rafting logs

[Quebecnewf]

Start of a new thread to document my attempt to raft home to my mill the 400 logs I gathered up over the last 2 winters.

Distance to tow approx 11 miles. Speed I hope to make with logs in tow 2 knots.
Here is a Google pic of the planned route




As you can see some of the route is quite technical and requires working with the tides. Part of the area is dry at high tide so in order to get the logs you must go in with the tide put them in the water and come out on the same tide.

Quebecnewf

[thecfarm]

Hope you take more pictures for us. Sounds like you know what you are doing.

[r.man]

No roads in those parts Quebec or are you just feeling historical. Around here the log drives were always in the spring with the runoff pushing everything. Lots of small creeks, ponds and rivers still have stone piles and underwater timber leftovers from dams that held the water back to flood low areas to make the drive possible.

[isawlogs]

r.man,
No roads on shore over his way.  Travelling is done by boat or air when the ice is out.

[LOGDOG]

Looking forward to pictures of the trip.

[Magicman]

I'm glad that you took the time to detail the route.  It is not as I had visualized.

[bandmiller2]

What are you planning to use for a tow boat?Is rafting still commonly done in your area? Frank C.

[weisyboy]

are the logs worth the time and effort, seams like a lot of trouble to go to for some logs.

but still very interesting, iv only ever seen logs rafted down a river with the current.

[beenthere]

weisy
Seems if he wants logs, he has to go to the trouble of getting them. Otherwise, he goes without logs and lumber.

So...I'd guess it is worth it to quebecnewf.

[Ianab]

Probably still cheaper than putting them on a truck and driving them 50 miles, especially if there is no road. ;)

Lash them together to make a raft, hook on a tow rope and start towing.

[Piston]

Trip sounds like it would be a lot of fun and an adventurous experience.  Looking forward to the pics, also interested in the tow boat.  ;D

[SwampDonkey]

Weisyboy, it's the only way to get logs to lumber up there unless you want to pay a fortune to boat the lumber up from the nearest town with a road into it. It's a very remote area. The Island is pretty much barren with shrub-like trees.

[Quebecnewf]

 


Here is the tow boat. It has a 120 horse JD diesel. 400 logs will be as much as I can tow I would think. I will work the tides. Logs will be in racks of 20 logs attached to a main line . We will come out with the falling tide which will bring us out of the bay at 3 or 4 knots. Coming across the bay will hope to get 2 knots. We will have to wait for good weather any wind and you will lose the tow. I know this because it has happened to me before.

Quebecnewf

[PC-Urban-Sawyer]

Quebecnewf,

My father-in-law (God rest his soul) would have said "L'rd Tund'rn Jezaz Bye, that's a wee bo't for such a grand haul..." And then he'd have taken another pull on the bottle of Screech.

Good Luck. Wishing you fair winds and following seas.

Be Careful!

Herb

[logwalker]

Didn't you used to sled those over the ice? How big is the prop on that boat?

Joe

[Quebecnewf]

We do haul logs on the ice but this year we were busy cutting my father's firewood and hauling that home. We did haul home around 100. Gas is 1.89 a liter here now so we will try to move them by boat. I can bring 400 logs home with the boat with about 10 gal of diesel. If things go as planned

The prop on the boat is about 20" 3 blade.

Quebecnewf

[sgschwend]

I would recommend setting up a small tow and going through the process with a tow you would consider easy. 

I haven't towed logs before but I have towed docks about 100' long.  They towed hard, I couldn't obtain 2 knots with 250 hp.  I think what you will find is that a big prop matters too, not just horse power. 

Should be fun.  Let us know how it goes.

[Quebecnewf]

I have towed around 380 logs from about the same location a few years ago with no problem. Slow but steady. I also towed 200 logs from agreater distance to the west and they were all big spruce also with no problem. The west tow also involved crossing the mouth of a river. Total distance towed about 17 miles total towing time about 7 hours. It was a flat calm day so that helped.

Quebecnewf

[Mooseherder]

Bring the video. ;)

[Jeff]

Yea, we need a new favorite video from you, but it'll be pretty hard to beat this one you posted awhile back.  ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGhfWrqLbEo&feature=player_embedded

[customsawyer]

I hope he drives boats better. ;D

[Quebecnewf]

Yes that was pretty wild. My good friend had an even closer call this winter. He took his camera back and set himself up and took apic of the final result. I will look for it and add it

Quebecnewf

[Quebecnewf]

 



Here is the pic he took of the close call. He fell a birch ( the one across his back ) as it fell he saw it was going strike this broken fir and pendulum on him . He dove to the side the birch took him in the back and crushed him to the ground . If he had dove 6 inches further ahead you can see what would have happened. As it was he was just badly shaken up.

