 5065E mfwd w/553 loader

The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls looking like hard work. --Tom A. Edison

sealark37

Carefully examine the actual lifting capacity of the modern mid-sized tractors equipped with the front end loader(FEL).  Some will not lift 600 lbs.  Most useful are the larger industrial models of the Ford, Massey Ferguson and similar solid front axle tractors equipped with a grapple bucket on the FEL.  You need one that will lift 2000# to meet the needs of a sawmill.  The larger skid steers will also handle a ton or more.  You may also need to look at the smaller center pivot loaders offered by most machinery firms.  They are more expensive, but the are faster, have better traction, and plenty of extra capacity.  Just what I have seen while playing in the mud.  Regards, Clark

pineywoods

New tractors are nice, but there is another way. Used older tractors will do the job, sometimes better than the newer gadget-loaded models. I used an old (1960's) massey ferguson gas burner for years. Not much trouble to cobble up a set of home-made forks to put on the 3-pt hitch. Now i have a larger sized kubota M4700 with a front loader and forks, winch on the back. I'm kinda spoiled..
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

highleadtimber16

Schramm, Have you considered a Bobcat or excavator? I have both and work very well for me. I do prefer the excavator for the long reach and thumb. It's also very easy to move lumber/beams around with a couple straps. The bobcat is nice to but I find it very difficult to get in and out of. I use a model 763 but you could go smaller no problem. Hitachi, Cat, John Deere (same company as Hitachi) and Komatsu are all very good brands. I find that a 75 Hitachi is the perfect size for me. But a 50 or even a little 27 would be fine for a small operation. Anyways good luck!

Ryder,
2011 Wood-Mizer LT 40 hyd w/ 12' Extension,
EG 200 Wood-Mizer
Cutting Old Growth Cedar from Queen Charlotte Islands.

roger 4400

Hi. I own a Massey 1643, 43 hp 4 wheel drive and love it. A set of forks works great, get the "" skid steer  quick attach ""it  is universal so you can buy attachment from any makers,  so you can switch from your bucket to your forks in a short time. To log with a tractor a 4 wd is a plus, almost a must. Try to get a logging winch on your pto, I have one they are fantastic and if you can afford it,a cone so your logs will not jam on other trees or rocks when you winch,, it will slide. When lifting something with the loader or forks  ALWAYS put some weight on the back of your tractor 500 to 800 pounds are good if your loader can lift 1000 or 1200 pounds , the counterweight in the back will help your stability and will release the pressure on your front axel. Industrial tire are stronger  but less traction than agricultural tires. Hydrostatic transmission works great for me, more precise than a clutch. If you can get a 35 hp tractor it should be ok , weight is a plus for a tractor. Good luck. Roger
Baker 18hd sawmill, massey Ferguson 1643, Farmi winch, mini forwarder, Honda foreman 400, f-250, many wood working tools, 200 acres wooden lots,6 kids and a lovely and a comprehensive wife...and now a Metavic 1150 m14 log loader so my tractor is a forwarder now

hamish

Basically its dependant upon your "other" uses for it.  Smaller scale an atv and an arch work great.  Most compact tractors and lesser hp tractors have very weak FEL lifting capabilities.  3pt hitch forks are the route to go, as is an older used tractor till the wife get the idea of having a tractor around, then you can just replace it and say its the same one!
Norwood ML26, Jonsered 2152, Husqvarna 353, 346,555,372,576

DanG

A lot depends on other uses you may have for the machine.  A farm tractor with a loader and forks should be adequate to support a small mill like that.  I wouldn't want one with less than 50hp, but that's just me.  I had an old rough terrain forklift, the famous "Hootiemobile" that served me very well for several years.  I sure got my $1500 worth out of it! 8) :D  That was the best machine I've used for moving logs and lumber.  I like a forklift because you can be so precise in placing materials, and it is easy for these old knees to get me on and off of it.  I also used my 60hp tractor for a while.  It did the job but struggled with the larger logs.  Now I'm using a Cat 416 backhoe.  It is plenty strong, but placing things right where I want them can be a challenge.  It has many uses away from the mill, and gives me a second way to make money if needed.
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

wesdor

I have a JD 3520 with a 300cx loader.  It is rated for 1600 pounds.  Also the detachable bucket and pallet forks.  A logging winch, chipper, and log arch are also part of the equipment.

