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Author Topic: sinker logs  (Read 6241 times)

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Offline sjfarkas

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sinker logs
« on: March 26, 2011, 07:46:15 pm »
I tracked down some sinker logs.  some of them are from the days of the trains bringing the logs out of the mountains and some could be as new as 30 years old.  There is a mix of ponderosa pine, sugar pine, incense cedar, Fir.  Sizes range from 12" to 36"+  What do you guys think would be a good price for me to buy approximately 5 mbf of these logs?  How much is this lumber worth?
Always try it twice, the first time could've been a fluke.

Offline beenthere

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2011, 08:25:50 pm »
Who's logs are they? What are the CA laws for taking sunken logs?  Might be good to know.

Value of the logs may be just what the market is for any other logs available to the mills or from the loggers. Just a thought. :)
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Offline sjfarkas

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2011, 09:26:02 pm »
They are on private property and were under mud and water and dug up recently during some permitted excavation.  If I don't buy them they are going to donate the logs for firewood and take a right off. 
Always try it twice, the first time could've been a fluke.

Offline Left Coast Chris

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2011, 12:28:28 am »
It is not likely you will really know the value until you cut into them.  I would be cautious as to thinking the value is more than fire wood anyway especially for the pine.   Pine discolors so easily it could be ugly or beautiful depenting on mold and/or minerals in the mud.  Black mud and red mud would probably produce two distinct effects on the trees as for color/ minerals.    The fir and cedar could be interesting if they are big and clear.   With the economy the way it is I would be catious about thinking they have more value than regular logs and they may be less if the coloring is ugly.

This is the time of year that firewood is down in price.   Can you offer them a little less than firewood price and let them know that pine especially is likely a real gamble?
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Offline BaldBob

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2011, 01:27:00 am »
Being on private property does not necessarily mean that they belong to the property owner.  If they have brands on them they may well belong to the company that branded them or, if they are out of business, their successors in interest.

Offline sjfarkas

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2011, 09:01:36 am »
they belong to the succesors.  I did get one piece of pine milled yesterday.  It was a 4' piece maybe 12" diameter.  It was different looking.  It seems solid and the knots have a blue ring  around them.  I put the boards inside the shop so they will dry out a little. 
Always try it twice, the first time could've been a fluke.

Online Magicman

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #6 on: March 27, 2011, 02:27:27 pm »
It's the idea of it that drives the price here.  Folks with unlimited money will pay more than something is actually worth just because they can.
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Offline sjfarkas

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2011, 08:53:27 pm »
I agree with you about that's what is driving the price.  It's because it's different.  people want to be different and if they can afford to, well that's fine.  I wasn't looking for this type of wood, but I was meeting with someone and they pointed it out.  I know that buying this wood would be a risk, but without risk there are no rewards.  I still don't know if I'll make an offer.  I was thinking of $100/mbf  Do you guys think it's too high or too low?
Always try it twice, the first time could've been a fluke.

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #8 on: March 27, 2011, 10:17:31 pm »
I would certainly pay that.  If I got it, I would visit the "upscale" home builders to get a feel for their needs.  I would have a cut list before sawing.
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Offline Cedarman

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2011, 08:44:31 am »
I look at these ventures from what the upside could be to what is the worst that can happen.  If the logs were all rotten you would be out the money and time invested.  That is it. Right.  Upside could be many dollars per board foot.  What about letting them take some of the risk reward by saying I will give you x amount.  When I saw them and they turn out good I will give you an additional y.  Just a thought.
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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #10 on: March 28, 2011, 08:48:19 am »
My experience has been that it really takes a looong time to dry that stuff out.  It's value is decorative rather than structural.
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Offline doctorb

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2011, 09:35:41 am »
Do logs that are submersed, say in a lake, rot at the same rate as those that are buried?  Are there formulas to determine how long the logs have been down there?
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Offline sjfarkas

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2011, 12:06:36 am »
I was told today that I can come pick them up.  $100/mbf   I plan on duing an inventory of species and size tommorrow.  My wife seemed ok with the idea until I told her they took my offer.  I better petal some wood real quick.
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Offline timerover51

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2011, 01:57:01 am »
Do logs that are submersed, say in a lake, rot at the same rate as those that are buried?  Are there formulas to determine how long the logs have been down there?

Logs immersed in a deep, cold freshwater lake essentially do not rot, but season.  That is the basis of sunken log recovery.  You have a good log, that when treated properly, can be quite valuable.

As for a formula to determine how long a log has been submerged, you might be able to work it out by a detailed study of the tree growth rings in comparison to some known growth factors.  Otherwise, you have to check the records to determine when the logs might have been submerged, and figure that the logs on the top of the pile are the most recent and the ones at the lowest point on the pile are the oldest.  In the case of forests submerged by a reservoir, you can get the exact date and time of submergence.

Offline Holmes

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2011, 08:46:58 am »
Timerover51 welcome to the Forestry Forum. Timerover51 sounds interesting is there a reason for your name?  Holmes
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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2011, 06:14:25 pm »
Timerover51 welcome to the Forestry Forum. Timerover51 sounds interesting is there a reason for your name?  Holmes

i am an avid reader and student of history, primarily military history, and also of science fiction, so I rove over the whole time span from the past to the future.  I as born in 1951, hence, Timerover51.  I also have a desktop publishing company called Timerover Press.

Offline Ron Scott

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #16 on: April 22, 2011, 08:39:12 pm »
Idaho Firm Salvaging Sunken Logs from Flathead Lake

KMVT.com (April 18) - A forestry firm- Northwest Management-is salvaging century-old logs from the bottom of Flathead Lake in Whitfish, Montana. The company plans to use the logs, which were part of the former Somers Lumber Company's floating log yard, for tongue-and-groove flooring, table tops, and molding.

http://www.kmvt.com/news/regional/Idaho-firm-salvaging-sunken-logs-from-Flathead-Lake-120114179.html

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Offline timerover51

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #17 on: April 22, 2011, 09:55:36 pm »
Ron, thanks for the post.  I am negotiating with Scott Mitchen, who started the log recovery on Lake Superior, to recover logs for him.  I will be meeting with him in the next couple of weeks.  I do wish that Michigan had a better log recovery set up.

Offline Ron Scott

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2011, 07:37:04 pm »
Yes, Michigan has made it quite difficult. It was a lot more fun when I was into it back in the 1960's before all the rules, regulations, and permits.
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Offline SwampDonkey

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Re: sinker logs
« Reply #19 on: September 09, 2011, 06:16:06 am »
Well here is a new one on me:

http://www.fwds.com/ETL/html/products.html

And I do not agree that you can't get slow grown wood in this day in age. It's just more difficult because: 1) It's not close by, 2) It's mostly going to come off public lands which the licenses own all the timber rights, 3) You just aren't going to be allowed to go around cherry picking on public lands.

Pre-commercial thinning pays off. :)

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