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Timber Framing a discussion of the History and Pre-History

Started by Jay C. White Cloud, February 12, 2013, 02:15:02 AM

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Jay C. White Cloud

Good Day All,

As a first installment, I shall take a section from another post, as it is more germane here, than it would be on the other post.  I did not want to detract from that post thread's author or subject, nor devalue this discussion as it evolves. Below, please find the catalyst for this thread between myself and D L Bahler.  Do please, join in if you have questions, comments or observations. My next post will address D L Bahler's observations.

From: Jay C. White Cloud

Hello All,

Dodgy Loner, thank you for sharing your trip with all of us.  As a keen observer and student of all things "timber frame," particularly timber framing outside of Europe and of other origins, I would share the following observations.  I lived in the West Indies on and off through the mid 1980's.  I concur, depending on the region, there was strong influence from different European cultures that tried to dominate this part of the world, like so many others.
QuoteThere would be no such thing as "Haitian culture" without "Old World influence".
However, as some one of Native upbringing and still identifying by this culture, I am very vigilant to point out that most of the places the Europeans went, already had there own cultures that was strong, vibrant and healthy.  After the Europeans came, not so much, as through diseases and domination these indigenous cultures were exterminated or simply enslaved.

I have been a student of pre-european timber architecture for the better part of 30 years, and have found that the heart and soul origin was most likely the Middle East then it went East into Asia before ever reaching Europe, by several thousand years.

I have looked at the timber and wood cultures of Africa for a long time, considering their beautiful wood work.  It was not until UNESCO created their short documentary below that I could even get other timber framers to believe me when I spoke of independent timber cultures like the Zafimaniry people of Madagascar.  All eyes still seem to turn to Europe for all things timber frame related, when this is just not the case.  Slave traders, (many black themselves,) routinely ship people from this island to the West Indies.  I'm not saying that the Creole culture of Haiti had any native Madagascar roots, but the possibility is there, not to mention the Islands own architectural forms which looked very much like what you find Haitians living in today.

Regards,

jay

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9wTLBGXZ04



Reply from D L Bahler:

QuoteJay, I have to contend with you on one point. You speak of The transmission of timber building form from the middle east to Europe by way of Asia, etc. This I must disagree with.

I have made a long study of traditional Germanic building forms, and in particular the forms of The Alps (especially the Swiss Alps, where I myself trace my heritage over thousands of years)
Here I have learned one thing, Most western European timber framing is derived from 1 of 2 basic building forms, both of which are extremely ancient and are tied inseparably to ancient Germanic culture. First there is the iron age post structure, very crude timber framing similar to what we see in these pictures from Haiti. This is the father of many French and English methods. Then there is the central European log structure (interestingly, English and Scandinavian log building derives ultimately from framing, but Alpine log building does not) which has a history dating back to extremely ancient times. This style has been prevalent in the Alps since before there was such a place as Jerusalem.

Basic timber building practices have existed in Europe as long as there have been people there. Stonehenge, for example, is built with wood-type joinery reflecting the fact that it is based on a much earlier, timber-framed 'wood henge'. Timber framing in Europe developed along its own lines, from its own cultural traditions, and is not the child of Asia or anywhere else. That said, neither is Asian timber framing or African framing the child of anything European.

Take this in the context of my Swiss heritage, which means I don't care about Europe, or about making my people out to be big and important. We are mountain people, and we're a totally different race than the Europeans who go and write their favorite versions of history. We have a long history of not liking anyone else. I'd much rather have my mountains than to rule the world.

As for Haiti, this we should consider:

The Haitians trace their roots to modern day Ghana. They were captured and sold by their own countrymen to the French (I am in no way condoning European slavery, but still ,we need to remember that the Africans themselves played a large role in this. Sometimes when we 'de-europeanize' the historical slant we tend to go too far in the other direction. The truth lies always in the middle ) The French built castles on the Ghana coast for the slave trade, in order to ship them off to Haiti. As Such, haitian culture is derived almost entirely from a mixture of Ghanan and French, with a few traces of native culture scattered here and there (such as a few loanwords in creole)

As for the origin of haitian building practices, yes there is some knowledge held over from Africa, but by and large most of their building forms are derived from French influences. This is easy to see in Port au Prince, and in most of the other villages. Although it is harder to see in some of the more remote locations. The reason for this is not because there was no sound tradition from their native land, but rather because the French intentionally destroyed as much of it as they could. This is evident in the fact that creole is a dialect of French, not of any African language.   

