iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

Bed extensions for wmz mills, much hassle mounting?

Started by drobertson, August 07, 2012, 03:53:35 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

drobertson

I just read a post talking about what it takes for us portable sawyers to move to a sight, one of the guys talked about his 6 foot bed extension. I have always thought I could use one at times, just knew it might be a hassle for moving. Besided the advantage of sawing longer stuff than 20' is it hard to change over?
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Beavertooth

It would not be worth it unless you had a lot of logs to saw. And I would suggest having FAO's on mill and extension where you could get it all level and keep it that way. I have a 6' extension for my LT70 and I use it only if I am going to be there a long long time.
                        Craig.
2007 LT70 Remote Station 62hp cat.

MartyParsons

Hello,
Text book says four hours to change the BX. I have done it in less time. The extension comes with stationary supports.  You could use the fine adjustable supports to save time.  You should check the bed rails every time you move and most times you will not need to change any adjustments. If you have the BX mounted to a pad the time would be much less.  I would guess less than 1 hour after you have done it once.
Marty
"A pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees opportunity in every difficulty." -Winston Churchill

drobertson

This sounds like another niche, I get request for quote bi weekly for 30'+ stock but mostly heart pine.  This stuff is hard to handle. I know it will sell, just not sure on the set up time and accurracy of cuts.
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

customsawyer

In my experience the accuracy is more dependent on the the stress in the logs than the mill. If you have stress in a 10' log imagine what it is going to be like at 3 times the length.   
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

drobertson

thanks for that reminder, cool stuff on your website, those 70's are some horses are'nt they,  Have a good one,
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Brucer

I've extended my mill by 6' (twice ???.) so now I'm up to 33'. It's not something I'd want to do very often for portable work but it has paid off big time now that I'm stationary.

Setup:

  • Level your mill.
  • Position the extension near the end, mounted on it's legs.
  • Shim the legs & use a farm jack/bumper jack to raise it as needed. I like to lay down a couple of 7' long 2x8's under the legs and parallel to the rails.
  • Position the saw head near the front of the mill where it's out of the way and turn off the power. You do NOT want the feed chain to drop onto the contact strip when it's powered up.
  • Remove the feed chain from the tensioner.
  • Remove the tensioner and reposition it at the end of the extension.
  • Drive the alignment pins into the rails on the extension.
  • Slide the extension up to the mill and bolt the connecting block to the mill.
  • Fine tune the shims and start pulling the extension to the mill with the tensioning bolt.
  • Install the brace on the outboard side (you need to transfer one of the mill's outriggers to the brace when you do this).
  • Splice in the 6' feed chain extension, connect it to the tensioner, and tighten the chain.
  • Check the bed rail alignment on the extension so it's the same as the mill. My first extension was a used one and was all set up for the previous owner's mill. The bed rails were 1/2" too high :o ???. My second extension was straight from the factory and the bed rails were 1" too low.
  • Move the carriage along the track; look/listen for bumps and movement as you cross over from the mill to the extension. Fine tune as needed.

Wow, it didn't seem that complicated when I did it. After you've done all this a couple of times, you can probably do it about as quick as I can type it all in :D.

The 6' extension will fit nicely into the back of most pickups if you want to go mobile, but you'll need something to lift it out at each end.

The extension(s) let you fill a niche. I had one customer ask for a 26 foot 8x12. When he came by to get it he borrowed my tape and checked the dimensions along the length. Then he looked up and said, "Look at that -- it's the same all the way along!" It turns out he'd bought a couple of long beams from a circle mill operator who didn't bother to keep his track properly aligned over its full length. The guy keeps coming back to me every few years.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

drobertson

Many thanks Brucer,  that's what I was looking for, Many thanks,  great description.  David
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

JVK

Thanks David for starting this post. And thank you Brucer for the real life instructions. I am about to install a new 12' bx to the LT 50 and was going to ask you guys for some tips on doing the whole thing. Does the mill want to walk to the left looking from the hitch end when turning a big cant? Do you block some of the support feet somehow? Is there a best place to put say a 24' - 28' log on the mill? I allmost allways cut little end first, is big end first better for the turner to work? I know I'll figure this out but I sometimes think things to death. Thanks   Jim

Brucer

OK, this is going to be a bit hit-or-miss.

I load the logs with the small end toward the front. The upside is that you can use the toeboards to level it and you don't have to keep walking to the far end if you're tryng to level the log precisely. The downside is that the logs will overbalance on the hydraulic loader. For the odd long log I just use the FEL to assist. For a whole whack of long logs I build a temporary "dead" deck beside and level with the mill.

It's a good idea to raise the head right up to the top when loading a big log, so there's no chance of the log rolling into the debarker.

When you're first loading a long log don't forget the raise the side stop on the extension. If you think rolling a log off the side is bad, imagine rolling just one end of a really long log off the side :o.

When your logs get to around 30', they will sag in the middle when you try to level them. Level the ends with the front toeboard, then raise the rear toeboard just enough to take some of the sag out of the log. No point in building stress into your timber.

