iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

H.P. and Hook Angle

Started by dgdrls, October 01, 2012, 05:57:39 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

dgdrls


My little LT-10 is serving me quite well so far with one exception, 
Hard woods are giving me difficulties with lateral shake of the sawhead, 
I have sawn with 10 deg and 9 deg blades, with varying success at various feed rates.
the drier the logs the worse the effect no matter how fast/slow I advance the sawhead. 
I have only been able to find bands down to 8 deg bands.

Question, does it take more H.P. to pull less hook?
If so any sources where I can get shallower bands?

Thanks
DGDrls


POSTON WIDEHEAD

What dia. are the Oaks your sawing?
Are you pouring the lube to it?

The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

dgdrls

18" or smaller  Hard Maple Locust and Hickory so far,  water and pinesol lube   wet but not bathing them,  soaked the hickory I had
but it was also wetter to start with,

DGDrls

millstead

You could try woodmizers 4%. Blade they worked well for me and I was sawing with 14hp but I had to saw slow

customsawyer

Hickory is tough on my LT70. I would hate to think what it could do on a LT10.
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

WDH

I am with Customsawyer.  Hickory and locust?  Whew  :).
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

mikeb1079

my home built mill is probably similar to your lt 10, mine is 16hp.  i have used woodmizers 4 degree bands with success on oak and locust.  give em a shot  8)
that's why you must play di drum...to blow the big guys mind!
homebuilt 16hp mill
99 wm superhydraulic w/42hp kubota

hackberry jake

You could try less set on the locust, but hickory and oak need a little more. I set a band with way too much set and noticed a jerky cut. I need to get an angle gauge. I have just been "eye balling" the hook angle.
https://www.facebook.com/TripleTreeWoodworks

EZ Boardwalk Jr. With 20hp Honda, 25' of track, and homemade setworks. 32x18 sawshed. 24x40 insulated shop. 30hp kubota with fel. 1978 Massey ferguson 230.

fat olde elf

Hackberry Jake....What is your sharpening system where you can "eyeball the hook angle"? 
Cook's MP-32 saw, MF-35, Several Husky Saws, Too Many Woodworking Tools, 4 PU's, Kind Wife.

ladylake


Is it shaking with both new and sharpened blades?  Are there any adjustments where the head meets the post that could be tightened up some? A couple things that cause shake would be a couple of teeth set more than the rest, wear on the grinder wheel when sharpenig leaving the teeth at the end of the band slightly higher than at the start.  I've went to a harder wheel .  Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

ladylake

Quote from: hackberry jake on October 01, 2012, 10:38:41 PM
You could try less set on the locust, but hickory and oak need a little more. I set a band with way too much set and noticed a jerky cut. I need to get an angle gauge. I have just been "eye balling" the hook angle.


If you have a miter saw just saw some small wood pieces at 4*   7*    10*   etc.   Not that it has to be exact.    Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

dgdrls

Thanks for the input so far,

Bands are standard WM, Double Hard.
WM indicated 9 or 10 deg available only for the LT10
The last log I cut was Hard Maple 3 months dry about 18" Dia
w/ new 9 deg.  Hard Maple seems to be the worse.
I will also recheck all sawhead connections

I have another piece of Locust I'll try again with the 9 Deg and more lube,

DGDrls


NMFP

Try wm 7 degree or 4 degree bands.  I know many use 9 degree but I see no reason to use them when 10 degree is classified as general purpose and 7 saws just about anything.  With all the bands I sharpen and use, I no longer sharpen any 9 degree.  All 4,7 and 10. 

If you cannot find 4 or 7 degree, sharpen a band you have to 7 degree and I am sure you will see a major difference in your results.

Good luck and let us know how you make out!   8) 8) 8) 8)

hackberry jake

Here is my sharpener set up. I never have thought about the miter saw trick. I'll have to try that.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KXIcvSgrN3M
https://www.facebook.com/TripleTreeWoodworks

EZ Boardwalk Jr. With 20hp Honda, 25' of track, and homemade setworks. 32x18 sawshed. 24x40 insulated shop. 30hp kubota with fel. 1978 Massey ferguson 230.

dgdrls

Well as far as bands go WM does not produce a 7 or 4 deg for the LT-10,
Cooks makes an 8 Deg or I have some sharpened as NMFP suggested

Anyone have experience with Cook's 8 deg?

