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Questions for Wood-Mizer owners.

Started by Ga Mtn Man, February 22, 2012, 10:15:30 AM

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Ga Mtn Man

I'm still going through the process of choosing a mill to purchase.

Does the extra 8" of throat opening on the TK mill vs. the WM really matter in the real world of sawing?

Are you happy with the claw turner/two-plane clamp set up or do you secretly wish you had a bi-directional chain turner?


If you'd prefer to remain anonymous, please PM me.  I won't tell a soul.  ;)  ;D   

"If the women don't find you handsome they should at least find you handy." - Red Green


2012 LT40HDG29 with "Superized" hydraulics,  2 LogRite cant hooks, home-built log arch.

terrifictimbersllc

I have 28" theoretical on the LT-40.  Effective more like 25" because of clearance/log position issues as the head travels the whole length of log. Especially vertical clearance.  I love my LT-40. And I'm not saying I'd get a different mill (well, really I already have).  And it's a totally hypothetical and possibly ridiculous statement:  But I'd easily pay $5000 or maybe more if a "10" throat clearance upgrade" was offered for my mill.   
DJ Hoover, Terrific Timbers LLC,  Mystic CT Woodmizer Million Board Foot Club member. 2019 LT70 Super Wide 55 Yanmar,  LogRite fetching arch, WM BMS250 sharpener/BMT250 setter.  2001 F350 7.3L PSD 6 spd manual ZF 4x4 Crew Cab Long Bed

ladylake

 I ran a log that measured 36"  X  46" log  through my brothers TK 2000 last Sat thanks to the 16" throat above the blade.  One of the main reasons I own a TK is the chain turner.     Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Ga Mtn Man

Hey Steve,

Thanks for spending so much time on the phone with me the other day.  Your opinions are much appreciated.   TK advertises "cut right through the center of a 33" log".  From a practical stand point, what do you think the max cut width is on a 2000?
"If the women don't find you handsome they should at least find you handy." - Red Green


2012 LT40HDG29 with "Superized" hydraulics,  2 LogRite cant hooks, home-built log arch.

Ga Mtn Man

Quote from: terrifictimbersllc on February 22, 2012, 10:32:10 AM
I have 28" theoretical on the LT-40.  Effective more like 25" because of clearance/log position issues as the head travels the whole length of log. Especially vertical clearance.  I love my LT-40. And I'm not saying I'd get a different mill (well, really I already have).  And it's a totally hypothetical and possibly ridiculous statement:  But I'd easily pay $5000 or maybe more if a "10" throat clearance upgrade" was offered for my mill.

So the difference between the two mills theoretical capacity is more like 5"?
"If the women don't find you handsome they should at least find you handy." - Red Green


2012 LT40HDG29 with "Superized" hydraulics,  2 LogRite cant hooks, home-built log arch.

pineywoods

Lt40 manual with home-made hydraulics

Throat clearance.. seldom any problem. Any log thats that big, log handling is the real problem..

cantilever head problems...an old wife's tale. works good and has some advantages over a 4 post head, especially when sawing large knotty limby logs.

Claw turner with 2 plane clamp....         a real design master piece that you won't appreciate until you watch a sawyer that knows how to use it. The clamp in particular is useful for a lot of things besides clamping a log.

Now my mill has a bunch of home-made changes and add-ons, which would lead one to believe I found ways to improve an lt40. Not true. Every time I thought I could improve something, turns out the Indy boys had already been there. I bought a used manual mill at a good price and made my own "add-ons" because I have the means to do so but not the finances to trade up...One exception, I converted the woodmizer single tooth setter to dual tooth, cheap and works good.

To top it off, it's been said on here many times, but I'll say again, woodmizer customer service is as good as it gets..

1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

ladylake

Paul     It would cut thruogh the center of a 33" log if the log was positioned perfect, I'd feel a lot more comfortable with a 30" log with some leeway between the guides and the log.  I get more and more people looking for wide natural edge slabs for bar tops, table  etc so the 33"  between the guide rollers is nice.  My B20 only has 24" between the rollers so I end up using my brothers TK 2000 for the big ones.    Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Bibbyman

Many times you can place an odd feature on the "open" side of the Wood-Mizer mill and in this way work down quite large logs.  Every Wood-Mizer owner has sawn logs way larger than the mill is expected to do.

Way far more advantages to the cantilever head than any faults competing mill manufactures have manufactured.

Best advice I can give is to saw on or at least watch both mills saw a verity of logs.  And look over both mills with a critical eye to construction, quality and functionality.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDE25 Super 25hp 3ph with Command Control and Accuset.
Sawing since '94

ladylake

With the huge throat area on the TK2000 it kinda take away WM open side advantage and yes the WM 40 had a advantage over my B20 dealing with large logs. After having a couple different WM operators  with a lot of experiance saw for me run thier claw turner I knew I wanted a chain turner, claw turners work good untill the knotty snarly logs show up.  Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

boman1

Ive cut almost a million bdft on my LT40 Super...wouldn't change brands at this point!

