Secrets to driving screws in White oak

[Banjo picker]

Does any one have a trick to make driving screws in white oak a little easier...I am trying to put the finishing touches on a fence made of white oak ....putting the top board on to keep the tops from curling...I am using a screw that is really made for composite board called Splitstop it is good enough of a fastner except the T15 head wants to give it up just before I finish...Do I need to predrill every hole or is there another way....Tim

[fishpharmer]

If white oak is not green you must predrill holes in my experience.

[Banjo picker]

I was afraid of that...   Tim

[pineywoods]

Try rubbing some soap into the threads before you start the screw. Waterless hand soap worked best for me.

[SPIKER]

Try rubbing some soap into the threads before you start the screw. Waterless hand soap worked best for me.

ditto liquid soap is one of only ways I have found.   My brother worked doing fencing when other construction jobs were low.   Kept dove liquid soap for oak boards ;)

[Don K]

I've heard beeswax makes a excellent lubricant.

Don

[cpstrutt]

Wax is what my daddy taught me.

[isawlogs]

 Wax or soap will do the job just fine , I use wax myself.

[Banjo picker]

I tried soap and some sort of go-jo this evening and had limited success...I just started drilling them...The problem is the T 15 head its just too small for what I am asking of it...I think if it was a T 20 it would work with the soap...but the 15 just spins out..does great after dirlling ....I got some bees wax somewhere I will give it a try and see how it does....The reason for sticking with the T 15 s...is I have 4 boxes of 400 each...I am too cheep to buy anything else while I have them... ;) :D ;D   Tim

[isawlogs]

 Cheap is good  :D  Drilling , even though it will be longer, will be the best to do in this case. Hope you have two drills to play with . 

[trapper]

I have found a cordless impact driver works far better than a cordless drill for driving screws. Bit dosn't slip in head of screw.

[fiddle1]

you get one of those donut shaped wax rings for seating toilets
and rub the screw threads on it to lubicrate them----its like
wax and silicoln with graphite in it. Screws will go in superfast.

also you can predrill a pilot hole. but best success in oak
has been not only a pilot hole but a counter sink.

make sure the screw is level stick it in first then use the driving force to
screw it down.   

[woodsteach]

Use Square drive screws and not those DanG torx head screws. ;D

I hate the torx head screws but they are available local and I have to remember to order the square drive ones.  Just a a test I drove a 3" square drive screw into kd red oak with nothing more than countersinking

[Phorester]

Squirt'em with WD40?  I sometimes use that on my rough woodworking projects.

[Stephen1]

I have found a cordless impact driver works far better than a cordless drill for driving screws. Bit dosn't slip in head of screw.

The impact driver is the way to go, for sure.

[SwampDonkey]

I work with white ash a bit and I have to pre-drill every hole or it ain't going to happen. ;)

[Banjo picker]

Here is some pics of the fence in question...I had to drill the holes after the wood seasoned a bit...The torx heads worked good as long as they were the 25 ...the smaller ones would strip, and that is what I had to put the verticals up with...I tried most of what was suggested with very little sucess...I did not get the bees wax out..that might have been the cats meow...





I still got a gate to build...I thought I had a pic of the double gate in the gallery ,but I didn't find it...

Its all white oak except the post which I cut from utility poles (never again)  and 3 sections of fence when I ran out of WO and used red oak...That will be a good test to see how well the different species age...I wanted to do several different kinds...popular, pine etc. but the misses put a quiotias on that... :D  Tim

[fishpharmer]

Nice looking fence Tim.  The grandkids will enjoy it, when they are grown. 8) 8)

[ScottAR]

The T25 Torx are the best I have found.  I prefer those over all the rest with square being semi close second.
Once a square strips, they are done as where most anything else will back out.  My main deciding factor is what is available in stainless. 

[SwampDonkey]

That's a nice fence in any man's yard. ;D Should keep the deer out of the pool. ;)

[Banjo picker]

You know SD I was actually worred about that...I have seen tracks within a few feet of it...I would think if one got in unless they happened upon the corner where the steps are ...it would be lights out for them...I have to move enough dead deer at work, I don't want to have to get one out of the pool...

I was breaking a horse a few years ago and he bucked from the barn to the edge of the pool, where I decided it was time to get off...If he was going in the pool he was going in by himself... ;D  Tim

[SwampDonkey]

 :D :D :D

[H60 Hawk Pilot]

I think you ID'd the problem with the T-15 head as the problem and 4 boxes of them and too frugal to upgrade to T-25 or so. I understand all that and would drive the screws I have as well. I'd pre-drill them to get them in all the way in. The lube may be not req'd... if you are using the right sized pilot drill.

I have done tractor trailer (oak) decks and it took me awhile to get my installation set up right. I ended up using a 3/8 drive impact, air driven and it worked 100%. However, my head size was T-25 or T-30 as I recall. I had to find some good T-30 bits because the cheap bits would round off in a heart beat.