Quebecnewf

[isawlogs]

 And you call that a close call .     Magigman has many close calls.  ;D

[LOGDOG]

Wow! That guy needs to stay away from Chainsaws and trees. They don't like him.

[Mooseherder]

Good thing that was a rotten Birch cause they don't hurt as much.
Is Red Green your friend? :D

[SwampDonkey]

Might need Relic and Nick on this job. ;)

[isawlogs]

 
Sure glad to hear that he made it, rename him Lucky

How long to you think it will take you to tow these logs to the island. ?
Can you have this done in one day , tying all the logs and tow them home ?

[Ernie]

I don't think it would be a good idea to let your friend "help" with the tow. ;)

[Troublermaker]

Quebecnewf do you tie your logs together with rope? Back when my Daddy was a boy {He was born in 1911} they use to drive a wedge in the end of the logs with a ring and a short piece of chain holding them to gather to make a circle then fill the inside with logs and float them down the river.

[Quebecnewf]

The logs are all hitched together 20 to a rack and the fastened to the main line. One rack behind the other. The front rack is about 3 logs wide the next one 6 logs wide then 12 then 20 . This gives a point to the front and makes them tow easier.

Nice weather here today got the boat painted, block and tackle hooked on and and will launch on the tide tomorrow.

Quebecnewf

[Peter Drouin]

thats a staged picture.  with the guy under the tree  :D :D :D nice one

[Quebecnewf]

 


Went down today to check on the logs we piled for tow last winter. There are two locations one on the mainland and one on a small island just ofshore. This is the ofshore pile . Not the best location as we found out today.



We have two piles on this island about 200 logs




These are the piles one the mainland about 200 there as well. This is a better location . They will be easier to get into the water.




Another view




Next Sat and Sun should be rafting day weather permitting

Quebecnewf

[Kevin]

Nice pictures Newf.

[r.man]

Q, how did you do the logging?

[Coon]

They hauled the logs out to shore with snowmobiles and komatik style sleighs in the winter.  Do a search on his previous threads that he started.  ;D

[Quebecnewf]

 



Went down today and got 200 logs ready to tow. Things went pretty well. We will try to tow them home to the mill tomorrow or the day after weather permitting.

Quebecnewf

[beenthere]

Wish you well and a safe voyage. Thanks for the pic.
Looks ominous and challenging. But I think you like a good challenge.

[Magicman]

That is what I was waiting to see.  I wish you safety with your tow.   

[Ernie]

Looks like quite a challenge, thanks for the pic can't wait for the "action" shots

Good luck.

[Coon]

Looks like you're about ready to hook onto the floating skidder.  ;D  Nick and Relic would be proud of you.   :D

[LOGDOG]

Looking good.Nice logs and the best thing is they are getting a bath. Should be nice clean sawing. 

[jim king]

I can relate to what you are doing.

[LOGDOG]

Wow, beautiful logs Jim. What species are those?

[jim king]

The biggest logs are Lupuna for rotary cut plywood veneer and the smaller ones are Mahogany and Spanish Cedar.  These photos are from the Javari River which is the border between Brazil and Peru.  No skidders are used , the logs are rolled or winched out and lashed together with staples made out or rebar and cable.  It probably took this group a month to get down to the mills at the Peru, Colombia and Brazil border.

[LOGDOG]

Jim,

   You don't happen to know anyone down there that exports Spanish Cedar, Ipe, and Mahogany do you? In the last 24 hours it's been a topic my wife and I have been discussing ...importing those species. I'd be interested in some contacts if you know of any. 

[Quebecnewf]

nOW THOSE ARE NICE LOGS. I only wish our rivers would support that type of log driving. No such luck here. River is too wild and far too many big waterfalls and rapids

Going tomorrow to tow the logs home to the mill. Will post more pics at the end of the week

Quebecnewf

[kelLOGg]

I have to jump in and show my ignorance. Does the picture show the logs in tow broadside??  I would expect to see them towed in the direction of their axis. Wouldn't there be a huge difference in the drag between the two towing orientations?
Bob

[Mooseherder]

This is the process he mentioned back on reply 30. ;)

The logs are all hitched together 20 to a rack and the fastened to the main line. One rack behind the other. The front rack is about 3 logs wide the next one 6 logs wide then 12 then 20 . This gives a point to the front and makes them tow easier.
Quebecnewf

[jim king]

LOGDOG:

You don't happen to know anyone down there that exports Spanish Cedar, Ipe, and Mahogany do you? In the last 24 hours it's been a topic my wife and I have been discussing ...importing those species. I'd be interested in some contacts if you know of any.

I would not at this time encourage anyone to import wood from any country in the Amazon into the US.  With the new laws there is not one peice of wood that could pass "Lacey Act" scrutiny and you could end up with a huge fine and possibly jail.  Mahogany is also under CITES which makes it doubly dangerous.  Here the bribes can be paid and false paperwork made to pretend the wood is legal but the US Govt is now starting to pay for inspections of logging concessions and private property to verify that the wood actually came from the stump shown on the harvest plan.