Like Roger said, BE SURE TO HAVE WEIGHT ON THE BACK when carrying a load.  Also keep the loader as low as possible. I usually have the winch on the back if carrying something with the forks.

A friend has a Kubota and that is also a good tractor.  In my case the Deere was actually cheaper. 

Another thought - the dealer makes a big difference,  the lowest price may not be the best deal.

POSTON WIDEHEAD

Having an LT 10 tells me your not in production sawing. So backhoes, Bobcats and larger tractors I would not recommend unless you live on a farm and can use the larger equipment for other applications.

I have to agree with Fishpharmer.....at least consider a Logrite Log Arch. I can't see me losing a Corvette just to get a log hauler for an LT10.
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Schramm

Nope I am not thinking production however I did think about driving my LT10 back to WoodMizer and spend the additional $6000 to buy the LT15 with the siding/shingle and resaw addition.  I honestly think for as much as I will be cutting up, the Logrite jr with the extrension will be PERFECT!  I eventually want to make flooring however that is in the long run, not in my short ideas of what I want to do.  Right now my intention is rebuilding the house I bought and then rebuild the other house I bought for my daughter.  Right now she is 12, so really in no hurry on that one but will probably start on that in about 2 years after I finish our home.  Both homes are well over 100 years old and are completly gutted (ie... wiring, heating/cooling, plumbing and everything else).  Making them both state of the art with all the gadgets that I can afford.  I own 1.5 acres on the house I am working on now and 2 large lots on the other house.  I also am in the middle of closing on 5 acres of wooded land by a lake which has some nice trees.
Thanks for bringing to my attention the Logrite as I cannot tell you how sick I was thinking of having to sell my Corvette to buy a tractor.  I really am not thinking of cutting more than 1000 bf per month.  I went out and picked out (20) 10' 14" & 16" white oak logs today and I will need to get the jr ordered on Monday as they will be here on Saturday.

Rob

T Welsh

Thats a loaded question! This topic has come up many times.(Which machine is best) I think it boils down to 2 choices a tractor loader or a skid steer, both machines have advantages and disadvantages. Pick a machine that will do the most amount for YOU and your needs. Tractors are great around farms and skid steers are very versatile with all the attachments they can handle. I will not recommend one or the other. WHY, I have both ;D. Tim

porcupine

Corvette or Tractor ????

Easy for me. There is rarely a day that goes by without my 50HP Kubota with FEL assisting me around my kingdom.  :D

Moving snow, dirt, plowing, discing, lifting everything up to including me (to trim limbs on trees) max 2800#. She hauls logs from the woods to the mill then moves the lumber to be stacked. It pulls the ole CJ5 when it needs starting encouragement and more....

I would be very limited without the tractor.
Kubota M5040  2007
Kubota U35 Mini-Ex  2016
Brute Force 18-24 Firewood Processor 2022
Brute Force Grapple
Super Split HD
Logrite Cant Hook, Pickaroon
Stihl MS250, MS461, MSE 220
Lamar 16' Dump Trailer
Load Trail 20' Tilt Trailer

Schramm

Well I guess that is what makes us different, I am a mirror manufacturer and not a mill.  My hobby is woodwork and while I would love to add hardwood flooring to my business alone with re-claimed lumber I have a full time business that takes much of my time.  I design mirrors for many large companies and hotels and actually I am sure no matter what state you live in you have been around my mirrors or crossed by them at one time or another.  My business is antique mirror glass my hobby is wood.  If my living came from owning a mill then yes I would already own a tractor but since it is a hobby I thought that I would ask.  I have worked many many 20 hour days to get my business to the point where it runs alot on its own and my Corvette is my fun along with woodwork.  If I can move 16" logs with a arch then I get everything and that is what will make me happy.  Yes a 20K tractor for you is a necessity but I already own 150K worth of equipment and now I have bought in the last 3 months $25K in new woodworking tools including the mill.  Dont think that I am full of money by my comments either as my family made adjustments over the last 15 years to get to this point and it really has been totally in the green only over the last 7 years.  The first 8 were a struggle but I would do it all again.

Thanks guys for all the help, all the time!