Bibbyman

We've been running LT40 mills since '94 and I figure we've sawn over 3,000,000 bf by now on the three LT40s we've had.  While I've never sawn on a mill with a chain turner,  I've not felt the least bit hampered with the claw turner.  The two-plane clamp is worth its weight in gold.  I thought someday of making a video of all the ways it can be used.  I use it a lot for flipping cants – and a hundred other uses.

Wood-Mizer has the chain turner on the LT50 and LT70 for those that just have to have one.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDE25 Super 25hp 3ph with Command Control and Accuset.
Sawing since '94

POSTON WIDEHEAD

It all depends on what business you plan on being in. I have the LT40HD. 98% of my sawing is barn siding.
My boards are usually no wider than 12". I have sawn a good bit of 18" but the customer brought his own logs.
I saw lots and lots of 2 x 4's, 4 x4's and 6 x 6's for barns.

I also do a good bit of quarter sawing on Red and White Oak for wood workers.
Lots of Red Cedar for outdoor furniture makers.

Long story short.....I've never needed a wider throat unless I'm eating BBQ Ribs!  :D

The LT40HD fits me like a glove.

The older I get I wish my body could Re-Gen.

Kansas

The chain turner is definitely better on the LT70 than the claw turner. That being said, an experienced sawyer can turn just about anything with the claw turner using the two plane clamp assisting as needed. We certainly did on the LT 40.

The biggest mistake I ever made purchasing equipment was buying a custom built 4 post mill to cut bigger log. (Not Timberking) Yes, we can cut a 36" right down the center. Makes it nice for quartersawing lumber. We quarter the logs... and take them to the Woodmizer to finish the job. It also has a bi directional turner, poorly designed. You really should take a look at what your logs supply is going to be. If you aren't going to be cutting, or need to cut, really big logs, take that into consideration. Unless you are quartersawing all the time on big logs, I think you can cut a good sized log on the 40. The number one reason the Timberking has to have a wider stance is that unlike a monorail like the Woodmizer, you have to have something wide enough to fit the log between the 4 posts. I am absolutely not knocking Timberking. Haven't been around them much. And if for some reason you are going to have to split down the middle very large logs on a regular basis, it might be the saw. But my guess is you can cut just as big of log on the 40 (or 70), or bigger. Most of the time you are flat sawing anyway.

What kind of sawing do you plan on doing, and what will be the average size of the logs? That is the number one question.

cypresskayaksllc

I like the claw and the 2plane. Too much. Sometimes when I get a real gnarly log or a cant thats in a bad spot Ill spend way too long trying to finess it with the claw/clamp combo. I could just take the cant hook over and do it the manual way a lot quicker. But the challenge is good.
LT40HDDR, JD950FEL, Weimaraner

Brucer

For my bread-and-butter work, the claw turner does the job -- it'll turn the logs 90 degrees in one cycle. For bigger stuff a chain turner would be nice. I can "fine-tune" the turning -- backward or forward -- by putting the clamp under the log, lifting it a touch, and moving the clamp in or out. I use the clamp exclusively to turn cants (forward or back).

The throat opening on an LT40 is 28", but 4" of that is beyond the side stops so you only get 24" of useful opening. However, lots of us have found you can "cheat" by using various means to shift a log beyond the side stops. Some of us do it safely and some not-so-safely.

My WM has an effective cutting depth of 14" without the dragback. I once cut some FOHC 14"x21" cants to prove it. The dragback uses up just over 2" of that cutting depth but I rarely miss having it.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

medic

The only thing I could add is consider how often you would max out the log capacity on either mill.  I love my TK mill but the couple of extra inches that I gained in the cutthroat over a similar sized WM is not why I bought the TK.  I'm currently running a TK1400 and most of the stuff that I saw is in the the 18-24" range.  If you remove the throat capacity from the equation, it comes down to which mill do you prefer to run.    So unless you think you're going to be regularly cutting stuff that will max out the cutthroat it's not an issue.  (although if you're going to max out the cut on a 2000 on a regular basis maybe you should be looking at a swinger with a slabber attachment instead of a bandmill......oh no, now I've started the band vs swinger discussion again  :) ......)
Good luck
scott
Retired Paramedic, TimberKing 1400, Logrite cant hooks, old MacCullough chain saws.  Too many projects not enough hours in the day.

