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Patty's Jeep

Started by Norm, March 21, 2004, 11:11:52 AM

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Norm

Patty asked me to put some pics of her jeep that won't start on here. Keep in mind that any advice you give should be in person with a full set of tools along. ;D










Patty

OK, Red, you shamed me into fixin' old Willy myself.  :P I got the book out and here is what he is about.

Model: MF-M38A1 made by Kaiser
Engine: 4 cylinder F-head Inline 4
Electrical: 24 volt (2 batteries to start it, the 3rd battery to run it)
Tansmission: 3 speed on the floor, 4 WD, Warner T-90

Anyone familiar with these?
I think I'll start with the batteries and see if  the 3 are still good,and  check the terminals. After that, and if he still won't start, we go to the spark plugs, plug wires, etc. This should take a while for me since I have never attempted anything like this. Any advice will be appreciated.
Women are Angels.
And when someone breaks our wings....
We simply continue to fly ........
on a broomstick.....
We are flexible like that.

Paul_H

Patty,
I was going to ask if the engine has been missing,but I see it's right there where it belongs ;D
Science isn't meant to be trusted it's to be tested

Paul_H

OK,I got that out of the way and I feel better 8)

Now what is Willy doing or not doing?Will he turn over?

I Willy want to help
Science isn't meant to be trusted it's to be tested

EZ

Nice jeep Patty.
I think a chevy 350 will make it run. :D :D ;D Sorry just had to say that. Wear groves when changing plugs, keeps your hands from getting all beat up.
EZ

redpowerd

the body on that thing is in some great shape. i still see floorboards! do you still have the windsheild frame?

make sure you clean all frame connections for grounding. i usually expose some new wire, clamp on a new spade, and wire brush the threads in the frame, then use never-seize.
how many gauges worked when it ran last? its good to know oil pressure and if alt. is charging.

that twin stick transfer-case is handy! 8)
NO FARMERS -- NO FOOD
northern adirondak yankee farmer

Patty

Red,
The windshield frame is still in one piece, it just came off at the hinges. It looked as though the hinges had been welded on many times. Yep, Willy and I are the same age, and  he still has floor boards too!  ;D
Most gages were replaced by the last guy that had it, he rewired it too. When our youngest was still home he replaced the batteries and Willy ran just fine. Then all of a sudden he (the Jeep)started just dying out of the blue as you were going along, and there was no getting him started again.

Now Willy just won't start at all. It turns over like it wants to start, but it doesn't seem to quite be getting enough juice. I figure the batteries need a charge to fix the no start problem, and Norm thinks there is a short in the wiring somewhere which caused it just to die as you were driving along.
Women are Angels.
And when someone breaks our wings....
We simply continue to fly ........
on a broomstick.....
We are flexible like that.

Patty

"clamp on a new spade"  By the way, Red, what is a spade. Also,  "that twin stick transfer-case is handy", what are you referrring to here?
Women are Angels.
And when someone breaks our wings....
We simply continue to fly ........
on a broomstick.....
We are flexible like that.

sawhead

when a coil goes out ,they will do like your describing run then just die for no reason then when the coil cools they will start up , might be worth checking
The journey of a thousand miles begins
with a broken fan belt and a leaky tire

old3dogg

I agree with Sawhead.Check the coil.
Neat Jeep.Sure makes me miss my 78 CJ.

Stump Jumper

I agree with EZ  a 350 chevy mill under the hood :o 8) :o 8)

I agree with the coil idea.  Check for spark before the distributor cap and at each plug.   Could have a points problem as well.   Could be distributor cap and rotor also.

Wish I could be there to help.  
Jeff
May God Bless.
WM LT 40 SuperHDD42 HP Kubota walk & ride, WM Edger, JD Skidsteer 250, Farmi winch, Bri-Mar Dump Box Trailer, Black Powder

old3dogg

If you are gonna change the horse power go with a 400 small block.They have ... well... more horse power.
But hey.I had a 74 Nova with a 250 straight 6 and that old dogg would kick some butt!

Stump Jumper

The small block chevy 400 had siamesed cylinders would get hot spots and not cool very well when upping the horse power. So I prefer a 350 with a 400 crank they call it the stroker. 8)
Jeff
May God Bless.
WM LT 40 SuperHDD42 HP Kubota walk & ride, WM Edger, JD Skidsteer 250, Farmi winch, Bri-Mar Dump Box Trailer, Black Powder

redpowerd

that glass bodied cj5 of mine has a amc 360 :o
gobs of power for that little thing, soon its gettin a barely used 304.

the spade is a terminal end for your wire. kinda like a wire nut, but you clamp it on with pliers. youll see what i mean when and if you replace your ground wires. any hardware or auto store should have them, and they come in all gauges.

that twin stick is for high and low range, and 4 wheel drive. its handy when you want low range, but not 4wd, like towing a hay wagon or navigating tight turns.
unless that t-case was swapped out for a newer one upgraded with power take off........in that case it should be dismantled and truck freighted directly to my cj5 and replaced with an original ;)kiddin

id go with these guys in checking power to the coil and the coil itself. i usually just put a new coil in, or you could test it with an ohmmeter, i think. ill do some reading on the test, or someone will chime in with it. never had a reason to test a coil, have oodles of em.

there will be enough rednecks in here to get that ol gal runnin!
NO FARMERS -- NO FOOD
northern adirondak yankee farmer

sawwood


 Hi Patty. I work on Jeeps here in KC and have seen the one
 like you have. If you can git Norm to let me test drive the
 WM i can come up some saterday and have a look see. I
 am in Phoenix now and will be home Wed night so just give
 me a e-mail and will see what we can do.

