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Rust Reaper Report

Started by Fla._Deadheader, December 19, 2003, 06:43:23 PM

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Fla._Deadheader

Well, it Don'T work worth a darn on loosinin up a bent shaft  ;D ;D ;D

  Stuff does a good job on rusty stuff AND loosinin up sawdust that's packed tight into the tiny setscrew holes, where them blasted Alien wrenches fit. ::) ;D ;D ;) ;)

 I like the fact that it's VERY loose??? liquid and crawls into tight places. I think it's a lubricant also, but, it's pretty thin stuff??? Whatcha think boss???

 It came with a small metal tube (tiny) so you can put it exactly where ya want it, instead of sprayin yer neighbors place too. ;D ;D

  If I had the chance, I would probably try to sell it. Works well. Thanks Mike and Jeff and whoever else was involved in sending it. 8) ;D :D
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

chet

Ya think it might work on my stiff old joints I feel when I get up in da morning.   :-/
I am a true TREE HUGGER, if I didnt I would fall out!  chet the RETIRED arborist

Fla._Deadheader

Never thought of that. My joints ain't what they used to be, neither ::) ;D
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

mhasel

I can't say for sure but I know the fellow who pressed the pins & bushings on our crawler a few years back swore that all the old-timers in his part of VA sprayed their joints with WD40 ;D

Jeff

Thats only cause they didnt have Rust Reaper ;D
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

DanG

I've heard the same thing about WD-40 and arthritic joints. There was sort of a "craze" going around about DMSO being good for this ailment, and WD supposedly used it for a penetrant. I dunno if any of it really works, though. I gotta figger it didn't, or a can of WD-40 would cost you 79 bucks at the drug store. ::)
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

Mark M

Yep - I heard it's supposed to cure rigor-mortise.

Mike_P.

Harold:  

I'm glad that you liked the Rust Reaper.  Regarding your question whether it would be a good lubricant, it would depend on the application.  The formula has about 70% solvent (a mix of medium- and slow-evaporating) to act as a carrier, a cleaner and to help with penetration.  The balance of the formula is a mix of synthetic oils, conventional oils, friction modifiers (soluble molybdenum) that bond to metal surfaces, EP agents, surfactants, wetting agents, anti-corrosion agents, penetrants.  This 30% is a heavier viscosity mix and is what remains after the solvents have gone.  Lubricants of this type lubricate very well, but are designed to be replenished, with the frequency depending on the application.

For example, in industry, formulas of this type are used often in lubricating conveyor chains or large drive chains.  I've also seen it used on open gears.  On a long conveyor, in a heated application, the lubricant might have to be replenished every 3rd or 4th cycle (revolution of the conveyor).  A shorter conveyor, at ambient temperature, might have to be replenished every 50 (or more) cycles.  These applications use automated oilers to apply the lube directly to the chain link and pin.

You wouldn't use Rust Reaper in a closed gearbox where the drive train requires a constant cushion of oil between the gear faces.  On the other hand, some of the components that we use in Rust Reaper, e.g., EP (extreme pressure) agents would be used in formulating a gearbox lube.

This is sort of a long-winded answer.  I hope that it makes sense.  If not, I will blame the coffee....either too much or too little.

Thanks for your comments, Harold.  And thanks also, to Jeff and everyone else at the Forum for their support and curiousity.

Mike

Fla._Deadheader

Hi Mike. I was just not sure if it would lube at all, because of the very liquid state of the fluid.
  I am aware that the new space age formulas of lubes and stuff can lubricate. Wasn't thinkin of replacing wheel bearing grease, or anything like that.  ;D ;D

  I WAS impressed at how it seemed to be "absorbed" into the steel, as it was applied. I KNOW that was not happening, but, sure looked like it. ;) ;D :D
  OOOps, forgot to add, our wind-up alarm clock quit ticking. Shake it and you get about 5 ticks. Put a dollop o Rust Reaper on both ends of the balance shaft, and that clock keeps right on tickin. ;) 8) ;D ;D :D
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Dave_Fullmer

Harold,
I don't know anything about the chemistry of Rust Reaper, but years ago (in the '60;s), I was assigned to be the technician to assist a young engineer in developing a process that would enable us to extrude magnetic material at Edmore Mich.