paul case

The reasons that a fella would buy a mill seem to change for some of us after we have sawn a year or 2.
I bought a EZboardwalk mdl 40 3½ years ago and It is a great mill. My reasons were I wanted to build a house and the framing lumber would cost more than the mill. Ez boardwalk mill has a 36'' max width cut and a bigger motor than many of the manual mills at a much cheaper price. The EZ is a great mill and it cut out my house fine and I have been sawing for a couple markets and custom sawing with it ever since. It has yet to make me less than its purchase price in profits every year. However my body has been giving me some feedback on maual log turning, and I found a great deal on a LT40hd local. Most of my logs are within the capacities of the LT40 anyway and my body is giving me a lot less lip about the work.
I know this thread is about cutting width capacities, but that kinda evolves as you saw for others. My sawing business sees a lot of all kinds of logs, big small crooked, live edge slabing, and who knows what. I am getting to the point that if I sell the EZ mill I would send those biguns to a neighbor of mine that has a ez boardwalk.
May I recomend that if you are looking to buy a mill and you are new to milling look at the used mills available. I didn't know where to look when I bought the ez boardwalk and if I had found as good a deal as I got on the LT40 I could have skipped a step. Certianly no love lost for me. I have enjoyed learning and sawing  and still am. PC
life is too short to be too serious. (some idiot)
2013 LT40SHE25 and Riehl edger,  WM 94 LT40 hd E15. Cut my sawing ''teeth'' on an EZ Boardwalk
sawing oak.hickory,ERC,walnut and almost anything else that shows up.
Don't get phylosophical with me. you will loose me for sure.
pc

stumpy

I've had a 4 post mill and now own a Woodmizer.  Both designs are good.  I prefer the Woodmizer design(aside from it's superior quality) mainly because of the design.  In my opinion it's not only more ergonomic, but it comes in handy when you get an odd shaped log. The cantilever design gives more flexibility. As for the width of cut, I've been sawing for others for about 8 years and I can't remember more than about 5 or 6 times where I lost a job cause I couldn't saw wide enough.
Ironically, I make custom woodwork out of slabs and often wish I had a slabber.  That being said, in most cases a project that requires wide material is usually better off being glued up as wide boards have a tendency to warp and split. I'm sure I've said some things here that others would disagree with, but these are my experience and it serves as food for thought in your comparisons.
Woodmizer LT30, NHL785 skidsteer, IH 444 tractor

Chuck White

I don't feel hampered with my Wood-Mizer.

I've gone out on jobs where there were a few logs in the pile that might test the ability of the mill, and myself.

Give it a little thought and like has already been said a couple of times, many times on the Wood-Mizer we're able to shift the odd shape to the outside and then start cutting.

After making a couple of cuts, turn the odd shape up (turned 90°) and cut it off, then continue cutting as usual.

The biggest log I've sawn to this point without having to take a slab off with the chainsaw was a 42 inch Hard Maple.
~Chuck~  Cooks Cat Claw sharpener and single tooth setter.  2018 Chevy Silverado and 2021 Subaru Ascent.
With basic mechanical skills and the ability to read you can maintain a Woodmizer  LT40!

Brucer

Paul makes a good point about your needs changing over time. A lot of us started off with a plan but found that reality, time, and opportunities led us in a different direction.

You can beat yourself to death trying to find the "perfect mill". You'll probably never find it, and if you do it may not be "perfect" next year.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

Larry

Quote from: Brucer on February 25, 2012, 07:32:49 PM
You can beat yourself to death trying to find the "perfect mill". You'll probably never find it, and if you do it may not be "perfect" next year.


I don't know about that.  My TK-2000 is quite near the perfect mill.  Lets see, I'm on modification number 84 since I got it less than two years ago. :D :D :D  Worked on mod number 85 today, installing a electric lube cutoff control. ;D
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

ladylake

 Sure your telling the thruth Larry, after running my brothers 2000 I cant think of more than 4 or 5 things I might modd.  TK did a good job on that mill.  Steve
Timberking B20  18000  hours +  Case75xt grapple + forks+8" snow bucket + dirt bucket   770 Oliver   Lots(too many) of chainsaws, Like the Echo saws and the Stihl and Husky     W5  Case loader   1  trailers  Wright sharpener     Suffolk  setter Volvo MCT125c skid loader

Brucer

Winston Ledet, formerly the manager of chemical plant maintenance at DuPont, once told me that you cannot find an off-the shelf piece of equipment that is perfect for your application. Anything that is "manufactured" is a compromise intended to "satisfy" most customers.

I wasn't sure about that statement, but I started looking closely at the equipment that was bought for the various plants in my own company. Winston was right. Every operation, every application is unique. The manufactured stuff might be close but we can always improve it to suit our special needs. The better run plants in my employer's operation were the ones where a plant engineer wasn't afraid to modify purchased equipment. The best run plant was the one where the manager allowed the operators and maintenance crew specify the modifications.
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

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