Lubricating oil question

[Tom]

When I was a boy, the finest oil was 3in1.  Grandmom used it on the sewing machine. Granddaddy used it on the guns.  I used it on my bike.  It was the WD40 of the day.  I have noticed that much of the conversation attributed to our sponsor's product, Rust Reaper, has to do with it's lubrication ability.  WD40 isn't much on lubrication.

I bought some 3in1 to use on my hair clippers the other day and realized that I never see any advertising for it nor do I hear of anyone buying it. The cans on the shelf in the store were dusty, as if they hadn't been touched in years.

I put it on my hair clippers and was very satisfied with the way it quieted them down.  They even cut better. ;D

I also saw some cans of Marvel Mystery Oil.   We used to use that for everything.  Poured it in the carb.  Poured it in the crank case.  poured it into the gas tank.  Used it for light lubing and it smelled good too.

The Marvel Mystery Oil on the shelf was in the same fix ???

Are these products popular anywhere anymore?

[Jeff]

Rust Reaper can replace them all. Order some Tom, you'll be impressed.

[Fla._Deadheader]

  Yer old school, Dude :D :D :D :D :D

  The younger folks have to be told what to use, and it HAS to be "high Tech".  Go to a parts house and ask for the stuff you mentioned.   HUH??? Never heard of that : : : ;D

[DanG]

I keep a can of 3in1 handy, and I use it all the time. My Dad and Granddad used to run a whole string of commercial sewing machines in a canvas shop, and that's all they ever used. Speaks well of the stuff that they can still stay in business with no advertising.

BTW, I got my RustReaper kit late this afternoon.  Neat looking applicators! Betcha that's gonna be some handy stuff. Thanks again, Mike and Jeff! 8) 8)

[woodman]

                 I use 3 in 1 all the time for all lite oiling uses

[ADfields]

I use 3in1 also, it's great stuff but I have not found it in a can in some time.   It's always in a little plastic bottle now days when I buy it.
Andy

[EZ]

I've used 3 in 1 which work ok for what I used it for. 3 in1 doesnt creap in places like Rust Reaper. One little drop of Reaper and the job is done. Like Jeff said, order some, you will be amazed. I use it 2 or 3 times a week on different things and each time I use it still amazes me. I put some on my Carheart coat zipper yesterday, no mess, and the zipper works better than it did when the coat was new.
EZ

[Norm]

I use 3in1 at work too. A couple of weeks ago I was trying to get just a drop on a VCR assembly. Got one drop and then some more where I didn't need it. Spent a half an hour cleaning up the overflow. Went to Mike's webpage (rust reaper) and thought those pin point applicators look like just what I need. Ordered off the web site and had it in two days. When I got it in is was impressed with how well packaged and the thought that went into the applicators for it. But not only that it had a big refill bottle. The pin point applicators work great and the product does everything that 3in1 did but better. I'm one happy camper.

[breederman]

I just used up a can of 3 in one one a record turn table trying to bring it back to life.All the testemonials have got me thinking to try some rust reaper real soon!

[Fla._Deadheader]

Loosened up the balance wheel on my alarm clock ;D ;D

[EZ]

Whats an alarm clock. ;D
EZ

[Fla._Deadheader]

I don't usually use the clock, but, occasionally we have to leave early in the morning, and 4 AM comes a little early : ;D

[DanG]

I thought you just used it to know when it's time to let Ed come up for air. : :D

[VA-Sawyer]

If that was all he used it for I don't think he would have bothered to fix it. Harold isn't one to squander time or money. Don't you know ?  :D
VA-Sawyer

[Fla._Deadheader]

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

[Duane_Moore]

Fla_Deadheader.  did ya ever get an underwater chainsaw? :D :D :D Duh---Duane

[Fla._Deadheader]

No chainsaw yet.  Shop is so full of boards, we got no place to "speriment".  Gonna hafta move to a bigger place, somehow???

[SwampDonkey]

We all used Singer Sewing machine oil here. I can't find it any longer though. It had a tiny spout, a little bigger than pin hole sized. But I don't think the applicator for Singer worked as good as Rust Reeper, as indicated by folks here. I'll have to order some myself. Good to have on hand for the motor on the furnace. My clock movement doesn't call for any oil and its housed in a dust free veneer case. Sometimes oil gums up a movement because it collects dust and it will have to be cleaned. But, that could be from over application too. I know there are some grandfather/grandmother clock movements that take a very fine, light oil from a pin-hole sized applicator. Just a tiny drop is all.

[Mike_P.]

Tom:

This is an interesting thread.  I haven't used 3-in-1 oil for a long time, so I took a look at their MSDS.  (They're part of WD-40, btw.)  The 3-in-1 Multipurpose oil is >97% oil "severely hydrotreated heavy napthenic oil" with the balance being other un-named ingredients-pretty much straight oil.  They note that the product has a slight citronella odor (I have no idea what that does.???)  The MSDS didn't indicate the viscosity, but as I recall, it is fairly light-perhaps around 5 weight maybe heavier.  It is all organic with no synthetics.  This would be an adequate lubricant in particular applications.

You should have better penetration and more lubricity and film strength with Rust Reaper because of the inclusion of synthetic esters and molybdenum friction modifiers.  Some of the products that we use in our lubricant are additives that go into some motor oils.  Rust Reaper should yield better, with less product doing more work.  Either of our precision applicators, which use a .012"ID tube, control are designed to allow you to put on a very small amount.

