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Removing Spark Screens, Does it make a difference?

Started by JOE.G, December 25, 2012, 04:04:49 PM

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JOE.G

I hear of people removing the Spark screens, does it make a difference? In Power? In sound? Pros? Cons?

My 562 XP doesn't have one but the rest of the equipment in my sig below does, Should I remove it from any of them? Should I leave it in some of them? Thanks
Husqvarna 562XP Woods Ported .025 pop up MM
Husqvarna Rancher 55 2005
Husqvarna 450 Anniversary Edition 2010
STIHL 009 1998
STIHL HT 131 Pole Saw 2012
STIHL FS 110 R Trimmer 2010
STIHL BR 600 Magnum Blower 2012

sawguy21

They are there for a reason and only affect performance if clogged by carbon deposits. Leave them in if using equipment on public land.
old age and treachery will always overcome youth and enthusiasm

Al_Smith

I'd certainly leave them in the blower trimmer and polesaw .The others are not what a person would call hot runners with exception of the souped up 562 so it probabley wouldn't make that much difference .

Quite frankly though in most cases it does make at least some difference if you retune the carb just a tad richer .Back pressure is back pressure weather it comes from a baffle or a screen .

If you are really concerned about it in many cases you can remove the screen ,cut the hole a little bigger and put the screen back .It would get about the same effect .

JOE.G

I was just wondering, Because I was cleaning up the saws and stuff and pulled them all out to clean them, They were all fine. I'll prob leave them in.
Husqvarna 562XP Woods Ported .025 pop up MM
Husqvarna Rancher 55 2005
Husqvarna 450 Anniversary Edition 2010
STIHL 009 1998
STIHL HT 131 Pole Saw 2012
STIHL FS 110 R Trimmer 2010
STIHL BR 600 Magnum Blower 2012

CTYank

Smokey the Bear will thank you for keeping the spark-arresting screens in place.  8)

Anybody who thinks this has any impact on performance is paranoid or easily suggestible.  :embarassed:
'72 blue Homelite 150
Echo 315, SRM-200DA
Poulan 2400, PP5020, PP4218
RedMax GZ4000, "Mac" 35 cc, Dolmar PS-6100
Husqy 576XP-AT
Tanaka 260 PF Polesaw, TBC-270PFD, ECS-3351B
Mix of mauls
Morso 7110

Al_Smith

A lot of people might disagree with the last part of that statement .For example take a survey of professional arborists who run Stihl 200T's and just see how many leave the screens in .Paranoid or stupid has nothing to do with it .

lumberjack48

When they breath better they run better, that was the first thing to come out of my new saws
There would be a lot less piston scoring, if they would have pulled the screen..
Third generation logger, owner operator, 30 yrs felling experience with pole skidder. I got my neck broke back in 89, left me a quad. The wife kept the job going up to 96.

AdkStihl

Try this....

With your hand approximately 6" away from your face....blow into the palm of your hand as hard as you can.

Now......take a piece of screen......window screen will work(less restrictive than exhaust screen even), and put the screen half way between your face and your hand. Blow into the palm of your hand. Big difference huh!

Unless youre cutting on State land where screens are mandated, remove them.......Your saw will thank you!!
J.Miller Photography

JOE.G

Husqvarna 562XP Woods Ported .025 pop up MM
Husqvarna Rancher 55 2005
Husqvarna 450 Anniversary Edition 2010
STIHL 009 1998
STIHL HT 131 Pole Saw 2012
STIHL FS 110 R Trimmer 2010
STIHL BR 600 Magnum Blower 2012

Al_Smith

I'm not even certain if you could catch the woods afire in this area if you ran open exhausts .Now there obviously is some concern in some of the western or southern states during times of low humidity so in that case it does have some merit .By the same token however during those fire prone times as I understand it they curtail any work in the woods as a preventative  to wild fires .That all makes  good common sense .

HolmenTree

The Stihl MS200T has a restricter plate attached to its screen which increases the mufflers outlet flow considerable when pulled. So screenless does make a difference on this saw.
Seeing the saw is designed mainly for aerial work above ground, fire hazards are not generally a problem. 
Making a living with a saw since age 16.

