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Circle mill dust removal

Started by SPD748, June 22, 2012, 09:22:30 PM

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SPD748

Good evening all,

I've come to the point in my build where I have to make a decision on dust removal. I have the standard options available i.e. drag chain, blower, conveyor. I've searched and read all the previous posts on the topic. I understand that each has it's advantages and disadvantages. I thought that I had decided on a blower however, lately I've been studying on building a conveyor. I'm thinking of a 24" wide belt under the blade leading flat and perpendicular out and off the concrete pad then dumping onto a separate inclined conveyor to create a pile. I could install a baffle on either side of the blade to direct the dust/chips onto the conveyor belt. I like the conveyor idea due to the clogging issues of a blower. Also, the conveyor would require less hp and be less noisy. I was thinking of something like Woodmizers sawdust conveyor as seen here:



  

Because of my blade clearance, I couldn't build a conveyor exactly like their's however the principle would be the same. I've been known to over think things in the past. That's why I'm looking for experienced advice prior to spending cash on this topic.

What do you guys think? Would it be worth the effort or should I go another route? Thanks guys!

-lee
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

410 Deere, 240 Massey... I really need a rough terrain forklift :)

Sawing Since 1-19-2013 @ 3:30 pm
Serving Since 2002
"Some police officers give tickets, some gave all."

lyle niemi

Dad had asawdust chain on his mill for 30 plus years and had very little problems with it. A fella I know has a conveyor for his sawdust and has problems with sawdust sticking in the winter.

SPD748

Thanks for the input Lyle. I have all the parts to install a drag chain. I know they are pretty much problem free. I may just go the chain route and be done with it. I was thinking that a conveyor would remove more of the dust/chips than a chain thus reducing the amount of manual cleaning required at the end of the day. At this point, its just a thought  :)

-lee
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

410 Deere, 240 Massey... I really need a rough terrain forklift :)

Sawing Since 1-19-2013 @ 3:30 pm
Serving Since 2002
"Some police officers give tickets, some gave all."

steamsawyer

Here is what I did.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_aBCr-yx4hQ&list=UU7d1hrrieYmf1HNx6ypOVpg&index=7&feature=plcp

This has been working all right but it needs some refinment. It will work better when I lengthen the chain and make it run deeper under the saw. Like it is, the sides of the hole are not steep enough and the sawdust banks up under the blade. The chain pulleys are wheel barrow wheel rims and they function good for idlers. The trough allows the chain to carry the sawdust up to a pile or wagon to be hauled away. I like the idea of a seperate power source for the chain so it can keep running when the rest of the mill is not running, that way you can safely clean out the sawdust. If you run the chain back over the blade you have to run it through a trough so it can't fall on the blade if the chain breaks. Also you need a guide under the blade to keep a stick or small piece of bark from tripping the slack chain from kicking up into the blade from underneath.

Check out the rest of my videos... if you want to see some steam powered circle jerk'n.

Alan

J. A. Vance circular sawmill, 52" blade, powered by a 70 HP 9 1/2 x 10 James Leffel portable steam engine.

Inside this tired old mans body is just a little boy that wants to go out and play.

Great minds think alike.....  Does your butt itch too?

Alan Rudd
Steam Punk Extraordinaire.

Ron Wenrich

I've been around several methods.  We use a vibrating table to a dust blower.  The blower goes directly to a trailer, and we do a couple of trailerloads a week.  I don't think you're at that kind of production level, so I wouldn't suggest the expense that is involved in that set up.  Although, we do get $450/trailerload. 

I worked at another operation that took things out by a conveyor type system, then moved it by a paddle chain to a building.  There were doors on the bottom that could load farmer's dump trucks.  They took it for free, and there were major problems of bridging and what do you do when its full?  It was a failed system in my opinion.

I've also seen barn cleaners used. 

The best system I have seen for small operations is a simple drag chain.  I believe Lyle has one that comes in over top the saw, then down the side to underneath the saw.  I had a system just like that.  I've seen many that don't come over top, but the chains sometimes get tangled when the pile gets high.  A drag chain is inexpensive, low tech for maintenance, and is normally unaffected by chunks of bark.

I had one system I made that ran lengthwise under the mill and out the back.  Simply transferred to another chain and out to a pole.  It worked just as well and only needed a small amount of clearance under the saw.  I even impressed myself that it worked.