Voodoo is very similar to practices still found in Ghana.

I spent 12 days in Haiti last spring. I may have some timber pictures buried somewhere in my file. Unfortunately I was deathly ill the last 3 or 4 days (I can't even remember, because I was so sick) with a virus that seriously messed up my thyroid and tried to burn my heart out.

But the Haitians themselves seem to say that they want to be african, and identify many parts of their culture as african, but at the same time will say that many things are French, and tend to view all the best things as being French. Indeed, people of French descent hold a high position of esteem in their culture, and anything that is connected to France (and increasingly the US) is thought of as being prime. I also learned that France considers the country to be a de facto French territory. something on the order of 90% or some such ridiculous number of the country is owned by French businessmen, and just about every large business in the country is run from France. There are only two connections on Earth to the Port au Prince airport, Miami Florida and Paris France.

"To posses an open mind, is to hold a key to many doors, and the ability to created doors where there were none before."

"When it is all said and done, they will have said they did it themselves."-teams response under a good leader.

drobertson

Jay, thanks for the post, very interesting, and thanks for adding the quote from DL, as a tool maker by trade, I can tesitfy that there are so many different techniques in achiving very similiar results,  we all have learned and formed our own styles I suppose with some degree of resemblence to past techniques.  Those hand carvings are quite unique, just wondering how the cutting tools are sharpened? I suppose older hand or foot operated grind stones?  thanks again.    david
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

DanG

You bring up a good point, Drobertson.  I'm sure we have all "invented" things that we didn't know had already existed for centuries. :D  I know I did when building forts and treehouses as a kid.  I used joinery techniques, very crude ones I might add, that may have been reminiscent of many cultures, but I had to invent them myself because I knew nothing of their existence.

I wonder if any of you who have been to Haiti noticed any North Florida influence in the architecture there?  I left my own mark on a school building near Les Cayes back in the waning years of the previous Millenium. ;D
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

customsawyer

I think this kind of thing is very interesting. It reminds me of food. If you take the same ingredients, flour and water, to different parts of the world it is amazing the number of different foods you will get. Two that come to the top of my thinking is bread or tortillas. I know there are many more but you get where I am going with this thinking. It is mostly influenced by what other ingredients they have to mix with the main two ingredients.
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

Raider Bill

Quote from: customsawyer on February 12, 2013, 12:05:58 PM
I think this kind of thing is very interesting. It reminds me of food. If you take the same ingredients, flour and water, to different parts of the world it is amazing the number of different foods you will get. Two that come to the top of my thinking is bread or tortillas. I know there are many more but you get where I am going with this thinking. It is mostly influenced by what other ingredients they have to mix with the main two ingredients.

Well but..... no matter where you are Grits are grits are grits :D
The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

Jay C. White Cloud

Hi Customsawyer,

I am so glad you made that analogy about bread, that I had to interrupt my prepared response to say thanks, and believe it or not your observation actually ties into timber framing really well.  Bread, and other food stuff, is a big indicator of migrational patterns in humans.  What do we eat when we get some place, and what did we bring with us to eat from where we were?

Great observation!

I'm trying to trim down the next entry so it is easier to read and follow, this is a pretty complex topic, much to consider and recent information has really change things.  There is a considerable amount coming out of Asia in the last few decades that we did not have details on.

Regards,

jay
"To posses an open mind, is to hold a key to many doors, and the ability to created doors where there were none before."

"When it is all said and done, they will have said they did it themselves."-teams response under a good leader.

D L Bahler

Jay, I am looking forward to your response.

I will add also,
I spent some time in China and southeast Asia as well, and had the opportunity to study some of the carpentry in the Tibetan tradition as well as the impressive Thai temple architecture. Both have obvious links to Chinese tradition, yet at the same time obviously their own unique thing. I do have some pictures of these somewhere in my files.

But while I observed the similarities of these to more familiar European traditions, I did not for a moment think there to be any sourcing from the West, or really any immediate link except perhaps incredibly ancient stemming from a common source in Sumerian culture or some such.

