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Vertical log construction

Started by Hoop, March 09, 2004, 09:02:55 PM

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Hoop

Photos of a 10 x 14'  tool shed and 24 x 40'   2 story garage I built using the vertical log construction method.

Please use the forum gallery for photos (admin)

Jeff

Pretty cool. How do you fasten one log to the next?
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Tom

You start 50 years ago and plant seedlings real close together along the foundation line, Jeff. :D

Welcome to the 'Forestry Forum, Hoop.  Looks like you will be full of information and good stories.  :)

beenthere

Vertical log construction brings up a lot of questions. What is the history of such construction, and what might be the advantages? I conjure up a lot of disadvantages (in my mind) over horizontal construction, but surely there are advantages (other than it is different).  

One advantage I can think of is no vertical shrinkage, thus the doors and windows wouldn't have to allow for vertical movement. However, the same shrinkage horizontally will add gaps between logs that might be good for drying hay (crops)and shooting at attacking Indians - i.e. okay for a barn.  

Changing out rotted wood (usually confined to the sill area) would be more difficult with the vertical log construction. However, water runoff might be markedly improved.

Brings up some interesting thoughts about its design. I hope to learn more about it.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Hoop

The logs are held together by 60 penny ring shank pole barn nails.  They aren't going anywhere.  

As with any building method, it has its advantages & disadvantages.

The advantages:
 It is far easier to horse around logs that are 8' in length.....than much bigger (and heavier) logs.
   I believe it produces a stronger wall than a conventional horizontal log wall.
The settling problem inherent in home logs is almost nonexistent.  
IMHO, the vertical log building method is inherently suited to the owner/builder that doesn't have a spare crane/excavator/etc standing idly by, ready to lift heavy logs.


The disadvantages:
 Someone mentioned shrinkage.  I didn't have this problem.  Most of my logs were dried through the course of 2 summers.
IMHO...the biggest disadvantage is resale value.  In this area, the vertical log building technique is fairly common, but unfortunately, nearly all of the vertical log buildings were very poorly designed.  Logs were used only inches from the ground, and the rain/backsplash/snow has taken its toll.   There are lots of vertical log buildings around here in very bad shape.....and as a result.....they are not looked upon favorably.


Also, if one designs a log building with the thought in mind of replacing logs sometime in the future.....IMHO.....one has lost before they started.   Logs should never be replaced.  The design should encompass placing logs at least 2' above grade as well as sufficient overhang.  
Throw in annual maintenance (caulking any new cracks that develope) and staining every 3 - 5 years and one should NEVER need to replace a log.  

Alcione

Thanks for the info and photos Hoop. I thought I was alone in thinking vertical log building was a viable method of construction. Im attracted to it for the same reasons you identified but have found it difficult to get information. I think this is because it's a deviation from "standard/accepted" log building practice. Ive only located a couple of good sources on the net for vertical construction - one in sth africa (loghomes.co.za) and an alaskan site (alaskacabin.net) this compares to hundreds of horizontal log sites. Most of the vertical designs in these sites are not ideal for me as they have tried to make them a little too modern for my liking but the engineering principals are there thats for sure and im positive a backwoods style of house could be crafted. Of course, im open to suggestions on ANY log building method.


Wes

My G-Grandfather built several log cabins in my area after WW 1 , A couple of them were vertical,from what I understand that design is of french origion.

 One of those cabins is up the road from my house, still standing tall on the mountainside. This house was built a little different than the others, He milled the logs in half, put a layer of sheathing and tarpapper between them and moved the inner logs over 1/2 way so that the inside logs covered the gap between the outside logs.  No drafts.

 Wes

Alcione

Thats a very interesting and ingenious technique Wes. Great to see the house has stood the test of time well.
The guys in south africa (that i found on the net) use a technique that starts with a horizontal sill log. On top of that is a horizontal plate log (about 3 x 10) then the 8ft vertical logs are placed with an overhang of a couple of inches at the front edge to allow water run-off. The vertical logs have a groove each side plus top and bottom and are splined to each other with strips of plywood. Top of the verticals are a double top plate of horizontals again. I guess they are nailed and bolted appropriately. I agree that this method originates in europe. This has been an interesting research project for me and im looking forward to getting started on my own place.

Alcione

Just come across this site that has a good story about the vertical log construction in the USA. Looks like its beginnings were from around the early 1600's.
http://www.vertical-log-courses-homes.net/originalbuilding.html
Hope you find this interesting.

Wildman

I've been teaching Vertical Log Home Construction since September 1995 - in South Africa of all places... 960 people trained - more than 300 student-built homes to date - the system originates from the Vikings - Most of the Vertical Log artisans were lost in the Great Fire of London,  but was brought to North America by the French - hence examples of the method in former French regions of the US and Canada.
 
The oldest living example of any wooden building (to the best of my knowledge) is a vertical log church in Greensted, Essex, UK - built in 845 a.d.  
There is also reference to King Solomans Temple being built in Vertical Cypress in the bible.. ( student pointed this out during one of my courses).

I'd be happy to answer any questions regarding the system.

The blessings of the system are many - very easy to learn. Fresh-cut logs are used because there is less than 1% shrinkage in the vertical length - plywood splines used and ringshank nails..or galvanised roofing nails. - Sill plate protectected by the vertical logs over-hanging..no water collection.

