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TO WRAP OR NOT?

Started by rs1626, July 26, 2010, 10:54:38 AM

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rs1626

Hi all i am building a 16*24 cabin 6" studs with osb on walls and will use 12" log cabin siding my question is should i wrap it with hose wrap between the siding and osb?

Raider Bill

The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

beenthere

By all means, agree you should wrap (but use the house wrap  ;D )
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Thehardway

If you have a building code in your area and you are planning to heat/cool the cabin the inspector will most likely be require you to wrap it.
If it will not be inspected, it is up to you.

An unwrapped structure is more difficult to heat/cool, however it "breathes" better which can be better for air quality.   There are trade offs with everything.  I would make sure you have some kind of moisture/wind barrier under the log siding to keep any windblown rain/moisture from getting into the OSB and making it mold/rot/mildew/swell etc.

Norwood LM2000 24HP w/28' bed, Hudson Oscar 18" 32' bed, Woodmaster 718 planer,  Kubota L185D, Stihl 029, Husqvarna 550XP

Sprucegum

That's a wrap - I would vote for tarpaper rather than tyvex or typar. Those new fangled wraps don't breathe as well as good old fashioned tarpaper and can trap moisture in some cases.

Larry

Another vote to wrap it with something.

Tar-paper is tried and true.  It's hard to put up if you don't have a helper.

House wrap goes up quick and easy.  Caution you get what you pay for...there is a big big difference between Tyvek and some of the other generic house wraps.  Compare samples and it is easy to tell the difference.  Tyvek has some great products to make a fully weather tight wrap.  Tape and elastomeric window/door flashing.  Eash to use and I can't see where you would have have a leak around a window or door.  Real sticker shock when you see the price on the flashing tape.

Whatever you wrap with if it is going to be exposed for more than a week or so use the red buttons to hold it down.
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

Radar67

Definitely wrap. Felt or tar paper is my choice. Here is my 16 x 24 wrapped.



The first picture is from early 2007, I just got around to siding it this year. The felt held up fine.

"A man's time is the most valuable gift he can give another." TOM

If he can cling to his Blackberry, I can cling to my guns... Me

This will kill you, that will kill you, heck...life will kill you, but you got to live it!

"The man who can comprehend the why, can create the how." SFC J

knowslittle

I agree with sprucegum...some years ago Tyvek and others supposedly deteriorated after contact with the  extractives of Cedar and Redwood.  Tar paper's been proven for decades.  I wont use anything except tarpaper, usually 15#.  Proven itself.

rs1626

THANKS for all the help looks like it will get wrapped

Raider Bill

The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

Raphael

I'm voting for the 15# felt as well.
... he was middle aged,
and the truth hit him like a man with no parachute.
--Godley & Creme

Stihl 066, MS 362 C-M & 24+ feet of Logosol M7 mill

ljmathias

Wrap that rascal! Grin

Now Raider, doesn't that catch-phrase refer to something totally different?  Maybe it bespeaks our true age   :D :D

Back to topic: I've used mainly tyvek to great success- my son's house is tight and dry and easy to heat and cool.  Something to be said for polymers (my profession, actually) be they natural ones like wood or synthetic ones like tyvek.   ;D

Lj
LT40, Long tractor with FEL and backhoe, lots of TF tools, beautiful wife of 50 years plus 4 kids, 5 grandsons AND TWO GRANDDAUGHTERS all healthy plus too many ideas and plans and not enough time and energy

Dave Shepard

I've been seeing a product around here a lot lately. It looks like OSB with a green coating. You sheath like you normally would, and tape the joints. Don't know any more than that, but looks like it would save a ton of time putting the wrap on. Anybody know anything about this stuff?
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

DBailly

First, OSB is crap. If possible spend the extra few dollars for plywood. If you have to use OSB use tyvek. Felt will trap any moisture between the paper and the OSB causing the OSB to delaminate. As for the green stuff Dave is refering to, it is a ZIP system. I have not yet installed it but What I have seen and read it is a good product that seems to save time. I think it is a bit pricey though.

beenthere

DBailly

Welcome to the forum.

Now, what is your background to classify OSB as "crap" ? 

Do you have a definition for "crap" ?
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

DBailly

Beenthere,

I have been working as Restoration Carpenter for 12 + years. I have workied on plenty of buildings where some work had been done recently using OSB. Personally I perfer traditional materials such as 1x planking for sheathing, but I understand the time and money savings when using sheet goods. I have taken off enough OSB that was put on in the 80's and 90's to know that moisture turns OSB into a wet mess. The felt paper only seems to expidite this process.