Also it was clear to me in my time in Switzerland -and I have read that this is generally considered to be true- that Alpine building styles are unique in the world, unconnected to the otherwise Germanic notions of northern and western Europe. These traditions are incredibly ancient, connected to the people themselves who derive from a stock far predating Indo-European settlement. I spent some time in the city of Thun, a wonderful little town nestled in the mountains whose history stretches back to the dawn of civilization. A place that has been settled longer than Jerusalem and is sometimes thought to approach the incredible age of Damascus. In such a context, I cannot believe that their carpentry traditions trace first to Asia. Add to this also that it was only in the last century that any practices from outside of the region, and even from outside of the specific valley, made their way into the building traditions of the more isolated and traditional regions of the Swiss Alps.


Jay C. White Cloud

Hi DL,

I'm writing a response, at the same time as I'm writing this...just wanted to take a moment to say thanks for doing this.  It is really helping in preparing text for publication.  There is just so much that hasn't be looked at from other perspectives in the timber framing field.  I don't think we will disagree as much as agree on many points, and I'm sure we will find new thing together through this.  Your rebuttals make me look further and deeper, and I know you will do the same.  I figure in about a year, it might even be beneficial for you and I to co-facilitate something at the TFG conference on history and layout modalities. 

Best Regards,

jay
"To posses an open mind, is to hold a key to many doors, and the ability to created doors where there were none before."

"When it is all said and done, they will have said they did it themselves."-teams response under a good leader.

Jay C. White Cloud

I have tried to come at this discussion from numerous angles but each time it became convoluted and too long a post to be enjoyable or educational to read. So I have tried breaking it down into different sections, this one (layout) being one of the best topics to speak to the past and present history of timber wrighting as we know it today.

We know through archaeological and literary evidence that the "scribe rule" methods of layout in timber wrighting are the most ancient and archetypal methods in all regions of the world that had a "wood culture."  We often forget that ship building was probably some of the first ways timber wrighting was improved, advanced and then shared with other regions. We also know that during the (Sage Kings)  pre-Shang dynasty of China (2800 BCE,) that "scribe rule," was abandoned for "line or center line rule" as the dominate lay out method throughout Asia and the Middle East, greatly advancing the complexity of the joinery and application; but decreasing the labor involved in the work of layout and joinery. 

QuoteFrom D L Bahler post #7
I spent some time in the city of Thun, a wonderful little town nestled in the mountains whose history stretches back to the dawn of civilization. A place that has been settled longer than Jerusalem and is sometimes thought to approach the incredible age of Damascus. In such a context, I cannot believe that their carpentry traditions trace first to Asia. Add to this also that it was only in the last century that any practices from outside of the region, and even from outside of the specific valley, made their way into the building traditions of the more isolated and traditional regions of the Swiss Alps.

All evidence I can find indicates that my previous statements are true, timber framing moved East and evolved in greater complexity before it moved/evolved West into Europe.  Was modern man living in Europe (Switzerland-Germanic regions) at the same time as they lived in the Middle East, absolutely, just as D L has claimed. (Thun was occupied since the 3rd millenia BCE)  Did this region have as an "advanced" timber craft as Asian regions, I'm afraid there is no evidence I could find, literary or archaeological, to defend that position. Was there timber craft yes, but only in the very simplest of forms, as found in all Neo and Paleolithic regions of the world including the Americas.  Europe did not advance into greater timber wrighting complexity until after the Roman occupation and expansion in 50's BCE and lasted that way for almost 450 years (400 ACE.) Note: Thun fell to Roman occupation during this time period as did much of region and came very much under it's influence.  Roman culture also was already trading with the Middle East and Asia at this time bringing back methods and cultural influences, so I must disagree with the position that there wasn't any influence in the region, "except in the last century."  There has been influence throughout Thun's history (and the region,) more so at certain times (Roman occupation) than others. Iron and it's advanced forging methods as found in the Middle East and Asia is one of the principle reasons for these advancements.  China already had advanced government, philosophy, science and arts as did Roman culture while most of Europe was barely coming out of a Paleolithic skill sets.


"To posses an open mind, is to hold a key to many doors, and the ability to created doors where there were none before."

"When it is all said and done, they will have said they did it themselves."-teams response under a good leader.

