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proper way to fell a tree

Started by jerry sundberg, November 28, 2012, 08:16:42 AM

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jerry sundberg

I've been falling trees for fifty years and have not had any accidents doing it yet.(Hope I didn't curse myself).But what is the proper way?Can you show a picture of how?
                           Your brother in Christ  Jerry
Farmall  man

Logging logginglogging

if you been doing it for 50 years with no acidents. then I say you are doing it right.

Weekend_Sawyer

I was in my late 40's a few years ago when a buddy of mine took the tree felling class. I believe it was part of the Game Of Logging. He and I felled a couple of trees together and the tips he gave me were priceless. Evaluating the tree, aiming the chainsaw, plunge cuts, using wedges, great stuff.

There is always room for more info in this head of mine, or should I say plenty of room.  :D
Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

beenthere

Welcome to the Forestry Forum

The GOL is great, as it gives a basis for making the individual tree decisions for more accurate felling possible. There is no single proper way, as each tree is, or can be, slightly different.

After this many years, what is causing you to have some doubts about your technique?
Do your trees drop where you need them to drop or just wherever they happen to fall? 

Basic rule seems to be to create a good hinge that will control the direction of the fall, and have an undercut that will keep the tree from breaking that hinge too early in the fall. The back cuts are important when there is a need to use wedges to assist the process for a happy and safe ending.

Don't wait for the accident to happen.  Your interest in learning more about falling trees is a good plan.

A pic of a stump or two will help critique your procedure if you would like that. ;)
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

jerry sundberg

Well I usually make a birds mouth under cut in the direction it is to fall, then a back cut a couple of inches higher. I also use the winch cable and snatch block to get it to go in the right direction even if it's leaning in the opposite direction. There's been a time or two when the tree spins and doesn't go where I want it to,just have to make sure I have a clear escape route! I don't think I've ever seen the" correct way " To fell a tree,just learned from my Grandpa many years ago.
                      Your brother in Christ  Jerry
Farmall  man

Ianab

What you are doing sounds correct for a straight forward simple to fell tree. 99% of the time this is what you should be doing.

Programs like the GOL are more about spotting hazards, and what to do about them. Heavy leaners, rotten hearts, multiple leaders, oversize trees. Things that require a slightly different techniques, and can be traps for the inexperienced.

This is a brochure put out by the NZ Govt (OSH), intended for part time chainsaw users. Farmers, firewood cutters etc. Professional loggers have their own industry training that's even more advanced, but this is just a simple guide to some of the hazards, and what to so about them.
http://www.osh.govt.nz/order/catalogue/archive/treefell.pdf

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

Peter Smallidge

Hi Jerry:

Others have proclaimed the great virtues of Game of Logging, to which I add my enthusiastic endorsement.  I've completed through level III.  It was perhaps the best educational experience of my life.  The things that even seasoned fellers learn during the training will surprise them.  I've hosted trainings through a certified GOL instructor for more than 10 years, and I don't recall ever having anyone (landowner or logger) leaving without admiration for what they learned.  The instructors I've met are top notch.  Class size is limited, and every student has a chance for active learning. Level I is the starting point and teaches the basics of determining a felling plan, determining lean of the tree, aiming the front notch, the bore (plunge) cut, double checking for safety, and finishing the cut.  Levels II and III will help with felling when there is side and back lean, without ropes, cables, tractors, etc.   It's all applied physics, but great fun.  You will learn what you are and are not capable of with your saw. The training will promptly pay for itself in saved work and effort.

Game of Logging is fairly common and accessible in the Northeast; I'm less certain about availability as you move west and south.  Maybe others know.

Play safe!



 



 
Peter Smallidge
NYS Extension Forester &
Adirondack Woodlot Owner
http://cornellforestconnect.ning.com

thecfarm

jerry,welcome to the forum.I've been at it for years too. Sounds like you cut the tree right off the stump. Need to hold some wood. But you know that, I cut on each side of my notch just a little,never had a barber chair,yet.
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

WDH

Yes, don't cut through the hinge and the tree will not spin.
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Okrafarmer

There are several recognized, and several non-recognized methods. Choosing the one that works best will depend on several things, including the shape and size of the tree, how much it is leaning, and whether it is leaning toward or near or away from where you want it to fall, how big your chainsaw is, what the species is, what obstacles you ahve to avoid or overcome, and what the intended use of the wood is.