I would hold off for a year or so until the dust settles and some sanity returns.  Right now the lumber industry could save the Amazon and create jobs and a nondestructive future but the WWF and others have created this mess and have made it impossible for people to work legal and thus people are switching back to slash and burn and cocaine production.  This is a true case of the inmates running the asylum at this time.  Wood going to Mexico or China and most other places is not to dangerous but to the US is a time bomb.

There are several companies here that tout FSC certification.  That is a joke and will come crashing down when the inspections start.

[LOGDOG]

Thanks Jim. I actually did a Google search and uncovered some of those concerns this afternoon. We'll stick with the good old American logs and lumber for now I guess. That Ipe really catches my eye though.

[kelLOGg]

This is the process he mentioned back on reply 30. ;)

I recall the description of the process but it's the orientation of the logs that surprises me ???
Bob

[Hilltop366]

I'm guessing the logs at the far end in the picture will be the front of the tow.

[kelLOGg]

I'm guessing the logs at the far end in the picture will be the front of the tow.

Ahh.. that would explain it. Makes better sense.  Thanks.

[Quebecnewf]

Left on Sun morning to pull logs to mill. Used the outboard to pull raft into channel and hooked up to the REEF RAT.

Started pulling at 9:00 AM . Three hours later arrived at the mill with 215 logs in tow. Things went very well made an avarage speed of 3 knots.

Worked with the ATV and skidding arch  untill around 7:00 PM hauling the logs up to the mill. Had a late supper and fell into the bunk for a well deserved rest.

Up again at 4:00AM and back at the logs. This time we had to use the front half of a snow sleigh instead of the skiidding arch (wheel fell off). Things went well and by 9:00 AM we had all the logs ashore and headed for home.

Pics will follow later today I hope (internet connection problems at home)

Quebecnewf

[thecfarm]

Glad things went well. All done rafting for this year?

[isawlogs]

    Glad to hear all went well and you got all them logs back on shore. Looking forward at seeing the pics of the trip , ya got some nice country your way 

[Quebecnewf]

 



Here we have the log boom attached to the Reef Rat . We are just checking the lines to make sure if we are good to go. You cannot see it here but the boat is in the channel and 20 feet to either side there is only 4 ft of water and this is a high tide



View from the boat looking astern just before getting under way



Logs under tow



Another shot of towing



Logs at the mill 3 hours later



ATV and skidding arch (which broke after only about 20 logs ashore) but we got them all ashore after a while.

only 200 more left to tow home

Quebecnewf

[Coon]

Nice job on the logs.  Thanks for the pictures of the journey.   ;D

[mikeb1079]

great stuff.  thanks for posting.

[beenthere]

Job well done, and well planned. Figuring everything out on top of having to work out the tide schedule plus the weather has to be satisfying when you win.

[kelLOGg]

Fascinating! Do you have a pic of the tow line attachment to the logs?
Bob

[ljmathias]

Beautifully done!  Thanks for showing us.  And I thought I had trouble getting logs to my mill... ;)

Lj

[Magicman]

Wow, thank you for sharing such an interesting operation.  From felling, bunching, and then "water skidding" it just demonstrates how we have to adapt to our surrounding and use nature as our helper/friend.

[LOGDOG]

Congratulations on a successful venture. Great pics. I like all that shield rock where the logs are beached. Reminds me of Ontario.

[Ianab]

I was at local sawmill yesterday and looking at some old pictures on the office wall. One of them was rafting some logs down a local river. A lot like the pictures that Jim posted, but from 100 years ago. Little steam powered river boats, and the loggers kids where out on the logs with Dad for the photo shoot. (or maybe they just rode the logs normally - it was in the pre OSH days.)

Just reminded me of this thread, that you aren't doing anything "new". 100 year ago they would have done the same things, but the boat would have been steam powered, and you would have used a horse or bullock to drag the logs out. This method worked for our great grandfathers, no reason it can't still work today.

Thanks for posting the pictures 

Ian

[SwampDonkey]

A 100 years ago? It's only been about 50 years ago here and maybe 15 on the Gatineau in Quebec. :D

[Ianab]

A 100 years ago? It's only been about 50 years ago here and maybe 15 on the Gatineau in Quebec. :D

Or this year.  :D

[paul case]

this thread has been very interesting. thanks for posting it.

oh and happy birthday swamp donkey.

pc

[cutterboy]

This is a great thread. Thanks so much for posting it. Quebecnewf, you are the only person I know of who makes salty sawdust. :D

[WDH]

Logging is the most challenging aspect of milling in my experience.  You have some real challenges compared to most of us.  That is very impressive.