D L Bahler

There is indeed archaeological evidence of sophisticated Germanic timber knowledge that is unconnected to Roman traditions. I could go into this, but wish to go another direction instead
The best and most ancient form of wood construction in all of Europe is that of the ancient Alpine cultures. Log building in the Alps can be and has been traced to pre Roman times. At one time, the style as preserved best today in the Berner Oberland and Wallis regions (culturally closely linked) was referred to as Celtic in order to establish it as pre roman. now this term is outdated, as we know that these people are not celts.
The Roman presence in Thun was minimal, the presence of the Roman cult almost non existent, and the Roman influence beyond Thun in the Oberland was totally negligible. These people likely lived out their lives with no knowledge that they were subjects of any foreign power. This is a state that lasted until after Bern began to consolidate its power and build castles in the region in the 14th century.the building styles of the Oberland remained cultury unaffected until the 20th century. Buildings in the upper Valais still maintain this distinction
Transhumance is a practice that connects Oberland culture to the ancient near east, and it is believed that Mesopatamian or Anatolian goat herders were the first to carry log building into the alps, where it had developed into very sophisticated forms by the time that the Romans arrived. Read Pliny's accounts for more information. Pliny marveled at the juxtaposition of the sophistication and the apparent simplicity of the mountain people.
archaeological remains have traced nearly all of the engineering aspects of this building form back over a very long period of time, and in my extensive research of the subject I have never found an ounce of credit given to romans or any other outside influence prior to the 16th century, at which time the modern joinery and principles were already completely developed.

I have always understood that Germanic tribes actually had sophisticated knowledge of joinery and building techniques, but did not use them for their homes because they were building temporary structures. Germanic farming practices were such that a farm was inhabitable for a generation at most, at which time they moved on to new lands. Once better farming practices were developed building practices almost immediately reached their zenith. early Medieval churches in Switzerland attest to this fact. As do viking stave buildings (stavverk is a sophisticated technique that is thought to have been know for a few centuries prior to the building of the stave churches of the 11th c.)
do not forget the viking ships, which were already highly sophisticated in the time of the 6th century Germanic migration, and during the 10th c viking invasions are said to have been centuries ahead of anything else in the world. (this is a topic I have researched extensively, I have a dream to some day build a small klinker boat)

Jay C. White Cloud

Hello David,

Please note that I greatly admire the linage and ancestry from which you herald.  It is truly one of the greatest wood cultures of the world.  I too, have the same love of my ancestral bearing.  I do not mean ever to sound like I am making less of there contributions or splendor.  I will at this point have to ask that this rather learned conversation, start to cite references, or it can't really continue to have any validity from either of us.  I am doing research for manuscript I am writhing and getting to discuss and discover new facts is wonderful and critical to good development in a disquisition.  However, I am required to have citation of my facts and foundations for historical perspective.

QuoteThere is indeed archaeological evidence of sophisticated Germanic timber knowledge that is unconnected to Roman traditions. I could go into this, but wish to go another direction instead. 
If this is not supposition, for my own research, could you please cite your references, (i.e. literary, research, lecture, etc.)

QuoteThe best and most ancient form of wood construction in all of Europe is that of the ancient Alpine cultures.  Log building in the Alps can be and has been traced to pre Roman times.
But as far as I can find, they did not blossom until after, Roman occupation. (Ref: "Historisches Lexikon der Schweiz (HLS), Schwabe AG," Basel, ISBN 3-7965-1900-8 (2002)  "Roman Switzerland: A Study of Cultural Interactions and Roman Strategies"
By Cindy Bettina Oberholzer 7007

QuoteThe Roman presence in Thun was minimal, the presence of the Roman culture almost non existent, and the Roman influence beyond Thun in the Oberland was totaly negligible.
This is not what the literature seems to indicate.  Please cite your sources.

QuoteThese people likely lived out their lives with no knowledge that they were subjects of any foreign power.
David, this again is supposition, if not backed up by cited reference.

QuoteThis is a state that lasted until after Bern began to consolidate its power and build castles in the region in the 14th century the building styles of the Oberland remained cultural unaffected until the 20th century.
This appears to be true, but is long after Roman occupation and we have countless references to there trading far into the Middle East and Asia.

