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Author Topic: log arch question  (Read 4582 times)

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Offline caveman

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log arch question
« on: September 08, 2010, 09:24:58 pm »
Good evening,
I am building a log arch to be pulled behind a tractor and would like suggestions on how long to make the tongue (part that will run from the arch to the drawbar).  Since we will be skidding logs about 1/2 mile to the trailer, it will be to our advantage to be able to skid relatively long logs that will be bucked at the loading site.  Would 12' of log in front of the lift point on the arch seem reasonable?  We need some degree of maneuverability since we will be skidding between tropical fish ponds that are only 8'-10' apart.  Also, would it be worthwhile to pin or bolt the tongue part to the arch in a way that the length could be adjustable?  I was planning on just welding it. 

I have enjoyed reading all of the topics and appreciate the wealth of knowledge and the skill of the members of the forestry forum.  Thanks, Kyle (aka. caveman)
Caveman

Offline Peder McElroy

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2010, 11:12:57 pm »
Caveman, I built a log arch that you can see in my Photos. It is about 8' to the hich. I built it to carry a 16' log @ the center point so it is off the groung. I hope this helps. Peder

Offline redbeard

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2010, 01:36:39 am »
I saw a heavy duty arch a guy had with his tractor and his tongue was made out of 2" reciever stock and he had 4-5' of 2'' square stock that slide inside with holes every 6", so he had plenty of options in the tight spots in the woods.
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Offline caveman

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2010, 03:22:22 pm »
Thank you both for your input.  We are building this thing on the cheap and using junk lying around the shop for the most part.  The arch is 2" gasline pipe sleeved with 2 1/2" pipe.  The hubs were cut off of the ends of a mobile home axle and were welded to the arch.  The tongue will be made out of more 2" pipe.  I have not decided whether to use a come along or a boat winch to lift the logs.  The idea is to have the whole rig strong enough to move good sized logs but light enough to load on top of the logs loaded on the trailer for transport. 

I have some new ag mechanics students in one of my classes and they are learning to cut, bend, weld and other skills while working on this project.  It will also be used at school while clearing an area for a cow pasture.  When the weather cools down a bit, I plan to haul the wm lt28 to school and get the kids to help me saw some logs that we can air dry and use for wood working projects next year.   

Last year, the kids sawed some short logs on the 20" shop bandsaw into boards that they jointed, planed and used for woodworking projects.  A lot of them learned a lot and got satisfaction from turning a salvaged tree into a useful product.
Kyle (caveman)
Caveman

Offline sdunston

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2010, 06:41:22 pm »
Here is a pic of the one that we built, It has carried a 24'' hemlock that was 12' long with no problems, Hope it helps


Sam
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Offline bandmiller2

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2010, 08:01:24 pm »
Kyle,I'd be a little nervous of a long tongue of 2" pipe you may want to truss the tongue and arch.Its pretty tough duty hauling a one ton log through potholes and over stumps. Frank C.
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Offline caveman

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2010, 10:16:56 pm »
Sam, that is a good looking log arch.  Frank, I think you are right about trussing the 2" pipe.  I did not mention the trusses but I had planned to triangulate braces from the arch to the tongue and perhaps run a 1" pipe as a truss above the 2" pipe tongue.  If it doesn't hold up, we will make another out of 4" pipe but I was hoping to keep the weight down enough to haul the logs and arch out in one trip with the trailer.  I appreciate the insight you have provided--there is little use reinventing the wheel.
Kyle
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Offline gcgrant

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2010, 03:59:31 pm »
Hi Caveman,
Have a look at an arch/log carrier that I made to move logs and to load them onto the bunks of my D&L swingblade mill.
It was one of those deals that works better than I could have imagined when I was brainstorming it! (check my photos)
Good Luck...
GCGrant

Offline Larry

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2010, 04:36:59 pm »
I have a 12' tongue on my arch.  Used a gooseneck hitch pipe from the trailer place.  On its first day I was pulling about a 40' tree with a 30" butt across a not to steep slope.  The butt started to roll down the hill and almost wound up the arch along with the tractor.  I thought maybe shorter tree lengths and a little less steep ground might be prudent.

Just something to consider.
Larry

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Offline caveman

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2010, 09:47:03 pm »
GC Grant, having the arch high enough to use a chain hoist looks like it would work great.  I doubt you will overload what looks like 4" square tube either.  Thanks for sharing.