Also, I have used the shock type (hammer) 3/8 drive to remove bolts/ screws and it works 100%. I learned this trick when I worked in a motor cycle shop. This shock drver was the best tool in my box for removing case screws in motorcycle engines. I don't see them for sale at the hardware stores, Sears has them.. I think. You can't beat this tool for removal and driving screws when they hang up. This tool will drive any screw because of the hammer shock force and the turning action you get when the end is struck (works 100%) with a hammer.

Forgot to mention, this shock driving tool may work too good and will twist the head off but better that.. than rounding it off by (just) the simple turning force without the shock being applied.  

Take Care,

Avery

[Bandmill Bandit]

I will ship you some real Screws from Canada!

I dont care what T screw you use they are all Phillips head and in my shop (and most Canadians shops) we chuck that junk in the trash bin without even opening the package

Robertson head is by far preferable and Thanks to GM (my mistake, should read Ford) you cant get Robertson head screws down there.

Bees wax works great as does dry silicon spray.
 

[beenthere]

Seems to me we can get square drive screws "down here" (and I understand that is also the "Robertson Head").

Now about the GM comment, maybe you meant Ford ?? Ford went with Phillips screws over Robertson screws for his model A's from what I read.

http://www.mysteriesofcanada.com/Ontario/robertson_screws.htm

I went through a period using just the square head screws and liked them. But got tired of needing to change out the drive bits between square and phillips, so just became satisfied with the phillips now.

[Banjo picker]

I was just going to ask what a Robertson Head was..I have used square head screws many times...we have plenty of them here in the states...To be honest they can't hold a candle to the Tork 25...The two by fours used for horizontal support are connected to the post with 3.5 inch T25's they were put up when first cut, but they went up with no problems..this was full 2 inch thick White Oak...I have built many things with store bought  2x4's using square heads and they are problamitic in the soft  1.5 inch stuff..., like beenthere said , all ways rounding off....I used some screws that favored a tork but had a slightly different shape they came with the driver or I would not have been able to use them...had never seen them before...

Hawk Pilot you could swap frugal for cheep and I wouldn't mind... ;)  Tim

[H60 Hawk Pilot]

Banjo Picker

You gave me a Big Belly Laugh with your back to me comment regarding Frugal and Cheap.

I always try to be polite and not offensive. Most of the time... I ramble on and over explain things. Most folks ain't as thick headed as I am and don't require the ABC to XYZ but I cover the bases (just to cover the thick heads like me).

My Big Belly Laugh back to You. I reused about a 1/3 of the old screws I removed from the old trailer decking. I blasted them in my blaster (glass bead) cabinet. They cleaned up fair and reusable, I saved about $ .40 cents per screw.  

So.. I'm Super Frugal and/ or Super Cheap  and  No Doubt about it.  So when You said that your're using them  4 boxes  of puny T-15  torq. head screw's... I  ID'd.  with You 100%.  I'd get them screws in there... if I had to use a sledge hammer and 1/4 dia. pilot bit {dumb little joke'ee  :D).  

Take care,

Avery  

[Bandmill Bandit]

if your using torx head wood screws i wana know where i can get some. The difference between torx and Robertson is a about the same as philips to robertson. So far i have only seen stove bolts and machine screws up here with the torx head

[clww]

Try the Rockler catalog.

[Just Me]

if your using torx head wood screws i wana know where i can get some. The difference between torx and Robertson is a about the same as philips to robertson. So far i have only seen stove bolts and machine screws up here with the torx head

GRK's, and they come in all varietys.

As far as all screws, if you are buying your screws at a Borg, or at just about all hardware stores and local lumberyards, the problem is probably the screw itself.

I would put this in all capitols but they won't let me.

"There are no good Chinese screws!"

I order my drywall type screws from Grabber, they don't break, the heads fit, and you don't end up with schrapnal in your hands.

I order most other screws from Baer Supply, and I do use square drives for all of my cabinet work. I order my small screws from them as well. The ones at the hardware store are all from the same importer and they just snap off with the least bit of torque. It is very frusterating to me to not be able to go to the local hardware and get a decent product. Thanks the Borg [Big Orange Retail Giant]stores for that

I believe that the Chinese have absolutely no morals/honor. They will build a product that is just good enough to fool you, will get rid of their toxic waste in your drywall, will steal your design in a heart beat, just generally slimeballs as far as their business policies. I choose to do as little business with them as possible.

As a lube I open the box and spray the whole thing with TopCoat. TopCoat is a table top spray for machinery to cut down on friction. It is used on tablesaw tops and such, but is handy other places as it dries and leaves behind a lube/protective film. Makes screws go in well and stays on the screw further down the hole.

If you are doing just a couple of screws or so and need lube, wipe the screws on your forehead. The grease from your skin will act as a lube......

[Banjo picker]

Good idea about spraying into the open box...Tim