We tried many different types of lube and what worked best for us was a mixture of olive oil and iodine.  The engineer claimed that this mixture literally combined molecurally with the steel in the die.

Being just a dumb electrical technician, I don't have any proof of this being true, but maybe, could be, might be Rust Reaper is being "absorbed",

My 2 cents worth
If it aint Orange (AC that is) it won't run.

Fla._Deadheader

That's interesting, Dave. Maybe Mike will fill us in without divulging his secret formula.??/

  I just like to know HOW things work, not neccesarily what causes it to work???
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Mike_P.

Harold, Dave:

I think that what you were seeing when the lube appeared to be absorbed into the metal was it rapidly wetting out and trying to adhere to the metal.

We have formulated it to have a low surface tension as it comes out of the container.  The product is going to creep where it can find an opening.  That's why a small amount will so readily spread.  In addition to "wetting out", there are components that want to cling to the metal surfaces.

In the portion that remains after the solvents have done their job are the friction modifiers to provide lubricating strength.  
The molybdenum compounds that we use do plate out on the metal surfaces and form a easily sliding low friction layer (sliding against each other).  There will be some diffusion of the molybdenum into surface roughness of the metal.

There are also a couple of esters that act as friction modifiers through their polar nature, which results in the formation of a layer of friction modifier molecules (at the metal surface) that are difficult to compress, but will shear and rebuild.   So when the lubricant is called upon to "work" under load it has the strength to do so.

There are friction modifiers (we don't use them) that form a layer by a chemical reaction with the metal surface.  Quite often these formulations will have sulfur or phosphorus in them.  Iodine may have that same characteristic?  I do know that I have seen low-iodine additives used to minimize varnishing and oxidation.  That would indicate to me that iodine would have a tendency to react with the metal, especially under load.

I hope this is of some value.  

Thanks,

Mike


Fla._Deadheader

In the beginning, I wuz follerin ya right along. Then, ya changed languages and left me behind ::) ::) :D :D :D :D :D :D

  What you said in the first part, Mike, was what I actually saw working. The liquid was adhering, like it was being absorbed. That is pretty neat. Also, them little needle thingy's on them bottles, make it pretty difficult to waste the stuff, tryin to squirt it all over the place.

   Ya might wanna re-think them skinny needle thingys, or you won't sell enough to make a profit. It'll last too long ;) ;D :D :D :D :D :D :D   Thanks, Mike ;) ;)
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Mike_P.

Harold:

It's good news and bad news! :)

For applied cost, safety and environmental reasons, one of our goals was to come up with a lubricant formula that would yield results (a little goes a long way) and another was to have a way to deliver it that wasn't wasteful.  I really dislike spray cans because of their inefficiency and lack of precision.

You are right about a bottle of the product lasting a long time.  From a sales standpoint, we need to reach a lot of folks in order to sell enough product.  That has me rethinking our strategy and target markets. ???  More niche markets and some larger volume applications?

Thanks for your feedback.

Mike


Fla._Deadheader

All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Fla._Deadheader

Helped a friend take up some self-stick Vinyl floor tile today. Left the floor sticky and, of course, stuck my knee right in it. Dat dere Rust Reaper took it right off my knee. Them little needle tubes are great. ;) ;D ;D
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

C_Miller

Just spitballin' here but how would it work as a lubricant on them slippery Munky bands?

C
CJM

Fla._Deadheader

Don'T believe ya need much lube on them Monkey's. In case of build-up on a blade, shut down occasionally, and wipe the blade with just enough to remove the sap. We noticed the last time we sawed, that a brown off-color appeared on the OUTSIDE of the blade. A little WD40 cleaned it right off. (Din't wanna waste the GOOD stuff ;)).