Larry from Arkansas, You make a good point about slopes and working with heavy logs.  In my part of the world, Central Florida, we don't have a lot of hills.  Most areas only change elevation 5'-10' in a mile.  If I get some time this week, I'll try to finish it up.   Students are doing a lot of the work so it takes four times as long as doing it myself plus I have a large proportion of knot heads in class this year.  I am afraid to drop my welding hood for more than two minutes at a time fearing a freshman might be hanging by his rear belt loop from a chain hoist.
Caveman
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Offline Okrafarmer

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2010, 09:59:00 pm »
Yes, FL is one of the flattest states, maybe the flattest. You shouldn't have to worry too much about hills, but you will still have to be concerned about any variability in the ground. The longer the log, the harder it is to control in sensitive places like around those fish ponds. If you are planning to hoist the entire log off the ground, you will find a practical limit to the length of the log you can lift before the arch becomes so long it is hard to maneuver. Also the longer and heavier the log, the stronger you need to make the arch. If you're trying to take 40' trees in between those ponds, better watch out as you turn those corners, it's going to be hairy. BTW, what model of tractor are you planning to use?
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Offline caveman

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2010, 10:26:43 pm »
Okrafarmer, the tractor is an M7040 Kubota.  We used it to drag out some respectable sized cypress a couple of weeks ago.  When we got to the part of the farm where the fish ponds began, we cut them at about 16' and carried them to the trailer on the forks.  Some of the logs were all that this tractor wanted to lift.
Kyle
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Offline Okrafarmer

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #12 on: September 16, 2010, 12:26:34 am »
Yeah, we use a Massey Ferguson 1260 fwd (Iseki built). It has the same problem. It won't lift more than about 1,000-1,200 lbs. 33 hp. It'll run the disc mower and hay baler all day long, but it's a little light in the pants for log loading. I usually have a box scraper on the back for some added rear weight, but there's no substitute for a proper sized tractor when loading logs.

Sounds like the size (and length) of your arch, and the weight of log that it can balance and carry will be somewhat limited by the small size of your tractor. A heavier tractor can handle a heavier load, especially when maneuvering in tight spots like around those ponds.

Now one other thing you could try, if your ground is quite flat, is to only lift the front end of a long log off the ground, and drag the other end. Then, to get through where the ponds are (repeatedly, I assume?) you can drive some really sturdy poles in near the banks of the pond and drive between them, allowing the poles to guide the logs between the ponds. If you are dragging, say, 40' logs, then posts every 20 feet or so ought to keep the log from rolling down into the pond. Just make sure your posts are strong enough and in hard enough to hold the side-pressure of the log rubbing against them.  ;)
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Offline bill m

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #13 on: September 17, 2010, 12:18:21 pm »
I had to bring out some 40 ft. logs without dragging them in the mud so I made this to carry them and be able to steer them around corners

It is normally used to load my forestry trailer for transport

I unbolted the handle, welded attachment points for hyd. cylinders off of a snowplow and welded up the beam to cradle the log. 





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Offline beenthere

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #14 on: September 17, 2010, 02:59:09 pm »
bill m
That was clever riggin.  8)
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Offline bandmiller2

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #15 on: September 17, 2010, 08:18:01 pm »
Bill thats a clever lashup,of course you could always have a tiller man steering the back end.What do you use the long logs for?? Frank C.
A man armed with common sense is packing a big piece

Offline Okrafarmer

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #16 on: September 17, 2010, 09:26:06 pm »
Bill thats a clever lashup,of course you could always have a tiller man steering the back end.What do you use the long logs for?? Frank C.

That is a great setup, Bill! You know, before Bill posted those pictures, I had been thinking in the back of my mind that you could rig up some kind of a dolly and have a second man steering the rear of the log like a fire truck. But I thought, nah, I won't post that because that would seem too far-fetched. It was too far-fetched, I guess--- the very idea of paying another guy to steer, when simple hydraulics can get the job done.
No matter how conventional wisdom may fly in the face of radical thought, it's still the most popular type.

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Offline bill m

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2010, 07:42:21 am »
Bill thats a clever lashup,of course you could always have a tiller man steering the back end.What do you use the long logs for?? Frank C.
They are for a timberframe workshop a guy in town is building. I thought about getting longer hoses so I could put it at the end of the log but decided it would be harder to see around corners behind me and know where the end of the log is for steering.
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Offline Lud

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2010, 05:33:55 pm »
Real nice job, Bill.   that looks handy!

When I read 2" gas pipe it makes me think of my arch made from a 12' transport disc I pulled out of the boneyard here at the farm.

Because of the split axle on the disc I saw that my arch could also load to my mill by straddling with the log above.  I use a Warn 3700 winch to lower the log without damaging the mill.  Check my gallery.  An arch can do more than just carry.

I 've even back the arch back over the mill to use the winch to turn the log when my 60" Logrite Cant hook can't!
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Offline gcgrant

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Re: log arch question
« Reply #19 on: September 19, 2010, 01:39:16 am »
Hi Caveman,
There sure is a lot of innovation out there!  Actually my arch/carrier is made out of 5 in. tube I picked up at a salvage yard for scrap prices.  The tube is large enough that I didn't have to add much in the way of gussets or extra bracing.  Since I was going to transport it into our camp by helicopter, I had to keep it fairly light.  I think it weighs about 600lb.
gcgrant