Different methods can either minimize or maximize accuracy of fall-placement, maximize or minimize damage to the logs you plan to cut from the tree, and either speed up or slow down the rate of descent. Some methods are safer than others, and some are safer under some circumstances, and more dangerous under others.

These are some of the considerations, among other things. I am sure if we collaborated, we could come up with at least ten different cuts that are widely used by professionals, and others that are either not as widely known, or are "the wrong way" to do it.

It would be great to have a chart showing all the "endorsed" felling cuts with little explanations of when are the best times to use them.
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

Logging logginglogging

Next time game of logging comes to Northeastern VT i am gonna do it!!!!

jerry sundberg

Many thanks Guys,I appreciate the coments ,and will look into the GOL.
                      Your brother in Christ  Jerry
Farmall  man

Logging logginglogging

Quote from: WDH on November 28, 2012, 10:36:17 PM
Yes, don't cut through the hinge and the tree will not spin.

Unless of course if the tree is very very dead and punkey or dry and the hinge snaps.  I cut a lot of stuff that has been dead for a long time and ocasionally when i really dont trust a tree enough to even wedge it I hook my winch on it and set it up for the direction i want it to go and then cut it. Once I have it close I simply winch it over from a safe direction. Can also be done with a come-a-long as well.

WDH

Yes, many bets are off with the dead ones.
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Logging logginglogging

Quote from: Logginglogginglogging on November 29, 2012, 07:29:53 AM
Next time game of logging comes to Northeastern VT i am gonna do it!!!!

Oh wait the class costs money and the push Bore cutting like every tree.
Never mind.... :-\

Al_Smith

Well pretty simple if you cut away enough of it gravity will put it down .You just have to kind of aim where it goes and preferabley not into a house or on top of yourself .Not good .

A rope is okay but keep in mind the rope doesn't steer the fall ,the hinge does that .Bad hinge ,bad fall .Once gravity takes over it's too late to correct it then .

celliott

Quote from: Logginglogginglogging on November 29, 2012, 08:15:18 AM
Quote from: Logginglogginglogging on November 29, 2012, 07:29:53 AM
Next time game of logging comes to Northeastern VT i am gonna do it!!!!

Oh wait the class costs money and the push Bore cutting like every tree.
Never mind.... :-\
Levels 1-4 are offered at least every fall at Northwoods stewardship center in West Charleston.
Why are you against bore cutting? The GOL method really is a very safe method to fell trees, in large part because of the bore cut. The only reason to cut straight back when making your back cut, like a traditional method, is if you are using a crosscut saw. That is where those methods descended from.  With modern equipment, you can bore cut with a chainsaw, set the hinge, set wedges so the tree isn't going to fall backwards, and still have the tree attached to the stump, ready to fall when you want it to.
The class is well worth the money IMO, if you are going to be felling any trees at all.
Chris Elliott

Clark 666C cable skidder
Husqvarna and Jonsered pro saws
265rx clearing saw
Professional maple tubing installer and maple sugaring worker, part time logger

Brux

A video my wife took when the neighbor took down a very large cottonwood. Just a cell video and my first time using to utube.



http://youtu.be/TnsoyS9uF54
Woodbine pro processer,2006 woodmizer lt-40, Asv 4520,John Deere 450 c, Oliver 1755,Kabota 6800, walhesten FX90, Stihl 660 056 044 036pro 310 200t 180 Husky 395

Al_Smith

Bore or plunge ? I plunged a bad leaner ash today as a matter of fact with humbolt face cut and a back strap release  and I'm not even on the west coast nor have I participated in the game of logging .Sawman of the corn field .

There's nothing wrong with either a bore or a plunge if they are done correctly and in  the right situation nor the game of logging which quite frankly really isn't a game .

Okrafarmer

What's the difference between a bore and a plunge? don't they both stab in from the tip?
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

Ianab

QuoteA video my wife took when the neighbor took down a very large cottonwood. Just a cell video and my first time using to utube.