Dave Shepard

Welcome to the Forestry Forum!
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

Raider Bill

Haven't they changed the composition of OSB in recent yers to stop or at least slow this down?
The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

Raphael

Quote from: DBailly on August 01, 2010, 10:07:02 PM
First, OSB is crap. If possible spend the extra few dollars for plywood. If you have to use OSB use tyvek. Felt will trap any moisture between the paper and the OSB causing the OSB to delaminate.

Funny that's exactly what I've been told would happen w/ Tyvek and NOT happen w/ felt because felt breathes and Tyvek doesn't...

  OSB is a whole lot better than it used to be, even the stuff laying ground wet under tarps the past 3 years is still solid and clinging tenaciously to the panels... Probably doing so well because I want to strip it off.   :D 
... he was middle aged,
and the truth hit him like a man with no parachute.
--Godley & Creme

Stihl 066, MS 362 C-M & 24+ feet of Logosol M7 mill

barbender

 Isn't the ZIP system just OSB with a pre-applied housewrap membrane? If so, how can it be a "good product" when other OSB is "crap"?
Too many irons in the fire

Gary_C

I am now more confused than I was about this house wrap issue. It was always my understanding that Tyvek or similiar products was better for house wrap because unlike tar paper, it let moisture pass thru so the moisture would not be trapped in the wall cavity with the moisture barrier on the inside of the wall just under the finished wall. But from the answers here, I would believe everyone is expecting the house wrap to block the movement of moisture.

So what is the real purpose of house wrap?
Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.

beenthere

Gary_c
The house wrap isn't a moisture vapor barrier, and neither is the tar paper. Both stop water tho.  The wrap comes in larger sheets and is more effective and more easily sealed around doors and windows.

south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

beenthere

Quote from: barbender on August 14, 2010, 08:24:50 AM
Isn't the ZIP system just OSB with a pre-applied housewrap membrane? If so, how can it be a "good product" when other OSB is "crap"?

All OSB isn't "crap"   :)

OSB is oreinted strand board, and is not the same as flakeboard or chipboard.  However, all of these products can be made "on the cheap" with very little glue used in the process, and with little control over the size of the flakes or the strands. Or they can be made "very good" with plenty of glue and be like steel plate.
Availability of a sheet product to the public consumer varies as to what the box stores are buying on the market. If the box stores can pick up shiploads of "crap" and sell it, they will.
However, the large consumer using the product in their own mfg facility (producers of the ZIP system may be such), they can make deals with OSB mfg's to get the quality they want (high or low), and it can be above normal expectations of the "crap".
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

shinnlinger

I sheathed my whole timber frame with the Green Zipwall.  It is roughly 1/2 Advantech OSB  with a supposed special green coating that allows it breath like tyvek.  I bought it because I knew it would be some time between sheathing and siding and I knew Tyvek would be a pita for one person to apply AND probably be blown off and shredded by the time I got to siding(how many times do you see that???).  It was also quicker as a result and each sheet was less than $12 which I thought was very reasonable.

Advantech is an OSB that is extremely resistant to moisture.  I put down 3/4 Advantech on my deck and it sat out in the New HAmpshire weather for over a year with almost no bubbling that you would see in conventional OSB.  I got it after a neighbor had a similar experience to mine.

I used Zip roof on my roof and that is brick colored OSB that supposedly has a water proof paint on it so you don't need tarpaper

WIth both the zipwall and Zip roof you seal the seams with a special rubber tape.  The tape is VERY impressive stuff.  I used some grace ice and water shield  on a door install on my house and after a year, that fell off, but the zip tape held solid right next to it.

That said, the tape is expensive and that is where they get you when using the Zip products.  If I was siding my house right away, I would consider not taping the seams to save $ and allow breathing.  That said, I understand the zip wall really does breath well and the HUber company put a lot of research into it.  The Zip wall is more brittle than the zip roof so it may indeed be a different product.

Dave
Shinnlinger
Woodshop teacher, pasture raised chicken farmer
34 horse kubota L-2850, Turner Band Mill, '84 F-600,
living in self-built/milled timberframe home

Dave Shepard

I use Grace ice and water to repair torn tractor seats. No more wet backsides. ;D
Wood-Mizer LT40HDD51-WR Wireless, Kubota L48, Honda Rincon 650, TJ208 G-S, and a 60"LogRite!

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