I've never used Marvel Mystery oil.  I understand that it includes oil of wintergreen, which we use also and I think it also contains some lighter, more aromatic solvents.  I would think that it is more of a penetrating additive than a lubricant.

There are a ton of oils, lubricating penetrating and whatever, out in the marketplace.  I think that a seller is faced with constantly reintroducing their product to the market.  Both of the products that you mentioned are great examples.  They've been around for a long time, but with new competitors (sometimes better), new technology (different bearings, new engines, etc.), and new generations of buyers, new channels to market (e.g., Walmart) they don't enjoy the popularity that they once did.  These are also highly fractionalized markets with different products being used in different niches.  I continue to run across penetrating and multi purpose oils that I've never heard of.  

On the other hand WD-40, which is not a lubricant and not, I submit, the best penetrant, enjoys a great mass market share through aggressive, effective marketing.  It's clear here that the marketing is better than the product.

This is sort of a long reply, and, I hope, not too windy.  Issues of lubricant marketing, what succeeds and what doesn't are near and dear to my heart.  As you might imagine  :D

Thanks,

Mike

[Tom]

Well you are a member as well as a sponsor and I enjoy a long winded dissertation by someone who knows what they are talking about. :D

I will probably always have a can of 3 in 1 oil and Marvel Mystery oil around if for no other reason than to have something familiar on the shelf. :D  Must be old age creeping up on me.

I know that Rust Reaper must be a good product with the accolades provided by Forum members.  I'll have to try it one day too.

While light lubricants and penetrating oils are valuable to me, I find that my use of aerosol lithium grease is handier, quicker, and more prone to being used than a grease gun on many of my sawmill systems where plate rubs on plate.  I wish that an applicator could lay it down in thicker layers.  

The biggest problem with grease around a sawmill is that the sawdust soaks it up and applications don't last long enough. A lubricant would either have to be dry or easily applied so that the surfaces would be treated.  I don't think I'm alone when I say that I would rather saw wood than mechanic.  I definitely shy away from preventive maintenance that eats into my sawing day. Lubrication is one of those things that I have to make myself do.  It's frustrating when the sawdust undoes a lube job in 30 minutes or an hour and you need to get out the grease gun again.  Spray grease is a God-send. ;D

[DanG]

Tom, ya ever try sprayin' a little WD40 on that dried up Lithium?  Makes it slicker than ever! 8)  I only spray the sliding parts of my mill with Lithium occasionally, then just loosen it up with WD every day.

Mike, you're right about WD not being a great lubricant. If I understand correctly, it wasn't designed to be, but was/is just advertised as such. :  It has a lot of other uses for the creative mind, though. It really takes pine tar off about as well as anything I've tried, and does pretty well at preventing surface rust, too.  But it couldn't loosen the balky spring connection on my cross-feed disconnect!  RustReaper did! 8)

[Tom]

DanG, The wd might loosen up the lithium if the lithium were still there but the sawdust takes it away.  Especially on the clamp mechanisms, which are right under and behind the log.

[Mike_P.]

Tom, DanG:

Would Rust Reaper work in place of the spray lithium grease?  I'm speculating in ignorance of the specific application, but in some ways the principle is the same between the two products, in that you are using a mixture to deliver a lubricant.  

The lubricating agent in grease is an oil that is suspended in a soap.  (Lithium based in this case).  The oil is released from the soap to provide ongoing lubrication.  It sounds as if the grease is being removed before it has a chance to give up its' oil.

With Rust Reaper, we have blended a variety of lubricant additives with two different solvents with varying evaporation rates and characteristics.  The solvents help with cleaning, penetration and "wetting" of the lubricant.  As they evaporate, the residual (oils, esters, moly, anti-rust, surfactants, etc.) is left to lubricate.  As you continue to apply Rust Reaper, you will get a microscopic build up of moly (friction modifier) on metal sliding surfaces which would act as a "dry" lubricant.

I've seen lubricant formulations similar to Rust Reaper used successfully to lubricate slides and chains in very dirty applications.  But, you need to deliver it to the friction point and need to reapply it depending on the severity of the work involved (heat, friction, etc.)

It might be worth a try.  Please let me know what you think.

Thanks,

Mike

P.S.  DanG, I'm glad to hear that Rust Reaper worked where WD-40 did not.  Thanks for the feedback.

[redpowerd]

a few years ago my grandfather dropped of a new 55 gallon drum of 3+1 he got cheap at an auction. i just pump it into a gas can to keep in the shop. i keep it in windex spray bottles, its handy cause you can select the stream. i have these bottles everywhere, tractors, barn, siloroom, you name it. practically trippin over them. i also got some plain plant sprayers from wallyworld and filled em up and gave em away to everyone for christmas ;D
 i stopped buying wd40 when it stopped starting my tractors, they musthave changed the formula, cause i used it in place of either for years, then it just stopped working.

[Blue9R]

Mike P - Thanks for the info on Rust Reaper. I'll have to place an order & make room on the shelf over my work bench!

For what it's worth, here are some points of interest about WD-40:

Rumor is that the formulation is primarily butyl carbitol, kerosene and a light mineral oil.  The butyl carbitol (glycol ether) is a solvent & water displacer and gives WD-40 it's pleasant odor.

In the past, WD-40 could substitute as a tractor starter because the aerosol propellant was very volatile, similar to propane.

WD-40 is sprayed on fishing lures due to the butyl carbitol or an amine component actually being a fish attractant.  It is now illegal in some states, primarily because the mineral oil leaves an "oil slick"on the water.