With a claw turner the front end of the log will tend to "climb" the front side stops. Just lower it back down and it will have turned a little. Use the raised clamp to keep the log from rolling away from the side stops, when you back off the turner, but don't clamp it tight. The chain turner will probably do the job quicker and with less hassle.

I've only rarely had to use the auxiliary (manual) clamp that comes with the extension. Sometimes when you try to clamp a heavy log the far end might not come up against the side stop. Your hydraulic relief valve will be squealing but the log won't move. Here's a simple trick -- raise the far toeboard just enough to bump the log and then lower it again. Do this a couple of times, then apply more pressure with the clamp. Repeat as needed -- your log/cant/timber will inch toward the side stop.

Turn a timber using the clamp just as you would for a shorter log. However ... sometimes the timber won't "tip" because the far end stays down on the bed rail up against the side stop. Here's another trick. Use the clamp to lift the front end of the timber and shift it about a foot or so away from the side stop. Then raise the rear toeboard as high as it will go. With a long log the far end will probably stay in contact with the bed rails, but that's OK. The toeboard will act as a pivot. Now slide the clamp out from under the cant, raise it so it's beside the cant, and then push it back toward the side stop. This will kick the far end away from the side stops. Once the cant is parallel to the side of the mill, lower the toeboard, move the clamp under the cant once again and raise it to full height. The cant probably won't tip off the clamp but you can easily tip it using a cant hook at the front. You can even tip it by reaching both hands across the top of the timber and pulling it toward you. Before doing this, think about where the cant is going to go and think about where your body parts are going to be when it goes there. A big cant will land with a heck of a bang.

I did this last little trick with a 16"x14"x27' Douglas-Fir timber today. There was a guy having a smoke outside the building across the road when I did it, and he had his back to me. I think he might have swallowed his cigarette when the cant landed on the deck.

I always try to keep the log as close to the front as possible, while still leaving enough room to raise and lower the head and get the debarker onto the log.

Dealing with slabs and flitches can be annoying. I drag mine back onto a long roller table and then push them sideways onto a row of horses, keeping one end flush. When the timber is finished I cut the pile of slabs and flitches with a chainsaw into whatever lengths I need.

The traditional way of pushing flitches onto the loader arms doesn't work so well because the far end will drop to the ground. If you do this, have a piece of 8x8 or some such on the ground at the far end to keep the flitch up off the ground.

I've never had a log get up enough speed to knock my mill sideways. Dropping a cant on the bed rails when turning makes a loud bang, but doesn't seem to do any damage. There's more bed rails to spread the load out.

Don't forget to raise and lower the manual side stop on the extension. I keep a heavy rubber mallet handy in case I forget.

It's a good idea at the end of the day to walk around the mill and check for loose bolts on the bed rails. Especially keep an eye out for leveling bolts starting to lift up off the frame. Turning heavy cants can loosen them pretty quickly if they aren't properly tightened when you start.

I'm sure there's more -- maybe some of the experts can weigh in.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

customsawyer

I have the 24' ext. and load my logs with the big end towards me. The main reason I am able to do this and get away with this is that I have hyd. on my ext. which gives me the toe board rollers on the ext. It also gives me another two plane clamp and log turner. ;D  The logs that I cut tend to have a large amount of butt swell so I like to keep that end towards me. If the throat of the mill clears the butt swell I can get by the rest of it.
Brucer and I both do some long logs but we are on opposite coast so we cut very different logs, thus the different techniques.
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

thecfarm

Sounds like a few of you really know what you are doing.  ;)
Model 6020-20hp Manual Thomas bandsaw,TC40A 4wd 40 hp New Holland tractor, 450 Norse Winch, Heatmor 400 OWB,YCC 1978-79

drobertson

That is good stuff guys, again thanks. I will start the planning process for this addition. Thanks for the tips and tricks.  I can see cutting long logs from the big end first if for no other reason to save time cutting  the swell without traveling the entire length. I have experienced some issues with weird entry cuts on the big end. Not a problem when it is the last to be cut. Just starting the cut. I hope you guys have a great week-end,  David
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Brucer

Quote from: customsawyer on August 10, 2012, 02:47:43 AM
Brucer and I both do some long logs but we are on opposite coast so we cut very different logs, thus the different techniques.

Not to mention that I don't have the second set of hydraulics, or the same amount of horsepower, or the chain turner, or ...   :D :D.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

pineywoods

For you long-log guys, here's a couple of items I fixed up for my neighbor sawyer.  Link to the backstop on the bed extension


  

  

 


adjustable feet for the legs on the bed extension


  

 
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

JVK

Good pics Pineywoods. I will consider those when I connect the extension. Thanks Brucer for taking the time to explain those tips on dealing with long logs. I'll be off to the races much faster with your help. I even printed them off so I can review over morning coffee. Thanks again.   Jim

drobertson

nice pineywoods! Man, you have it going on for sure. All things are possible with the right amount of devine intervention!  and some good ole get down and do it!
only have a few chain saws I'm not suppose to use, but will at times, one dog Dolly, pretty good dog, just not sure what for yet,  working on getting the gardening back in order, and kinda thinking on maybe a small bbq bizz,  thinking about it,

Thank You Sponsors!