Actually, using explosives IS an approved way of removing a hazard tree, and much more fun.

Tends to make a mess of the butt log though, or else it would probably see much more use.  :D

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

beenthere

Blasting was last years' USFS solution to taking several trees down because the hillside was too steep for cutters.   ::) ::)  They didn't explain how the blasting charges were set, but I'd assume manually and not by robots.  Maybe a drone ?
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Al_Smith

Quote from: Okrafarmer on November 29, 2012, 11:18:25 PM
What's the difference between a bore and a plunge? don't they both stab in from the tip?
In that in my way of thinking a plunge goes in one side and out the other using the tip .A bore goes in from the back cut  side to the hinge done both sides leaving a hold wood in the middle which is cut last for the release .

The neat thing about a bore is you can set wedges to prevent a back  lean without worrying of hitting the wedges .Dang saw cutting orange plastic really isn't the thing to do .Yes I've cut the wedges in case you were going to ask .

Now  I have no idea how others use a bore cut ,really don't care truth be known .In my case generally only on larger trees say 36" or so .I like that method myself and wish I'd known about it years ago .So I guess in a way there are some new tricks an old dog can pick up .--even a junk yard dawg--- ;)

Logging logginglogging

I have used bore cuts leaving a backstrap when needed. Just not every tree, as it is much more work that way. Also more risk of kickback.

Okrafarmer

It's pretty good for a leaning tree that you don't want to split.
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

Okrafarmer

One I felt was overused by certain people I knew in Maine was the spear cut. It has its place, and I have used it sometimes, but generally only for small to medium trees in a tight spot.  It seems a bit dangerous for every-day use. Also a little difficult to master the science of it, as it seems to leave a certain element of unpredictability.
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

Logging logginglogging

Quote from: Okrafarmer on November 30, 2012, 08:51:00 AM
One I felt was overused by certain people I knew in Maine was the spear cut. It has its place, and I have used it sometimes, but generally only for small to medium trees in a tight spot.  It seems a bit dangerous for every-day use. Also a little difficult to master the science of it, as it seems to leave a certain element of unpredictability.
i agree

Al_Smith

Quote from: Okrafarmer on November 30, 2012, 08:47:39 AM
It's pretty good for a leaning tree that you don't want to split.
It's also a good idea to bind the butt with a stout length of chain and a binder .Carefull now don't cut the chain else you'll be spending the next hour repairing the cutters .--YES I've hit the chain too but at least I'm honest about it . :D

Geeze I used to hear these guys ramble on they've never stuck a saw ,never missed a fall and never oiled the gas tank .Evidently then they just hadn't had enough time on the trigger then .

Al_Smith

On a plunge there's a little secret to it .You start out with a portion of the tip passed where it will kick back and angle the end of the bar in until it's straight where you want it to be ,then shove it through .It takes some practice though because if done incorrectly it can come back on you out of control .Not good and not safe for a newbe .You have to use a narrow tipped bar and an non guard type chain else to can't plunge with it because of the design of the anti kick backs .

Now I'm not advising anybody to plunge but if done make certain that chain is sharp as a razor .Cutting on the tip because of the way the cutter reacts going around a radiused tip of a bar it really cuts fast .

After about maybe one fall and some bucking though you will need to refile because it puts a strain on the cutters .

muddstopper

I can only remember ever boreing but one tree. It was a massive whitepine that took three men to almost completely reach around it. I had a old Sthil chainsaw that was way to small for this size tree and only had a 18in bar. I cut a leading notch, decided it was to small so, I set the saw inside the lead notch and sawed out another big wedge. Knowing my saw wouldnt reach all the way thru, I then took the tip of the bar and plunged it in from the wedge side and cut out everything I could reach with that short bar. This left just a shell of wood around the outside of the tree. I would saw from one side for a little while and then the other side, until the tree started to lean. I then rev'ed up the saw and let'er rip, cutting as fast as that little sthil would go. The tree fell for what seemed like 30 min, hit the ground and broke out about 20 or 30 ft out of the top.  The tree fell right where I had aimed it and slid down the mountain probably another 50 ft or so. We where skidding with an old D2 Cat dozer, down hill, and had to buck the tree into several logs to pull them. I dont remember for sure, but seems the 8ft butt log had around 800bdft in it.