  I still think the wire tooth brush we installed as a wiper on the INSIDE of the blade, has made a BIG difference to our build-up.
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

SasquatchMan

Seems like Rust Reaper needs to design a nose-sprocket lube, hmmm?
Senior Member?  That's funny.

Fla._Deadheader

That raises a good question. Would ya reckon that nose lube and debris will make the sprocket sticky and not turn so freely??? If so, the needle that comes with the Rust Reaper will fit in the lube hole and loosen up that gunky crap. Then, a fresh squirt of nose lube would work MUCH better.???
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

SasquatchMan

F.DH I've heard (around here, actually) that the sprocket lube theory is to lube it all the time (every sharpening, every gas tank etc) or never ever.  I've just started using Jigaloo lithium spray in my nose and so far it seems to turn better, but I'll rip some dusty poplar and see if it continues to function or just gets gunked up (at which point I guess a guy goes for some kerosene or something... could be pretty tough to get the lith out.
Senior Member?  That's funny.

Fla._Deadheader

Sas, The Rust Reaper is really loose liquid. Kinda like Alcohol. I would bet it would loosen up that crap.
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Mike_P.

This is a chance to display my ignorance.  We have a woodlot, but I don't know much of anything about sawmills and little more about chainsaws.

When you are talking about a nose sprocket, are you referring to a chain saw?  Is there a build up at that sprocket between bar oil, sawdust and moisture from the wood?

Thanks,

Mike

SasquatchMan

Yup, we're talking about chainsaws (at least I was - who ever knows what the Deadheader's on about???).  There's a little sprocket wheel in the end of the bar on a lot of saws, and the question is are you better off lubricating the thing, and dealing with whatever gunk gets stuck in your lube, or leaving it dry and presumably having it wear out faster... we'll have to take this over to the chainsaw forum pretty soon
Senior Member?  That's funny.

etat

Got the Rust Reaper today.  First thing cleaned up the rust on my table saw top.  It wasn't looking too spiffey as I had sort of  converted it to a wet tile saw while laying tile in a bathroom.  The rust was mostly surface rust but when I squirted a little on it and rubbed it down with a scrubby pad it shined that top back up pretty good.  Then I waxed it so it wouldn't rust back and  I wouldn't have to waste any more on it than need be.  It made the cleanup much much easier.  

The little bottle and tube with the needle thingys is really cool, and actually set up much better than I would have expected.  Real steel needles, not some plastic straw thing that you'll keep loosing.  One little tube came with a clip so you can keep it in your shirt pocket while you're working on something.  Those little needles, they're made on the caps of the tube of Rust Reaper, and the Cap of the Little Bottle of Rust Reaper.  Theres a bigger bottle that you can use to refill the small ones.  As florida said, you can put the amount you need right on the threads or nut of a rusty bolt almost without wasteing a drop and it just soaks right in and goes to work.

All in all I give it an A plus for the way the bottles are set up.  Professional all the way. You can tell a lot of time and thought was put in to what would be actually needed for using this on nuts and bolts and such.  First class in packageing and application uses, they probably could have put it in some much cheaper plastic bottles without the needles, but didn't.  I personally think folks will appreciate this, I know I do.
 
http://www.rustreaper.com/cgi-bin/store/cp-app.cgi?usr=50X2422120&rnd=7505386&rrc=N&cip=209.247.222.49&pg=bestsell

and, if you just clicked on that link, be sure and look over the whole website, very, very interesting.

I've got another test that I'm going to try in the next day or two.  I've got an old JD 3020 tractor.  For a long time I've been wanting to widen the rear wheels out just a  little.  There's a screw on each side that you have to loosten first to widen the wheels.  When I bought and cleaned up the tractor these were covered with dirt, and rust.  I've never been able to loosen them, you can see where some of the threads have rusted almost off, and they are froze tight.  I've tried soaking them with WD 40. and diesel fuel and still couldn't buldge them.  So I just kind of learned to live with them adjusted as they were.  I'm a thinking this will be just the stuff to eat through that Rust and loosen them bolts.  
Old Age and Treachery will outperform Youth and Inexperence. The thing is, getting older is starting to be painful.

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