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Advice on Filling Large Voids in ERC

Started by WDH, April 01, 2012, 08:50:35 AM

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WDH

I have a 4" thick cedar beam that I want to make a mantle out of.  There is some doty/pecky rot and some bark inclusions.  The inclusions are less problematic, but I am at a loss on how to attack the deep wide voids in a way that blends in with the rest of the good wood.  Here is a pic of the bark inclusion and a couple of the large nasty voids.



 



 



 

Has anyone dealt with a situation like this?  Glue and sawdust will not work in this case.
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Larry

I've never been able to make holes like that blend in so I make them stand out.  Used bondo, tinted fiberglass or epoxy.  I might try a test on a piece of scrap to see how clear fiberglass would look.

Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

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Woodwalker

You could cut and insert a plug, but that may stand out too much. I've used a two part wood repair epoxy  and mixed sanding dust with it to get the color.
At an arts and craft show I saw some cedar end tables that had the voids had been filled with what looked like turquoise colored  pebbles and finished with and acrylic epoxy.   
Just cause your head's pointed, don't mean you are sharp.

Axe Handle Hound

+1 for the epoxy, but I'm with Woodwalker on the idea of using something interesting in the void in addition to the epoxy.  I keep a bag of small stones and bits of broken glass chips that I've picked up from the shore of Lake Superior for that purpose.  I've seen other people use everything from small photos, to bullet casings, coins, etc. 

shelbycharger400

im with the above
not much you can do to match the color of red cedar, stains are not even close either.   carve it out/grind it out.    put an inlay in their or use the rocks and stones/ epoxy fill .

tomb

Take a look at a product called Inlace.  It is a two part mix that fills voids, made to stand out.  They have some that look like torquoise, granite, and then you can customize your own with colors and stone flakes.  Works well! 8)
Tom

T Welsh

WDH,The only way to go as I see it is to live with it! I hate rot in my projects,but sometimes you can keep the character and solve the problem of rot by hitting the rot area with crazy glue and let it saturate in. it will solidify the area,then fill in with clear epoxy until level with the surface. then finish it. it will be a tranparent fill in when done. Tim

shelbycharger400

inlaceĀ© brand....   i forgot about mica pearl and powder!
greatlakesskipperĀ© is where i bought poly flake before.  good stuff , cheap too

WDH

The inlace is pricy.  I think that I will go with Bondo and see how it turns out.  I have nothing to lose  :).  If the customer does not like it, then I will do something else with it.  Thanks for the thoughts.
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

shelbycharger400

dont fret!!
look up mica powder  on ebay,  one ounce is 7 bux,    you dont need to fill the cavity completely with color.  just fill the hole with epoxy, leaving enough to fill.
pearl shimmers are a different story.     pearl powders you can pour in very small amounts if mixed in automotive clears.  less than 1/8 thick.  it would be better to mix in epoxys .

metalspinner

W,
I have used epoxy with a black dye to fill cracks in walnut.  It makes a nice contrast and provides some strength to the voids. I'll bet it would look beautiful with the red cedar.

Woodcraft sells dyes that are compatable with the epoxy.
I do what the little voices in my wife's head tell me to do.

Clam77

That's some nice looking wood - hope you find a way to keep it useable..   
Andy

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WDH

For the record, I have decided to go with pink bondo  :).  I have purchased the bondo, but I have not tried it yet.  I will keep y'all posted.
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Dan_Shade

are you going to test it on a scrap first?  the bondo may look really funky under a finish
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lots of dull bands and chains

There's a fine line between turning firewood into beautiful things and beautiful things into firewood.

WDH

Yes.  The piece is 9' long and the finished mantle will be 6' so I will test an area first.  If that does not look good, the fall back plan is to take a nice 6' cedar board, rip it into two pieces, plane them down to 3/8", glue them on the top and bottom like bread in a thick sandwich, and add a similar piece to the front edge.  Basically, wrap the top, bottom, and front edge with matching wood and re-constitute the mantle as long as the ends of the mantle that show the end grain look OK.  So, if the pink bondo does not look good, the fall-back plan will not be compromised.  The fall back-fall back plan is to abort. 
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

POSTON WIDEHEAD

This is my Red Oak Mantle over my fireplace. It is wrapped. 12 years ago I did not have a mill. I was given an old piece of Red Oak for a mantle that looked like junk....but it was free. I wrapped it in Red Oak boards and put wooden pegs in it. I put a 45 degree angle on the the corners when putting it together and now it looks like one big slab. It has got a lot of compliments and the wrapping solved an ugly problem.




  

 
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

beenthere

My cherry mantle has a large crack in the up side that isn't noticeable (unless I stand on the hearth and move a few items on display). Also has a void that is filled with epoxy. The leading edge and the overhang are clear.


 
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

WDH

BT,

The leading edge and a small portion of the overhang is all that you see anyway in most mantles.  An AXE sure would look nice hanging over that cherry mantle  :).

David,

Your mantle looks great, and I like the pegs.  My fall-back plan is the same as yours except that I was not planning to wrap the ends, but that remains to be determined based on the bondo experiment.  Although we have three cats, I do not plan to stuff any of the cats and put them on the mantle.  I also have some extra Garlon 4 herbicide if you can't get that Andropogon virginicus (broomsedge) under control, but I bet that RoundUp will work, too  ::).



Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Tree Feller

I use West System epoxy colored with lampblack to fill voids like those in the ERC pics you posted. That's a pretty common defect with ERC in my experience.

Usually, I have to use two applications as the first one will eventually sink in and still leave a void. That's okay, though, because the epoxy-filled area is then stronger than the wood was before filling.
Cody

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hackberry jake

Wdh, is cedar scarce out your way? I can send you another stick free of voids if you pay shipping
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WDH

No, it is not scarce, but good forest grown trees are hard to find.  Most of what I see is yard trees and fence row trees.  Thanks for the offer!
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

shelbycharger400

https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,56856.msg825537.html#msg825537

not scarce for me . Soon tho,  other than that, i come across cedar logs once and a while.  Lots of cedar in MN .

WDH

OK, here is how I dealt with the problem.  I planed the beam down to 3 1/4" and added a new top layer by glueing up two 3/4" boards.  Then I added a new 4" front to match the new top. 

I tried the pink bondo, but it did not look good, so I decided against trying to fill the voids.  I have way more in this than I estimated for the guy that I am building it for, so I will not come out good.  However, my pride of workmanship overrode that fact that I spent way more time on it than I intended.  In my opinion, it turned out nice.



 



 



 
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Magicman

 :D  That is taking "boxing the heart" to a new level.   smiley_thumbsup
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POSTON WIDEHEAD

Wow Danny....the extra time that you did not intend to spend on this project sure paid off.

Personally, I think you are a MASTER CRAFTSMAN and just don't like to brag.  :)

Great job!
The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

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