DGDrls

Handymark

I wonder if Woodmizer resharp will do a custom hook angle upon request?

bandmiller2

I have mentioned this before but look at Jakes vidio as the left side of the grinding wheel wears you will get less and less hook.You can counter that tendency by dressing the wheel often,but that wastes alot of good "grits".Most folks are better off with a little less hook anyways.Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

mikeb1079

so woodmizer won't make the 4 degree in the length you need?  that seems weird, i wouldn't think that'd be too much extra work on their part.  have you asked them?
that's why you must play di drum...to blow the big guys mind!
homebuilt 16hp mill
99 wm superhydraulic w/42hp kubota

hamish

Lenox makes the Woodmaster C-Sharp that works on the LT-10.  Have used the same band on my Norwood ML26 in cherry, oak, and seasoned tamarac (larch for some of you) with great results driven by 13hp.
Norwood ML26, Jonsered 2152, Husqvarna 353, 346,555,372,576

5quarter

DGDRLS...It takes less hp to run less hook. The more aggressive the hook angle, the more hps you need to take advantage of the blade.You have the right idea in that the less hook angle will produce less lateral force on the sawhead. get some one to resharpen some of your bands to 4°. also, when you next order blades, request 1" tooth spacing instead of the standard 7/8". The lt-10 is a great mill, but it is lightweight relative to the lt 15, for example, and the lt-15 is built more fore hobby than production. you will run up against your mills limits PDQ sawing the bigger hardwoods. another way to avoid or minimise lateral force on the sawhead is to keep your cuts under 10-12". also, you may want to try running .035" thickness on your blades. you are less likely pull down the rpms cutting a thinner kerf and may increase your feed rate. I would not use them to cut anything over 12" as you can't put enough tension on them to make up for the lesser beam strength.
   After going through the major brands, I settled on Cooks SS. for my saw and for what I am cutting, the Cooks blades are top performers.
What is this leisure time of which you speak?
Blue Harbor Refinishing

hackberry jake

5quarter, I'm not sure about the less hook angle takes less hp comment. I think it's the other way around but I may be mistaken.
https://www.facebook.com/TripleTreeWoodworks

EZ Boardwalk Jr. With 20hp Honda, 25' of track, and homemade setworks. 32x18 sawshed. 24x40 insulated shop. 30hp kubota with fel. 1978 Massey ferguson 230.

losttheplot

I get the head shake going on some times (Norwood LM2000) usually on wide cuts with the head up high.
From searching the forums I dont seem to be the only one getting it.

I find it is worse with a new sharp band, once it has made a couple of cuts it seems better.
I cut mostly Doug-Fir.

My local band supplier, Now a wood-mizer dealer, welds wood-mizer stock to what ever length I ask for.
I have been using 12* with 13hp.

When I'm pushing the mill, I push with one hand on the side of the frame, it takes very little effort to steady the shaking.

Hope this helps,
LTP.
DON'T BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU THINK !

dgdrls

Thanks to all who posted,  I believe a call to Cooks is in order,
I want to see what they recommend.

DGDrls


5quarter

Jake...You're right. I should have worded that better. Given the same log and the same feed rate, it does take more hp to run a 4°, as the 4° takes a slightly smaller bite. however, if you run the 4° a little slower and keep the rpms up, it'll make a straight cut with less lateral force on the sawhead and reduce or eliminate the shake that the OP was having trouble with.
   A bigger, higher hp mill like an lt-40 can really maximise the capability of a high hook angle blade, running at the maximum feed rate that the gullet will allow. And the strength and stability of the larger sawhead will in most cases overcome any lateral force that would cause shake and shimmey in a smaller saw (even more evidence to support the assertion that bigger is better... ;)).
   Dgdrls... So how goes the sawing? have been able overcome your trouble?
What is this leisure time of which you speak?
Blue Harbor Refinishing

drobertson

I just have to ask you all that use the manual mills, and the ones of you that post pictures, are you boys brushing off the boards before taking pictures?  Everything I have seen posted looks really good!  I mean I am impressed with the quality that I have seen on the forum.   and back to hook angles, I really would stay with the recomended blades. Of course trial and error leads to improvements in about everything, just saying with all belts tight, motors a running, a 7/8 pitch on the teeth, these things should just cut.  If you have to push the blade with a fight, you might just make sure the alignment of the blade is true, 
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Thank You Sponsors!