All the drag parts I used came from old corn pickers.  There might not be too many of those around.
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

bandmiller2

Lee, I've always used conveyers. Blowers pull alot of HP right off the top.Conveyers and drags are quite forgiving and build their own trough.I've always used firehose because thats what I've had,chain with paddles would probibly be better.Best if you have electrical service in the mill a 3/4 hp motor will do the trick of course a small hydraulic motor will to.Saws tend to drive the sawdust down tangent and slightly back to the offbearers end.A drag anywhere near will form a trough, and then will pull the dust out. Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

SPD748

Thanks for the information and video guys! I agree that the chain method is by far the most low tech and low maintenance method. If I go that route, I have a question: My mill will be set on a concrete pad i.e. no trough. The blade will clear the concrete by 7 1/2" to 8" at it's lowest point. Most chain systems that I've seen, including the video above, run the chain ahead of the saws lowest point what appears to be about 12". If I set my chain at that location, there will be ~18" clearance from the concrete to the blade. The issue is, there won't be a trough. Will the chain system still work? I would have to adjust the tension on the chain so that it doesn't drag along the concrete. Maybe a 1/2" to 1" clearance would prevent contact thus prevent premature wear on the chain.

Thoughts?

-lee
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

410 Deere, 240 Massey... I really need a rough terrain forklift :)

Sawing Since 1-19-2013 @ 3:30 pm
Serving Since 2002
"Some police officers give tickets, some gave all."

Ron Wenrich

You don't need 18" of clearance.  There are a couple of ways of handling this.

If you bring your chain over the top of the mill and down the husk side of the saw, you will only need a few inches of clearance.  You're only running one chain vs two.

If you need to keep your chain low for a distance, you can put in another idler pulley out from the mill.  The dust will still form a trough.  You can also put walls up to keep the sawdust in a contained area.  I did this on one mill and it worked fine.  That's the one that went lengthwise with the mill.

Instead of running the chain directly under the saw, you could offset it to get more clearance.  But, you would have to put a baffle under your saw to direct the dust towards the chain.  My mill runs like that to prevent blowback from the saw.  The dust will easily fall onto the chain. 

Dragging on the concrete will not be a problem.  There will always be some dust underneath the chain that would prove to be a cushion. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

SPD748

Thanks Ron,

Quote from: Ron Wenrich on June 23, 2012, 10:17:02 AM
Instead of running the chain directly under the saw, you could offset it to get more clearance.  But, you would have to put a baffle under your saw to direct the dust towards the chain.  My mill runs like that to prevent blowback from the saw.  The dust will easily fall onto the chain. 

Are you saying to offset the chain towards the leading or trailing edge of the saw? Is there any way you could post a picture of your setup? Thanks!

-lee
Frick 0 Handset - A continuing project dedicated to my Dad.

410 Deere, 240 Massey... I really need a rough terrain forklift :)

Sawing Since 1-19-2013 @ 3:30 pm
Serving Since 2002
"Some police officers give tickets, some gave all."

Ron Wenrich

I don't have a picture, just saying you could do it that way.  That's where steamsawyer has his.  Although, you don't have to run it quite that fast.  When I run a chain on a hand mill, I took it out to a pole that was about 15' high.  You can put lots of dust there.

My operations are for an automatic mill, and we use a vibrating conveyor that takes all out waste from the mill.  Sawdust gets separated out and blown into a trailer, and the slabs and edging strips go to a chipper. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

dblair

 

  I did a screw conveyor after just blowing it out 

 
the pit is about 3ft deep at the deep end .
old Appomattox Iron Works circle mill.

thurlow

Pictures of my drag chain;  it started life as a first-step feed conveyor in a dairy operation.........moving silage towards the feed trough.  The end is 'flared' and sits in a pit underneath the blade.........slightly off-set towards the feed side.  The pit's been there since I first installed the mill;  for several years, we'd have to stop the blade after every log and move the sawdust with a corn scoop........dragging/throwing it out to where we could get it with a front-end loader on a tractor or backhoe every day or so.  I apologize for the pictures;  the mill hasn't been run in about 18 months and there are weeds, briars, dust, leaves, etc everywhere.  The drag chain catches NEARLY all the dust;  about once a week, it'll build up under the carriage drive belt(s) and it takes about 5 minutes to shovel it clean.  The 'flare' could easily be made out of plywood.  I already had electricty at the mill;  the drag chain is powered by a half-horse 110v motor. 



 



 



 



 

log skids



 



 

outfeed;  slabs go thru 'window' to be moved with forks on fel;  lumber is stacked to the left....out of picture



 



 

Kentucky coffee tree log on carriage



 
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