CTYank

Quote from: Al_Smith on December 25, 2012, 07:37:48 PM
I'm not even certain if you could catch the woods afire in this area if you ran open exhausts .Now there obviously is some concern in some of the western or southern states during times of low humidity so in that case it does have some merit .By the same token however during those fire prone times as I understand it they curtail any work in the woods as a preventative  to wild fires .That all makes  good common sense .

You might have trouble explaining you action to Maine Forest Service folks, some summers. They're understandably pretty inflexible about perceived threats to the major state industry, by whatever hillbilly modders. I was happy to show a screen in each muffler when asked. That makes real common sense.

No space before periods, still- std 'murican.  :new_year:
'72 blue Homelite 150
Echo 315, SRM-200DA
Poulan 2400, PP5020, PP4218
RedMax GZ4000, "Mac" 35 cc, Dolmar PS-6100
Husqy 576XP-AT
Tanaka 260 PF Polesaw, TBC-270PFD, ECS-3351B
Mix of mauls
Morso 7110

Al_Smith

Perhaps in Maine you have a point regarding the use of screens. However in terms of chainsaw performnce regarding how the engine runs not so.
Period with  space ,product of a not so fat of finger or not so practicular method of typing from a mechanic not an English teacher.  ;)

I can't help but wonder though with the amount of posters who use no punctuation  ,no capitol letters and incorrect spelling why a simple period would be so irksome to anyone.

If it's not too much of a problem since the subject seems to come up  time and time again especially on my posts explain why that is so annoying if you kindly would.

Tell ya what you tell me and I'll tell you in exact details how a two cycle engine works ,that I know. English composition ,it's been a long time since high school . :D

JOE.G

Don't worry I won't bash you for grammar, since mine is awful also. CTYANK so all people that remove the screen from there saw's are Hillbilly's?
Husqvarna 562XP Woods Ported .025 pop up MM
Husqvarna Rancher 55 2005
Husqvarna 450 Anniversary Edition 2010
STIHL 009 1998
STIHL HT 131 Pole Saw 2012
STIHL FS 110 R Trimmer 2010
STIHL BR 600 Magnum Blower 2012

AdkStihl

Quote from: JOE.G on December 27, 2012, 10:08:47 AM
Don't worry I won't bash you for grammar, since mine is awful also. CTYANK so all people that remove the screen from there saw's are Hillbilly's?

Wonder what he thinks of the one's who remove screens and add extra ports  :D
J.Miller Photography

AdkStihl

Quote from: CTYank on December 25, 2012, 05:50:16 PMAnybody who thinks this has any impact on performance is paranoid or easily suggestible.  :embarassed:

Do you own any 2-cycle stuff? For example: A chainsaw, line trimmer, leaf blower or anything of the like?

Doesnt seem it by the above quoted comment you made.

Sincerely
Backwoods Hillbilly   :-*
J.Miller Photography

Al_Smith

Gee there is no real "backwoods " here so I must be a cornfield hillbilly... ;D

Now on that you can catch a cornfield on fire but they usually do it with a 150 thousand dollar combine... Much weeping and gnashing of teeth when that happens ...

Ha space,three periods  new modern hillbilly English. ;)--or maybe a new form of country ebonics.

Now this could be a great break through in translation because weather speaking the "Queens" English ,Aussie ,Brit or hillbilly we all or should have the written word about the same .By different punctuations it would therefore be very easy to figure out who was who without a specific location or mention of grits.

See all this time people thought I was just another pretty face. Fooled them all.

martyinmi

Quote from: Al_Smith on December 27, 2012, 04:23:15 PM


See all this time people thought I was just another pretty face. Fooled them all.

Al Smith...another pretty face??? Nope, ya never had me fooled! :D

And...with all the names that have been assigned to me over the years I suddenly learn that I am a hillbilly too? fly_smiley
And a hillbilly who punctuates most of the time to boot! smiley_goofy_face
No God, No Peace
Know God, Know Peace!

lumberjack48

Heres a picture of a muffler that my first saws had. There wasn't much backup pressure on this style of muffler. On the 08-S, Stihl we would drill about 8, 3/8" holes in the face of the muffler. This would start a fire real easy, with the muffler up against the tree, add a little Jack Pine moss [FIRE] i had to be real careful. The Homelite muffler was no better. A guy had to be very careful cutting in the summer not to start a fire. I remember the Ranger giving me a lecture, i was 12 yrs old.
I hope I'm not being graded, English wasn't my favorite subject.