Al_Smith

Those little D2's have packed out a lot of logs over the years they just weren't made for large stuff .They're little ,narrow and can turn on a dime and give you 9 cents change .What like 26 or so HP to the tracks more or less .

I think they weighed in at around 7,000 pounds and typical of most crawlers should pull about 90 percent of their weight on flat ground .

gspren

  As a firewood cutter I don't fell alot and when I do they are often standing dead oak or cherry and usually from 12 to 22 inches, I wish I knew more about it but so far I just cut a wedge on one side and cut in from the other until it starts. Sometimes I use plastic wedges and sometimes a cable and a farm tractor if I can get to it. Right now I have about 8-10 dead oaks marked ror dropping and I will wait until a friend is available to watch/help since I don't like felling alone.
Stihl 041, 044 & 261, Kubota 400 RTV, Kubota BX 2670, Ferris Zero turn

Weekend_Sawyer


gspren,

I just traded a couple of emails with Kevin Snyder of GOL in Pennsylvania about the basic training for my brother and me, here is his reply to my inquiry about classes in 2013:

  "We will be having classes in 2013, we will start scheduling them in the spring. If you contact me again in the spring, I am sure that we will be able to get you and your brother in one, probably will be in PA."
Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

Al_Smith

Quote from: gspren on November 30, 2012, 12:17:14 PM
    Right now I have about 8-10 dead oaks marked ror dropping and I will wait until a friend is available to watch/help since I don't like felling alone.
That is probabley a very wise choice on your part .Simple rule if you don't feel safe don't do it .

muddstopper

I dont like cutting alone either. I usually make my wife go with me if I have just a tree or two to cut. She might not be able to cut a tree off me if something goes wrong, but at least she can dial 911.

As young'uns growing up, dad aways cut 5ft pulp wood. I grewup running a chainsaw. I have seen what a saw can do. I feel I can probably make an experienced guess about any tree I need to cut, but I also know it doesnt take but one mistake to land in the hospital or end a life. I have had friends, with as much experience as I have, that are no longer with us from just one mistake. Taking someone with you in the woods is the smart approach.

Al_Smith

Quote from: muddstopper on December 01, 2012, 01:18:05 PM
I usually make my wife go with me if I have just a tree or two to cut.      .
"Make " .How do you make a woman do anything ?

Okrafarmer

I guess in his case he just makes her imagine what might happen if she doesn't go.  :-\
He that dwelleth in the secret place of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty. Psalm 91:1

Operating a 2020 Woodmizer LT35 hydraulic for Upcountry Sawmill, Dacusville, SC

Now selling Logrite tools!

Writing fiction and nonfiction! Check my website.

Al_Smith

 :D In lifes little journies and the loves of my life I've managed to be able to coax or pursuade though carefull and calculated methods of negotiation .

However due to the fact the ladies I've been close to where all rather spirited  sweeties "make " never worked in any case --nor they I for that matter .One tried but we parted company 23 years ago .

About the only thing Mrs Smith does is occasionly run the camera if I want to make a vid clp.From afar I might add.

muddstopper

Quote from: Al_Smith on December 01, 2012, 03:51:49 PM
Quote from: muddstopper on December 01, 2012, 01:18:05 PM
I usually make my wife go with me if I have just a tree or two to cut.      .
"Make " .How do you make a woman do anything ?

I lie a lot!

gspren

  My wife is about the last person I want watching me fell trees, she would be screaming at me to be carefull and keep pointing out the obvious.
Stihl 041, 044 & 261, Kubota 400 RTV, Kubota BX 2670, Ferris Zero turn

muddstopper

The obvious is usually what gets you hurt the most. I have never complained when somone pointed out something that I should easily see, especially when I didnt see it first.

Weekend_Sawyer


When I am doing dangerous work with heavy equipment or chainsaws, and especially if there are people around,  I pick the person I trust the most and tell him/her I am watching you only. That is the person I trust to back me up or give me hand signals for loading/dumping ect...

Jon
Imagine, Me a Tree Farmer.
Jon, Appalachian American Wannabe.

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