Happycamper

Schramm,
  Don't sell the car. I too will be LT10 it as soon as the snow goes down. I have used my old 1940 International H tractor to lift, move, skid some pretty good sized logs without problem 1.They are heavy well built units and with care will serve you well and do everything you need it to. The old farm tractors can be bought for anywhere from $500 to $5000. Easy to work on and cheap to repair as they are so simple. Plus you would probably get a much later model than mine.
                                Jim

  

 
Wether you think you can or you can't you're right

POSTON WIDEHEAD

The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Tree Feller

You can get by with a log arch when sawing on a manual mill but a tractor with FEL sure is handy.

I started sawing on my fully manual mill without any way to lift logs. I would haul them on my utility trailer by parbuckling them over the side, first with a come-a-long and later with a 3000lb Harbor Freight battery-powered winch. For offloading, I would attach a 3/16" wire rope, tie it to a tree an drive out from under the log to drag it off in front of the mill. It wasn't a very efficient way but it worked. The mill was stationary and set low on cinder blocks so it wasn't difficult to load the logs onto the mill using a Logrite cant hook.

After a while, though, I deided to  get some help and bought a used 30 HP 4WD Kioti tractor with a FEL. That was a very good purchase. I have lifted an 8' x 20" Red Oak log with that little tractor. Now, I couldn't imagine going without it.

On my little 4-acre place that thing is handier than a pocket on a shirt. Along with the tractor I got a set of forks for the FEL plus the bucket, a 5' bush hog, a 5' rototiller and a 5' box blade. The tractor and the attachments are a lifesaver around the place either tilling the garden, moving brush, moving dirt, mowing and of course, assisting at the sawmill.

In my case and at my age, I'd take the tractor and attachments over two Corvettes.   :)
Cody

Logmaster LM-1 Sawmill
Kioti CK 30 w/ FEL
Stihl MS-290 Chainsaw
48" Logrite Cant Hook
Well equipped, serious, woodworking shop

Schramm

Jim,

Your tractor is exactly what I would like to have once I live at the house full time as then I will have more time for the mill.  Until then I think the log arch is what I will use as most of the stuff I will be moving is barn beams.  I love your tractor and you are right on the money I have looked at some pretty nice Farmall tractors that are right on that range, thought about buying one and restoring it.  Yours is very very nice and looks like fun to hop on when you want to work.

Rob

Happycamper

Schramm,
  If you don't find a red one you can go green.
This one was given to me 2 years ago and I have restored it. Lots of time and $ but it runs like brand new and mows my fields with an old sickle mower I found for it. Both tractors really pull and lift well. Good luck in your search when you are ready.
                             Jim

 
Wether you think you can or you can't you're right

pineywoods

Just be real careful towing that log arch with the vette  ::) :)
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

Sixacresand

Hi.  I have a 50+ year old farmall tractor, which started off as restoration project.  When I got my LT 10, I used it to move logs out of the woods.  Eventually I built a arch, which I use each time I every day to move logs and stacks of lumber.   I pull it with my Sears Tractor, pickups  and sometimes with the tractor. 

I would say if you can afford a tractor with loader, get it.
"Sometimes you can make more hay with less equipment if you just use your head."  Tom, Forestry Forum.  Tenth year with a LT40 Woodmizer,

rimshot

My Kioti ck20 with a front end loader is ideal.  It a compact utility tractor (cUT.  I use forks around the mill rather than log tongs.  It has been very handy.  I bought it 5 years ago.

 
LT 10 with a 10 h.p. and a converted boat trailer to provide mobility for a once permanent mill.

DaleK

Try www.ironsearch.com. I'd look for something over 50hp, late 70s through 80s. Anything older than that is overpriced, newer compacts are also overpriced for what you get. Something like
http://www.ironsearch.com/Tractor-Loader/New-Holland/340B/2032028/Detail.aspx?SK=--tract-IL_1000_s--~false----0_0_0_15000&LP=12 or
http://www.ironsearch.com/Tractor/Massey-Ferguson/285/1997237/Detail.aspx?SK=--tract-IL_1000_s--~false----0_0_0_15000&LP=15 would get a lot of work done.

I use a JD 6420 but that's more tractor than you need if you aren't farming.
Hud-Son Oscar 330
Wallenstein FX110
Echo chainsaws and a whole bunch of tractors

bandmiller2

Schramm,prehaps a skidsteer with forks and a bucket would be good for unloading pallets of glass and plowing the parking lot at your business,what it does weekends is up to you. Do you have one of those fancy german grinders to bevel the edges of mirrors.?? Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

Peter Drouin


                             Jim

 


Now thats nice , I like green
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

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