 
Third generation logger, owner operator, 30 yrs felling experience with pole skidder. I got my neck broke back in 89, left me a quad. The wife kept the job going up to 96.

Al_Smith

Marty Marty Marty tsk,tsk ,tsk. You know you can't start a sentence with an and. Further more you can't end a full sentence with a subject and verb with an exclaimation point .

Now we have to take this more seriously before we both get assigned to write a 500 page essay about the virtues of punctuation or was that being punctual? It gets confusing after a while .< Space ha ha ha !

Lawdy do you have any idea how long it would take an illiterate flat land  hill billy like me who types with one finger to complete such a daunting task? Perhaps if I praticed using two fingers it could be done in half the time . ;D

AdkStihl

J.Miller Photography

lumberjack48

I had a Lighting III Lumbard i bought new in 1970, cut good, but kicked like a Mule.

The C5, C7, C9  Homelite had this style muffler also.
Third generation logger, owner operator, 30 yrs felling experience with pole skidder. I got my neck broke back in 89, left me a quad. The wife kept the job going up to 96.

Al_Smith

I think perhaps the early style Lombard Comango,Lightning .Lighting II might have had just a spark arrester .The two I have running and two or three in boxes that used to run have the same style muffler as a Homelite XL-12 .

Fact if you look that model up on Mike Acres site I think the blue one might belong to Mike and it has a spark arrester while the orange one is mine which has a muffler .That saw was considered fast in it's time and the reason it would come back so hard is because the timing was advanced about 35 degrees .

That's one of them you don't pussy foot around with .Pull that pot licker over with gusto or it will try to pull your fingers off .

Dave VH

I don't have any spark arrestors installed. I even took it out of my dirtbike.

by the by, I can't spell, I have lousy punctuation, and my grammer ain't no good,  I'm glad that we aren't judged here for that
I cut it twice and it's still too short

Al_Smith

Quote from: Dave VH on December 29, 2012, 05:25:58 PM


by the by, I can't spell, I have lousy punctuation, and my grammer ain't no good,  I'm glad that we aren't judged here for that
If we are though we make ourselves a pain in somebodies buttocks .< space  :D :D

Now that aside as much sport as it is I really was serious .If you feel the need to run a screen on a modern pressure can muffler just cut the hole larger and reinstall the screen .It will have the same effect as removing the screen .

TW where ever he got off to once had a formula with regards to how much to increase the hole size so it acted like the screen was removed but I have no idea myself .

I'm a rouge illiterate hill billy saw porter .When I get done with a muffler there is no screen ,no baffle cage ,no diverters .Nothing left but the shell .

Do they run better ,good question but you can certainly hear them a long ways away . ;D

JohnG28

I did a MM to my 361 and used the 288 husky deflector and a screen. Plenty more power and still "legal", least on state land. (Plenty of that near my camp)
Stihl MS361, 460 & 200T, Jonsered 490, Jonsereds 90, Husky 350 & 142, Homelite XL and Super XL

AdkStihl

Quote from: JohnG28 on December 29, 2012, 06:56:56 PM
I did a MM to my 361 and used the 288 husky deflector and a screen. Plenty more power and still "legal", least on state land. (Plenty of that near my camp)

266 Deflectors are much cheaper than 288's ;)
$5 vs $14
J.Miller Photography

scully

Great thread ! my only input .......more flow more go .....nuff said.....
I bleed orange  .

