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RR Ties for $40

Started by GeneWengert-WoodDoc, December 29, 2012, 08:36:07 PM

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RayMO

What is the going rate for good oak tie logs in your area ????
Father & Son Logging and sawing operation .

WH_Conley

225 to 250, before this guy came along.
Bill

RayMO

250 here in MO picked up at the landing price.
Father & Son Logging and sawing operation .

dgdrls

So  $225-250/thousand  for materials

What are buyers paying per tie delivered ?

Thanks
DGD



WH_Conley

Oak 7x9-$21.00, mixed hardwood  7x9 $20.50, 6x8 $12.75.
Bill

Ron Wenrich

I'm assuming those log prices to be in Doyle scale.  Its hard to make a direct correlation from one scale to the other.  You're looking at around $477 on the oak, and $465 on the mixed hdwd.

Theoretically, you can cut a 7x9 from a 12" log.  In Doyle scale at $250, you only pay $8 for material.  In a 13" log, that goes up to $10.25, but you'll be getting more in side cuts.  At 17", there is a breakeven point where the tie pays for the log.  Your operating costs and profit needs to come from your woodwaste and your side cuts. 

What's happened to the #3 log values?  Have they moved up along with the tie log price or have they remained low?
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

WH_Conley

The local buyer prefers 9 foo ties. That brings oak down to $.440. It is Doyle. To get the numbers you are talking you have to be buying 8 foot logs. Around here the market is good enough for what logs are left that you will not get any logs. Most of the loggers anymore won't hardly cut less than 10 feet. If you have to buy a 12" log at 10 ' at 250 then the price goes to $10.00. What passes for tie timber around here anymore is not hardly worth taking side lumber. We had an ice storm a few years that has changed our markets completely. Now that the glut is over the demand is out running the supply.
Bill

Ron Wenrich

Around here, a 9' log gets scaled as an 8' log.  There is no tie log category for 10' logs, so they would grade out at #3.  We converted some of that #3 wood into firewood. 

I remember about 10 years ago when they were saying that there was going to be a shortage of loggers.  That would crimp supply pretty well and force prices up. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

WH_Conley

As far as I know, in this immediate area, I was the last one cutting ties that was strictly buying the logs. The other tie cutters also log. I should say the other guy. He is the only small mill left cutting ties now.

Tie timber used to be 8'6", bought for 8'. Can't do that anymore. Everything to do with the local market has completely changed in the last few years.  There used to be a small mill just every couple of miles. Brokers would travel the country trying to buy tie siding. 
Bill

two tired

10 ft. ties delivered to the tieyard $32.50. Just went up about a month ago.
when wondering about weather conditions call the dog in and see if he is wet

Okrafarmer

There's not a very well established tie market around here. Loggers don't have the tie log frame of mind. 8' logs are 8' logs, and 4-6" of trim is haphazard. If you buy 8' logs, a lot of them won't make a tie because they're not quite 8'6. That puts you buying 10' logs and looking for a market for 7"x9"x18" garage blocks. I've told Profdan to cut all my 8' logs long enough to make a tie from, but I still haven't cut the first tie. I tried to make one today and ended up with a little too much wane. Should have paid a little more attention to the toe-boards! ::)
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

beenthere

Okra
Just have to ask... Who is Profdan ?
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Ron Wenrich

That's why they have tie logs and #3 logs.  A tie log has what's necessary to make the grade, including over length.  They pay more for the tie log than for the #3 to give the logger the incentive to make tie cut.  Loggers will than make all the lower grade logs long enough to make ties.

I always noticed that many of the better quality logs are cut 10'.  That's just in case they might make veneer, they're long enough.  Same market strategy.
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Okrafarmer

Quote from: beenthere on June 04, 2013, 10:41:16 PM
Okra
Just have to ask... Who is Profdan ?

He is an FF member but I think he has only posted once. I tend to send him emails with links to topics relevant to his operation, since he is usually too busy to browse FF himself. I worked for him for three years, and I still associate with him as one of my chief log suppliers.
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

beenthere

Quoteas one of my chief log suppliers.

Thanks, so he is a logger?   or runs a sawmill where you can buy some logs?
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Okrafarmer

He's primarily a tree surgeon.
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

stavebuyer

Our sawn ties($22/18/13) prices have not changed but the price of oak flooring lumber has almost doubled since last summer. 2&3A oak is netting us about 680mbf after freight and 2% net 10 day payment. Sawing 12-14" logs and leaving a 7x9 I get a 50-55% over-run. Including culls and Industrials the math works out like this on a 13" 40 bd ft(doyle scale) tie log. The log will yield..20' of lumber at $.68 = $13.60 for the lumber plus 42' in a tie that averages $20.00(10% cull and Industrials) thats $33.60 in sales per 40' log. Figuring a bandmill sawing rate of $.30 for 62' = $18.60. Lumber and tie value of $33.60-$18.60 sawing costs leaves a log value of $15.00 or $.375mbf. My operating costs on the LT70 including labor and work comp run around $200mbf so I can figure a .10 profit paying $.375 for oak tie logs. Your competitor likely has lower operating cost than my bandmill does. He isn't getting more for his ties; he is marketing his lumber to flooring mills that are paying $100-140 over Hardwood Market Report for 2&3A lumber.

Okrafarmer

I really need to find a flooring buyer near me where I can sell my 2 and 3.
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

captain_crunch

Wow any log out west that would make make a tie is worth 80,00 per thousand on truck
M-14 Belsaw circle mill,HD-11 Log Loader,TD-14 Crawler,TD-9 Crawler and Ford 2910 Loader Tractor

Kansas

Captain crunch, trying to understand your figures. It surely isn't 8000 dollars a thousand. And 800 would be too pricy still.

Okrafarmer

And 80.00 would be too little.
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

firecatf7333

Bump to an old thread. My Amish Neighbor has a circle mill and is interested in cutting RR ties. Located in Upstate NY. Anyone have any info I could get and a company that buys ties that I could contact?

thanks for your time

beenthere

Maybe fill out your bio in your profile, then we would have an idea where you are from.  That would be important to give you good information. ;)
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Dave Shepard

Quote from: firecatf7333 on January 13, 2014, 09:37:18 PM
Bump to an old thread. My Amish Neighbor has a circle mill and is interested in cutting RR ties. Located in Upstate NY. Anyone have any info I could get and a company that buys ties that I could contact?

thanks for your time
.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

Jeff

The guy was just trying to run up his post count for some reason from what we can see. I'll leave this post here, just in case there is some validity to it, but I just got done deleting a bunch of welcome to the forum post this guy just made to members that have been here for years. This post was the only one left after we got done sweeping up.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

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