We treat with Boron - which works by diffusion... requires 50% moisture in the log..

Cheers,

Bruce

www.loghomes.co.za

momto8kiddos

Hello!  I'm new to the forum.  And vertical log construction is the reason I joined!  We are thinking of building using this method.  We are total green horns but have four teenagers who can help us.
  Vertical log construction seemed ideal for us.  (However, we are investigating cordwood as well.)

In my research of the vertical log method  :P  I've read in historical accounts that the reason horizontal construction replaced vertical is because of vertical had more disadvantages than horizontal.  I'd be interested in hearing the disadvantages of both discussed in detail.

Mom to 8 kiddos  :D
Mom to 8 kiddos

john hass

i have studied log building for many years. my study is from the viewpoint of a homesteader with no money. i fully believe you can build a 2000 sq. ft. house for under 20,000$. vertical log is the cheapest method to build. 2011 prices!!!

1 would like to build log end style but it is much more time consuming and expensive.

place the bottom plate in place. then stand up the first corner log. toe nail thru bottom thru the outside and inside of log.  place the 1st top plate up spike it to the corner log, and using a ladder or boards to hold up the other end. you should never have to work alone. its easy to find someone to help. one person then stands the next log against the first one. the other person then takes a chain saw and runs up and down between them till a 3 or 4 inch flat is made.

you can use fiberglass insulation between the logs. cut them in about 6 inch strips and tack it to log number one, then fold it over to the inside and tack it again. (staple) top middle and bottom. then place log number 2 against the first log and toenail bottom and spike thru thru top plate. i would cut 3/4 inch styrofoam strips cut 3 to 4 inches wide. the styrofoam would look like chinking. you could cover it later. the best way is to quarter some poles and place the pieces between the logs. what we arnt told is fiberglass when it gets moisture from the air and wind the r-value drops to nearly nothing. if you drive past houses in the morning at the right time you can see the stud placement under the siding. with log building you dont have this problem.

then install log number three.  the reason you toenail the bottoms thru the inside and outside is so you dont saw them when flatting the sides. when using green logs or when cutting green logs before you dry them you can score the logs with a chain saw an inch or inch and a half deep. this will allow the checks and cracks to go to  the sides more. these sides can then be placed together when you put them up and not be seen. you do need overhangs. also you should put up rock 12 or 16 inches high around the perimeter to protect the logs.



i have left the window holes blank then put in the frames but you cant fill in the spaces properly so you should put the walls up then cut in for windows. doors  openings can sometimes be left open because they can be placed a few inches one way or the other  sometimes. if not this good place to use a larger log and flatten it for the door frame. this is a great time to build your own door. far less expensive and they are custom built adding to the great looks of your building.

the first thing anyone should do is buy your windows first. these can be bought much cheaper when you find them on sale. lots of places to look. just dont buy cheapies.

wood has an r-value of 1 to1 1/2 to the inch so an 8 inch wall is only 8-12 r. however, logs insulate different than fiberglass. have you ever walked into a log house on a hot july day?  if i built using log end i would use 24 inch logs. much more r-value.

however an 8 foot vertical log will give as much wall coverage as 4 pieces cut 24 inch. and this without all the expense of mortar and the mixing and placing and insulating  and troweling.

when you spike in a vertical log you are done. a man and a wife team can build this way when you cant build horizontal.

happy building email me or call 1-427-741-0607        john hass

beenthere

Welcome to the forum.
How soon are you going to start building? Hope you take pics as you go, and post them with a short dialogue of the progress.
I don't visualize it working very well, but am interested in knowing more from you.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Jeff

Welcome, and just the guy who's brain I need to pick someday. If I ever find a place near my land to build on, that is the type construction I wish to do. I have a huge amount of cedar available to thin on property that I think would be perfect for vertical construction. Cordwood Construction was another thought as well. I'm guessing you call it log end.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

ljmathias

Fascinating topic, and one that fits in with TF well- I can imagine a post and beam frame that you put the vertical logs into for outside walls- seems like that would eliminate any problems with lining the first log up and keeping the logs up off the ground- use the TF sill plate for that, which is already sitting on concrete slab or columns, or on stacked rocks.  Seems like this method really calls out for a sawmill sitting on the building site so you can trim the vertical logs flat on two sides, and especially to trim logs next to windows and doors, and when a wall run meets the next corner.  I also liked the comment on splitting the logs, and then staggering them inside and out with house wrap and OSB or plywood in between- eliminates all the problems with air leaks and critter invasions.  So now I'm thinking of using it for a shed or workshop, just to try it out- guess that's one of the advantages of the forum, lots of new ideas or old ones you just didn't know about (or at my age, you once knew about and forgot, and then forgot you knew about them   :o  )

Lj
LT40, Long tractor with FEL and backhoe, lots of TF tools, beautiful wife of 50 years plus 4 kids, 5 grandsons AND TWO GRANDDAUGHTERS all healthy plus too many ideas and plans and not enough time and energy

Magicman

Welcome to the Forestry Forum john hass.  Your concept and ideas sound unique and this would be an interesting topic to follow.   :)
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