SwampDonkey

A brand new Stihl 550 right out of the shop will clog up the screen in the first 8 hours and your production will head south. I've run them enough to know. So what we do is put in a courser screen. This is acceptable to the brow beaters on crown land, so good enough for us. Without this modification you are for ever cleaning screens. Before ya start blat'n about that, it doesn't end there.  With the way the thing is designed the screws will either strip out or the mounted hexagon insets that are punched in from the inside of the muffler will eventually pop out. I got real tired of that non-sense and just put in a  bigger screen from the get go. When I first bought a FS550 I couldn't figure out why the heck I was loosening power by mid afternoon on my first thinning job. Problem solved. And anyone that thinks otherwise has never run one for much, let alone a full 8-10 hr day for a straight week. You can bring your brand new saw to our next site and I'll be chuckling at you for a bunged up and later busted up muffler screen by day two when you poke it a good crack with your screw driver.

:new_year:
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

drobertson

On my 362 there are two snap in looking caps in the front of the muffler, do these come out, are they suppose to come out after break in?
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

AdkStihl

Quote from: drobertson on December 31, 2012, 11:52:27 AM
On my 362 there are two snap in looking caps in the front of the muffler, do these come out, are they suppose to come out after break in?

Yes they do.
But they are not exhaust ports. Remove them to access your muffler bolts.
Has nothing to do with break in.

They are in place to reduce the amount of crud from filling the holes which would hinder future maint. if ever the muffler needed to be removed.
J.Miller Photography

drobertson

I kinda figured that, thanks, J, it never hurts to ask I guess, with all the the talk about supin up our saws I kinda got into it. This saw,362 is a pretty bad lil custormer in my opinion,  appreciate your response, by the way I still have the 028 on the bench, I will get to it soon, thanks for the help.  david
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Al_Smith

Quote from: SwampDonkey on December 31, 2012, 09:46:32 AM
This is acceptable to the brow beaters on crown land, so good enough for us.   

:new_year:
Oh heavens there you go again talking Chinese .What in the world are brow beaters on crown land ? ???

SwampDonkey

Company quality, performance and safety checkers that you see about twice a year.  ;D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Peter Drouin

Its the same guy that put in the screens is the guy that took away the vent hole in a gas cans :D
A&P saw Mill LLC.
45' of Wood Mizer, cutting since 1987.
License NH softwood grader.

s grinder

drobertson,the caps over the muffler studs are required by the tree huggers,their called a [ anti-tamper] device.

cuterz

No opening the passages will give performance gains not the screen unless plugged. :D

JuniperBoss

My little Ms 170 saw clogged up with carbon before the thing cut 1 cord! I cleaned the spark arrestor nice and shiny, put it back, and it ran good. Honestly, it would clog up so fast it was unbelievable. I don't like homeowner's saws. This saw was sent to the doctor and came back diagnosed with an internal laceration (scored piston). Surely the spark arrestor had something to do with the scored piston. If I would have taken it out, would the saw have survived? You tell me.
"The three great essentials to achieve anything worthwhile are, first, hard work; second, stick-to-itiveness; third, common sense." --- Thomas Edison

Caloren

We use our 170 for clearing brush and small trees from our property, and a lot of times we are cutting at ground level in dry leaves, so do not want to remove the screen. I had used it for about two weeks when it lost power, yep, screen was plugged. The only saw I have that needs the screen cleaned every time it is serviced. I must say though, this saw gets more use than any of the others, mainly because of the type of work we do.
Loren
Stihl MS 170, Stihl MS 310, Stihl 028 AV Super, and half a dozen other no-accounts! Cat D4 D.

AdkStihl

Quote from: JuniperBoss on January 07, 2013, 11:53:54 AM
My little Ms 170 saw clogged up with carbon before the thing cut 1 cord! I cleaned the spark arrestor nice and shiny, put it back, and it ran good. Honestly, it would clog up so fast it was unbelievable. I don't like homeowner's saws. This saw was sent to the doctor and came back diagnosed with an internal laceration (scored piston). Surely the spark arrestor had something to do with the scored piston. If I would have taken it out, would the saw have survived? You tell me.
.

