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Tree dbh

Started by Michigan, January 03, 2004, 09:04:57 AM

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Michigan

 Would like to know your thoughts on how to mark a reference point for a tree's dbh. Would like something that would last as long as possible. Thought of paint, nail, and ribbon. Paint would last for? Ribbon would have to be replaced yearly? Nail if aluminum damage to value of tree? Any thoughts on how its done, thanks much

                                                                Dan

Texas Ranger

You got most of 'em.  You can scribe the bark, NOT into the cambium, but just in the corticle tissue and it will last for years.  Bark scribes available through the forestry supply houses.  But the height stays the same, just make sure you use a standard 4 and half foot height.
The Ranger, home of Texas Forestry

Stephen_Wiley

Dan,
 
Welcome to the forum,  many of us lingered before posting.  Found this place to be like family, full of lots of information, humor and caring.

As Don has already mentioned dbh is measured consistently at four and half feet from ground level ( because fluctuation in ground level can be different always measure from highest exposed area).

Be careful in using the bark method of scribing if your trees have thin bark. Also try to avoid 'nailing' as it will create a wound to which pathogens can gain access.  

Are you going to measure yearly? How many trees or acres of woods? What species? Are you concerned about asthetics of markings?

  
" If I were two faced, do you think I would be wearing this one?"   Abe Lincoln

rebocardo

I think bright spray paint on the west side of a tree would last a pretty long time. I painted some trees to mark a trail and it lasted a few years.

Ron Scott

I'd recommend tree marking paint; use one of the tree marking paints such as Nelson's for longer lasting and visibility.
~Ron

Jeff

Maybe I don't understand, but my question would be, why mark the DBH on the tree? Mark it on you. That way it will be on every tree you walk up to.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Texas Ranger

As my youngest says, "Well, duh!"  Diameter BREAST High. 8)

I had a lady tally man one time that made taking measurements,,,,,,,,,,,,, no, wait, for another time and another category. ;D
The Ranger, home of Texas Forestry

Bro. Noble

I think that  painting a 'dbh' mark on ones self is a brillient idea Jeff 8)

That would make a good game for the pig roast-------paint the dbh on the 'Big Guy' :D :D
milking and logging and sawing and milking

Jeff

How about guess the DBH of the big guy. Course when this bunch gets together its gunna take some doing to figure out who that is.

Honestly though, why would you mark the DBH on the tree?
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Ron Scott

So that the diameter measurement is taken in the exact same place every year or whenever by whoever takes it for record keeping over time.

Always measure from the highest side of the tree.
~Ron

Stephen_Wiley

Post change,

If anyone read my post prior to today (1/4/04) I have made a very important change.

Note in my above post previously I had typed .........'lowest exposure'  Must of been brain fog as I meant the highest. It is now changed and I apologize if this has brought any confusion to anyone.  :-[
" If I were two faced, do you think I would be wearing this one?"   Abe Lincoln

Stephen_Wiley

Also if you are measuring a tree such as a Hemlock with unusual trunk flare, measurement should be taken from the line of demarcation above abnormality.

" If I were two faced, do you think I would be wearing this one?"   Abe Lincoln

Jeff

QuoteSo that the diameter measurement is taken in the exact same place every year or whenever by whoever takes it for record keeping over time.

Always measure from the highest side of the tree.

So would it not be better to mark 4.5 feet on your person versus 10 gazillion trees?
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Bro. Noble

I think the object would be to identify the tree with a number so that the dbh could be compared in the future.

Besides a person's dbh can change both in the diameter and height deminsions :D
milking and logging and sawing and milking

Jeff

It wouldn't change anymore then a tree's. Besides I would think you could remeasure your dbh pretty easy. Now my diameter east and west varies quite a bit. ;D
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Tom

It's been recommended to tie a flag on the rental boat that took you to the fish so you can get it next time. :)   If it works for fishing, perhaps it would work for trees too.  My only concern would be the hill that forms under a tree as the roots grow.   If you mark yourself then you might be standing on higher ground next year.

I wonder if it would work it you drove a piece of PVC pipe into the ground next to the tree such that the pipe was 4.5 feet on the trunk? You could even stick a pice of paper inside with some information on it for next time  ....... like. ......."kilroy was here" :D

Jeff

I guess what I am getting at is that I dont like to see paint marks on every tree in the woods. I certainly dont want to see nails and I'm not sure how I would take a peice of PVC next to them. :D
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Minnesota_boy

Just run that PVC pipe through the mill like you would any othe hollow log.   :D
I eat a high-fiber diet.  Lots of sawdust!

UNCLEBUCK

so what is the defenition of dbh ,  diameter ---------  height , I dont know what the initials mean but I like checkin out trees in the woods .  :P
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

beenthere

Unclebuck         dbh ---  diameter breast height

south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

UNCLEBUCK

ok thanks beenthere !  I kind of thought that but just wanted to be sure . :P
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

etat

Uncle Buck, thanks for askin the question, I been fryin my brain off and on all day trin to figger out what dbh meant.
Old Age and Treachery will outperform Youth and Inexperence. The thing is, getting older is starting to be painful.

Stephen_Wiley

Uncle Buck and cktate,

d.b.h. = diameter at breast height or 4.5 feet from ground level at the highest exposed ground.

Exceptions:  trees with multi stem trunks, double leader below 4.5' feet, trees with excessive trunk flare are measured differently for log volume purposes.

Other abbreviations you will sometimes see are:

d.b.h./o.b.  =  diameter at breast height / outside bark
d.b.h./ i.b.  =  diameter at breast height / inside bark

depending upon purpose of tree survey or cruise it is important to note the difference.

Although not used much occaisonaly d.g.l. will be used in conjuction with d.b.h.    d.g.l. = diameter at ground level
" If I were two faced, do you think I would be wearing this one?"   Abe Lincoln

OneWithWood

I would think for the majority of trees there would not be a significant variance in dbh if it was taken at 4', 4.5', or 5'.  So marking the exact spot on a tree would be an unnecessary task.  It would be more important, IMO, to be sure and take the measurement from the same orientation each time to eliminate irregularities.  Of course that would not apply if you were to use a diameter tape instead of a stick.
One With Wood
LT40HDG25, Woodmizer DH4000 Kiln

Ron Wenrich

Consistency is the secret to any cruising.  You must be consistent where you measure your dbh.  If you measure one tree at 4' and the next at 5', you can start knocking trees into different size classes.  Enough guys already seem to stretch a diameter tape too much.   :D

Getting a few trees into different size classes isn't too big a deal when using variable plots.  But, for that 100% sample, you can start to gain or lose footage.  

I hate to see anyone use a stick for measuring trees that require any type of accuracy.  My first job as a forester was to go out and see why a consultant overscaled by 10%.  He used a stick and was off from 1 to 2 diameter classes on some of his calls.  Not acceptable.

He also had poor scaling and measuring techniques.  He measure mid-slope instead of high side.  It was one of his first jobs.  He cleaned up his scaling and is still in business 25 years later.
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

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