 Sawwood
Norwood M4 manual mill, Solar Kiln, Woodmaster
18" planer/molder

Mark M

There might be a ballast resistor in line with the coil. They used to go bad and you wouldn't get any spark. They usually were a ceramic block about 1/2 inch square and 3 inches long. You can test it with an ohm meter or just hotwire it.

old3dogg

See Patty.
You are gonna have that old jeep up and running in no time!
Let the good times roll!

smwwoody

If the coil is good  CXlean the spark plugs and file the points and she should fire right up

Woody
Full time Mill Manager
Cleereman head rig
Cooper Scragg
McDonugh gang saw
McDonugh edger
McDonugh resaw
TS end trim
Pendu slab recovery system
KJ4WXC

redpowerd

id change the points and condenser along with all plugs and wires, and cap and rotor. there, a tune up! proly needs it anyway. set your points with a buck folded in half, with just enough resistance to pull it out.
NO FARMERS -- NO FOOD
northern adirondak yankee farmer

Sawyerfortyish

My votes for a bad coil to.  I had a tractor do the same thing heat up and die. Make sure you have power to one side of the coil when the key is on. I think I have a manual for that model jeep someplace.

Patty

OK, this is dandy guys, I'm gonna have to look in the book to see where and what a coil is.  ::)  Another point of interest, the book said to turn the key and see if the lights dim. Well I couldn't get the lights, nor the turn signals, nor any of the gages to work at all. Is this a coil sounding problem, too? Or does it have something to do with those three batteries not talking to eachother correctly?
I feel pretty stupid here, but really it is only lack of experience. (honest!) Put a sony medical printer in front of me, and I can fix it, show me a sewing pattern, and I can make it, I just have never had the opportunity to learn about cars. Speaking of engines, we do have an extra 350 sitting in a case out there in the morton, Brett had it pulled out of his '67 Camaro and dropped in a new one. I just don't think it would fit in the Willy, literally.
Lester!!! I like the way you think! You can have all day on the WM, if you take a look at the Willy! I'll even off load for you! 8)
As soon as you have a free weekend, head on up. Please PM, me when you get home.
Women are Angels.
And when someone breaks our wings....
We simply continue to fly ........
on a broomstick.....
We are flexible like that.

Corley5

As long as we're talking Jeeps..  Anybody ever see a CJ2A with the shift on the steering column instead of on the floor?  Ours happens to be on the column and is the only one I've ever seen like it.
Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

isawlogs

Hi Patty...
 The first thing you will need to do is get your batterys charged up or replaced... clean the terminals of the batterys (sand them or use a wire brush ... I use my roto zip with a wire brush on )
  2  check your distibutor cap and clean the inside terminals.... The dist...should be on the engin side or top  a round black about 3 to 4 inch in diameter with 5 wires the size of a pencil coming out the top .... dont remove the wires they have a specific cylinder togo to....the center wire is going to the coil.....I am not familior with the willy but they are atached by eather a screw or a spring clip ... lift the cap off... your rotor is under neath the cap .... turn cap so you can see inside you should see 5 terminals 1 center for coil and 4 for sparkplugs these need to be cleaned .... emery cloth will do fine (sand paper )
 3,...  rotor  also needs cleaning with emery cloth only the end witch is in contact with the terminals of the cap....the rotor can be pull out it sits on a shaft... it could be stuck there and you will need to pull hard or in some cases prie it out ,   below the  rotor are your points
 4.  this little criter is what makes the spark that will get willy going.....as your motor turns the points will open creating a spark , the rotor brings it to the distributor cap then the wires to the sparkplug.... et voila le moteur is a start....
   the points need to be checked   once you have your batterys are OK  and you have the cap & rotor off  have Norm (had to get you in here somehow ) turn the motor over with the key    wile you check to see if the points are making contact and a small spark should hapen .... you can clean the points with a very small flat file , litely file the points by puting the file in between the contact point of the points and only a few strokes will do ( emery cloth can be used for this also it only to create a clean flat erea for the contact)
 If you have spark at the points your half way there ,,....
4, put rotor , cap back in place if you are changing the wires , change them one 1 at a time ,
   take a sparkplug out  they will be at the end of the wire check ther eif you have a spark Two ways of doing this ...one you will remimber a long time and a easy way.... your choice.... 1 hold plug in your hand and ground it to motor ....(if there is spark you will not need to see it ) 2 take a pair of insulated pliers and hold the plug to the motor and look for small bluish sparrk at the end of plug... if you got spark  your almost there
 5  once you get to this point.... try willy ifin he dont start it could be the gas so I would do this part and then when you get there we will coach you throught the next ifin you need coaching......  
A man does not always grow wise as he grows old , but he always grows old as he grows wise .

   Marcel

isawlogs

Patty
 if you need any help understanding this IM me and I will try to help you out
  Marcel
A man does not always grow wise as he grows old , but he always grows old as he grows wise .

   Marcel

chet

Patty da coil or in line resister has absolutely nothing to do with da lights. From da sounds of things probably your best bet is to check battery and ground connections and trace your voltage from there. Sounds like you are loosing your voltage somewhere.
I am a true TREE HUGGER, if I didnt I would fall out!  chet the RETIRED arborist

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