Too rich a mix causing carbon scoring on the piston and plugging the screen.
All too common with persons not realizing or caring how and what they mix their fuel with.
OR.....a bad case gasket leaking bar oil into the crankcase, but that isnt possible on a 170.
Did the saw smoke at all before cutting that 1 cord of wood ;D
J.Miller Photography

JuniperBoss

Smoke? Like smoke from the exhaust? Come to think of it, I do remember the exhaust puffing a little one or twice when I went out to cut. It wasn't much at all, big it was smelly and I could see just a little bit of partial burn or smoke from the exhaust. The engine was warm and was in operation, so it wasn't just from being cold.
     As for the gas mix, how can you mess that up? It's a gallon of fuel and a little container of oil. Pour it in, mix it up, your done. The dealer recommended the Synthetic Ultra, so we got it. Myself nor my Father have ever had engine problems, and certainly not ever relating to fuel mix.
"The three great essentials to achieve anything worthwhile are, first, hard work; second, stick-to-itiveness; third, common sense." --- Thomas Edison

lumberjack48

I believe the problem is your only running the saw 1/2 to 2/3 throttle never really cleaning the exhaust out. Run her full throttle off an on while your cutting, keep her cleaned out.
I would definitely pull the screen on this saw before its to late. This saw is begging to breath, its chocking on its own exhaust.
Third generation logger, owner operator, 30 yrs felling experience with pole skidder. I got my neck broke back in 89, left me a quad. The wife kept the job going up to 96.

SwampDonkey

Caloren, why not get a brush saw? That bending down all day cutting little stuff isn't neccessary. A 550 will take down stuff up to 6" on the stump.  ;D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

JuniperBoss

"The three great essentials to achieve anything worthwhile are, first, hard work; second, stick-to-itiveness; third, common sense." --- Thomas Edison

SwampDonkey

Where was it made? There is a new Stihl plant in China now. On the new 560, if I don't see Germany stamped on her, she can sit in the shop shelf. If and when I need one. ;)
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Caloren

Swamp, I've been watching your posts and thinking about doing just that. I'm just not sure if it would be worth it for probably two or three weeks total cutting all year.
Stihl MS 170, Stihl MS 310, Stihl 028 AV Super, and half a dozen other no-accounts! Cat D4 D.

SwampDonkey

Well, just up the weeks to 30, buy more land or hire out by the hour to thin the woods. Now you need one, bad. Just ask, I have lots of answers. :D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Caloren

Well, to answer your answers: 30 weeks? Then I would have to work in that cold, wet, white stuff that falls every winter, Yukk!  :o   :snowball:
More land? No thanks, 16 acres is enough for me.  ::)
Hire out? You mean get a JOB?  :'( I've been retired for 10 years, and I LIKE it.  8)
Well, maybe I'll sneak one of those machines in somewhere, some day.  ;)
Stihl MS 170, Stihl MS 310, Stihl 028 AV Super, and half a dozen other no-accounts! Cat D4 D.

SwampDonkey

I said I have lots of answers. Not always the right ones though. I didn't think it snowed in CA, except maybe 2 weeks a year. Heck I gotta go to 67 before the government hands me a cheque to retire. Who said we got rid of the class system? ;D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Caloren

Well I got retired early when the company I worked for started their new mill in Mexico and shut us down!  >:(  My normal retirement age was 66, but our house was paid for and only one car payment, was a tight couple of years!
Our property is at 3100' elevation so sometimes doesn't get much snow, but some years 12 to 18 inches. Up the road a few miles it will be 10 foot or so!
Stihl MS 170, Stihl MS 310, Stihl 028 AV Super, and half a dozen other no-accounts! Cat D4 D.

JuniperBoss

I live at 4000' elevation, but in the desert. We rarely get more that 10 inches on the ground at one time. Just a bit over in the Cascades there's 6 feet right now! :laugh:
"The three great essentials to achieve anything worthwhile are, first, hard work; second, stick-to-itiveness; third, common sense." --- Thomas Edison

Dave VH

back to the spark screens, I ran my leafblower the other night (stihl) to blow the snow off my truck before putting it into the shop.  I actually saw some sparks coming out of the exhaust.  I don't think that I would of seen them if it were daylight, but it did surprise me.
I cut it twice and it's still too short

JuniperBoss

I assume that does happen when the spark screen is taken out.
"The three great essentials to achieve anything worthwhile are, first, hard work; second, stick-to-itiveness; third, common sense." --- Thomas Edison

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