QuoteBuildings in the upper Valais still maintain this distinction Transhumance is a practice that connects Oberland culture to the ancient near east, and it is believed that Mesopotamian or Anatolian goat herders were the first to carry log building into the alps, where it had developed into very sophisticated forms by the time that the Romans arrived. Read Pliny's accounts for more information.  Pliny marveled at the juxtaposition of the sophistication and the apparent simplicity of the mountain people.
David, when I got to this section, I became very confused?  You are making my validation for me with the simple quote from your own research and presentation here.  I completely agree.  The more advanced wood culture of Europe and the region of the Alps you are referencing did come from Mesopotamia, which is the Middle East. Did it evolve further?  Of course it did, but, as I have stated, and you have also now, it came from the Middle East.  Where there are very advanced forms of timber architecture.  The Roman's did indeed influence and help advance it in Europe even further.  As for Pliny's accounts (Pliny how lived in the year 23 ACE) well after the Middle Eastern (Mesopotamian) influence on the region I can find no indications that he found the region more advanced than his own as far as architecture, please provide a reference.  I agree he spoke of the culture, but where again did he mention architecture?

QuoteArchaeological remains have traced nearly all of the engineering aspects of this building form back over a very long period of time, and in my extensive research of the subject i have never found an ounce of credit given to Romans or any other outside influence prior to the 16th century, at which time the modern joinery and principles were already completely developed.
You already did.  Mesopotamian culture predates Swiss culture by at least 500 to 1000 years, as far as advance agronomy and wood architecture.  This by your own admission.  If you have a counter to your own statement, please cite the reference.

I won't get into Viking/Nordic culture at this time other than to say many of the Eastern tribes of the Viking empire have been found with effigies of the Buddha, and Asian/Middle Eastern laminated steels, in the graves with them.  I think that clearly speaks to with whom they had been trading and raiding.

Respectfully yours,

jay
"To posses an open mind, is to hold a key to many doors, and the ability to created doors where there were none before."

"When it is all said and done, they will have said they did it themselves."-teams response under a good leader.

TW

the origin of Scandinavian log building is very old too. there are stone age building remains found in northern Sweden which have been interpreted as primitive log buildings.

however most bronze age and iron age buildings were framed in a primitive way with posts dug into the ground and lath and daub infills until the 11th century roundabout. at that time farmhouses were separated from barns and other outbuilding that had until then usually been built together in a row under one roof. then the smaller separate buildings could be log built with log walls as they had no way of scarfing wall logs then and the size of the building consequently was limited by the length of the logs. all the 13th century log buildings still standing are built with an already highly sophisticated technique that little by little has been developed further until this day.

sudden big leaps rarely happen in technology so I suppose that the highly refined 13th century log building technology must have had some roots somewhere in Scandinavia or elsewhere but so far nobody knows where. there is a hypothesis that it was learned and brought home by viking traders traveling in Russia.

D L Bahler

I did not go into the Germanic traditions due to the fact that I don't recall the sources used. It has been some time since I studied the Germanic forms. My people are not Germanic (*gasp*) and so this does not hold as much interest to me.

The studying the I have done on Swiss Alpine history and architecture required me to travel to Switzerland. Really in order to do you justice, I would have to do so again. There is a great deal of information that you really can't access from the outside. This is largely due to the fact that, for some odd reason, the outside world knows or cares very little about these things. Many of my references are in the forms of notes taken there from German language sources that I wish I could own.

But A lot of information comes from the Schlossmuseum Thun, Bernisches Historisches Museum, Schlosmuseum Spiez, Historisches Lexicon der Shweiz (which has some issues I might point out, which will always be the case when you try and reduce things to Encyclopaedia scope) Also some accounts from Authors such as Vitruvius and Pliny.

Regarding Plinys writings.
As you said, this was 23 AD. Roman conquest of the specific Region in question had occurred about 15 BC. We are not viewing a Romanised society during Pliny's day, but one on the Fringes of the Roman world, a stringe one.

Also keep in consideration that the 'Roman History of Switzerland' is almost always the Roman history of the Swiss Plateau. They never go into the Alps, because almost nothing conclusive is known about the Alps during this time period. People do not know who lived here, what language they spoke, what their customs were, etc. But they do know from archeology what their lifestyle was like, how they built their homes (and that they were heavily Christianized already in the 2nd century, when it was still illegal to so be in the Empire)  We know that the key aspects of Blockbau as practiced today were present -the common corner joints, the T+G timbers, the way that the door and window posts are fashioned (a style that Phelps refers to as Celtic to distinguish it as more ancient and separate from the more Scandiniavian/Germanic method of posts used on such a building). Infromation about this is found in Hermann Phelps and Ernst Gladbach. 

Regarding the Middle Eastern connection. This I don't debate. I hold to the position that the entirety of European culture is derived from the Ancient Near East, as are the people. But this Alpine connection is incredibly ancient. The residents of the Alp arrived in Europe before the Indo European migrations. DNA Haplogroups have linked the Alpine people to some degree with the Basques of Spain and the residents of North Africa. This is a people whose oldest tock is not Indo European, even though today they are mixed with many other groups. What I do debate is that European people needed some outside influence after the fact in order to figure out how to build things well.

Regarding the minimal influence of the Romans on the Oberland, this I have to say:

The Roman presence in Switzerland was very Stratified. The Eastern and Western portions of the Swiss Plateau were heavily steeled and Romanized. There was no presence in the Emmental whatsoever, it was a wilderness. The same is generally said of the upper Aare valley and the Gürbetal, the two valleys leading to the Bernese Alps. There were only scattered Roman Villae in the region, which can also be interpreted as Helvetic Farms (the Helvetii in some parts of Switzerland were very Romanized, and on the fringes they were rather independent)

Archaeological findings from the region of Thun have turned up almost nothing Roman. The oldest buildings in the area have turned up 2nd century remains, but these remains have been non-Roman in Character (Source for this, Schlossmuseum Thun, Bernisches Historisches Museum) They are generally referred to as 'Helvetic'
It is only further north on the Swiss Plateau that you find the remains of Gallo-Roman culture. To understand this, go east into Romandy, the French speaking part of the country. Here the remnants of Gallo Roman culture persist to this day. Here also the architecture maintains a definite Roman style and mode. But As you travel up into the Alps of the Region, things suddenly change and you begin to see things more like you would expect from the Swiss Germans. Cross the Aare river, and this Roman influence entirely vanishes. This is because the Alemanii wiped it out in the 7th century, and replaced it with their own forms of Language, food, architecture, religion, etc.

I'll dredge up from some literary sources as I find them.

D L Bahler

Somewhere buried in the 10 books of Vitruvius, there is some information on this as well.

The sources of mine that you would have most immediate access to are
Vitruvius
Hermann Phleps Holzbaukunst – Der Blockbau
Ernst Gladbach, Die Holz-Architectur der Schweiz

I had confused Pliny and Vitruvius in my early posts. my error. Pliny's references to the Helvetii and to the people of the Alps are cultural, about their religion and myths, and as interests me about their hard, long aged, rennet-set cow's milk cheese, which interests me because I make this cheese, and some historians try to claim our cheeses were lactic set goats milk cheeses until the high Middle Ages. Apparently Pliny contends this point...

While skimming Vitruvius, I did happen to find a brief episode on what appears to be some fairly complex timber framing.

That houses originated as I have written above, we can see for ourselves from the buildings that are to this day constructed of like materials by foreign tribes: for instance, in Gaul, Spain, Portugal, and Aquitaine, roofed with oak shingles or thatched. Among the Colchians in Pontus, where there are forests in plenty, they lay down entire trees flat on the ground to the right and the left, leaving between them a space to suit the length of the trees, and then place above these another pair of trees, resting on the ends of the former and at right angles with them. These four trees enclose the space for the dwelling. Then upon these they place sticks of timber, one after the other on the four sides, crossing each other at the angles, and so, proceeding with their walls of trees laid perpendicularly above the lowest, they build up high towers. The interstices, which are left on account of the thickness of the building material, are stopped up with chips and mud. As for the roofs, by cutting away the ends of the crossbeams and making them converge gradually as they lay them across, they bring them up to the top from the four sides in the shape of a pyramid. They cover it with leaves and mud, and thus construct the roofs of their towers in a rude form of the "tortoise" style. Vitruvius II,1,4

This appears to discuss the construction of wooden sills then an interlocking log wall laid up. However, if I recall his description of the roof is in error (Vitruvius is known for coming up with strange ideas while trying to describe things he saw in foreign lands) This whole roof thing is strange, since above he quite plainly mentions shingles and thatch in reference to these same houses. But here he is describing a method in place in Northern Turkey (Pontus) and comparing it to contemporary styles of Iberia and Central Europe.

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