Stihl MS 280: repair or replace?

[Damocles]

I have a 4 year old Stihl MS 280 which I just took into the dealer for repair. The estimate is almost $300. I only use it for cutting my own firewood; I cut 6 - 7 cords a year.

I'm wondering if I should just buy a different brand saw which has more reasonably priced parts than Stihl. I looked at a Husqvarna 365 Special for $550. Also looking into Dolmar. I'm not anxious to spend more money but I figure that if I fix this Stihl I'll have $750 into it over a 4 year period. It might be cost effective to switch.

Thoughts?

[jteneyck]

What's wrong with your saw?  Dealers have to make a profit, so even small repairs can get expensive in a hurry.  Chainsaws are often annoyingly tempermental, but pretty simple machines overall.  Most things you can fix yourself by asking for help from your friends here. 

But if you don't want to go that route, I would not throw another $300 at a MS-280.  I'd get another saw. 

[boobap]

But if you don't want to go that route, I would not throw another $300 at a MS-280.  I'd get another saw.

x2

[JohnG28]

What is it thats wrong with the ms280, and do you know why it happened?  I assume its some major repairs.  That is a lot for repairs on a saw, when a little more will get you a new saw. Part of why its costing so much is that the way the non-pro model saws are built, they are not as easy to repair.  This isnt just true for Stihl either, so I wouldnt cast them off for this.  You would probably be happy with a 365 Husky though, its a good price and it would make lighter work of your needs than the ms280 or the Dolmar 5100. Might look at a Husky 357xp too, its a pro model saw. I do similar cutting to you, and just upgraded to an ms361, and I love it. If you could find one around still might be something to look at.

[JohnG28]

Depending on how bad off the ms280 is, you might be able to sell it as a parts or for repail saw, at least recoup some of the new saws cost.

[Damocles]

The safety lock plastic guard thing is busted almost off, there is an air leak in the crank case (not 100% positive that's what he said - I was still reeling from the price), a couple bushings are missing (extra vibration may have contributed to the crank case problem), general tune up, and bang... $300.

The dealer said the blade was a bit duller than it should get, and he thought it might have been pushed too hard as a result. I suppose it's possible but I do sharpen regularly and keep an eye on the chip size.

Maybe I'll bite the bullet, get a pro saw, and make a no-pressure project out of fixing the other one for a backup. I like the sell it for parts option too, if it has any value.

[JohnG28]

With an air leak in the crank that would explain the high cost Id say. Not that anyone wants to cough up the cost of a new saw, but its probably worth it here.  A good pro saw with this kind of work should last a long time if taken care of.  Check out ebay or the like for this saw and see what theyre selling for as parts saws, maybe even your dealer as they would have less to invest to fix it.  Would make a good backup too, cant ever have too many.

[jteneyck]

Part of why its costing so much is that the way the non-pro model saws are built, they are not as easy to repair.  This isnt just true for Stihl either, so I wouldnt cast them off for this.

You're definitely right about that when it comes to the Stihl mid-range saws.  It took me a whole evening to tear apart a MS-290.  Unbelievably complex compared to my Husky 55.  That comes apart in just a few minutes.  I love the simplicity of how Husky designs their saws, at least the two I own. 

[Damocles]

You guys have been confirming my suspicions here. I was hoping a bunch of folks would say "no, fix it, it's a great saw and worth every penny..." Then I could save a couple hundred bucks. But no. I won't get another Stihl because of the proprietary chain sizes, parts, etc. Probably the Husky 365 special but I'll look at Dolmar as well.

Thanks very much for the input. Cheapskates like me need a lot of convincing before parting with money.

[JohnG28]

Damocles, where around Upstate NY are you located, and what dealer did you take it to?  I live just outside Utica, and I can think of at least 3 dealers within a half hour of me here, and I know theres more around.  Might be worth calling around to see if anywhere could do you any better on the repairs.  Was that 365 special at Khalers?  I think I remember seeing that they had some, but dont remember the price.  My uncle runs a 365 a lot, almost daily basis, and its his go to saw.  Sure youd be happy.  If your interested though I know of a Stihl dealer that has an ms361 brand new on their shelf still, its the model with the extra rear handle brake on it, C-Q I think they call it.  Anyway, I think they had it listed at $630 or $640.  I almost bought it, and they offered 10% off that price since it was a discontinued model, but I found one without the extra brake.  I know you said you were going to get away from Stihl, but they do have good products, and their pro saws are very good, especially the 361, and its very rare that theres a new one sitting on a shelf now-a-days. Oh, and welcome to the forum by the way. 8)

[Damocles]

I'm near Woodstock/Phoenecia - midstate I guess. I bought it from and took it to Ace in Saugerties. I called another shop in the area and the price is the same. Higher bench charge, in fact. I don't fault anyone for charging for their time, if they can get it - get it! But it's high.

The Husky 365 was at Ashokan Turf & Timber. I want to be one of those guys who says "I bought my saw 20 years ago and it still works fine..." 4 years is nothing to brag about.

Glad to be here, this is a great resource!

[Al_Smith]

. But no. I won't get another Stihl because of the proprietary chain sizes, parts, etc. Probably the Husky 365 special but I'll look at Dolmar as well.

Well first of all Stihl doesn't have "proprietary " chain sizes .Who in the world ever told you that  falsehood  because it's just not true ?

Parts no matter who made the saw are specifically made for the individual saw with few exceptions of interchangability .Granted the Stihl company is especially proud of their parts I'll grant you that .

You have to remember when dealing with dealers you are going to pay at least 60 dollars per hour in labor alone not to mention parts .More times than not the repair is simple but if you had no idea of how to do the repairs which you obviously do not ,face it ,you're at their mercy .-----but you also would be weather it's Husqvarna ,Dolmar or even an old McCulloch .That said,best of luck 

[Damocles]

Perhaps my use of the word "proprietary" is incorrect. There is a guy around here who does small engine repair. He told me that he can't make chain for this saw because the odd gauge is only available to Stihl franchises. So I bought my chain at inflated prices. Maybe I heard him wrong. I officially retract my under-informed criticism of Stihl's business practices and reserve judgement.

Either way, time to learn how to re-build chainsaws.   :-\

[JohnG28]

Well if its something you dont think you can do yourself or would question, then the shop is the right place for it to go.  As for the gauge of the chain on this saw, Im thinking that its probably .325 pitch, but the gauge I would still imagine is .050.  The drive sprocket or rim can be changed out to run 3/8" pitch, and a new bar would be required too, but thats the only thing I can think of, as 3/8" is probably more common.  And like Al said, these things, along with parts in general, are not common to Stihl, or anyone else for that matter.  Is there anyway you would be able to fix some of the other things, like the chain brake, yourself, and maybe only have the shop do the more difficult stuff? 

[Al_Smith]

Repairs on saws are not that difficult . The biggest thing is if you want to learn how you have to have the desire to do so .Some do and some don't .

Those that have taken the time to learn are really surprised how easy it is once the get in the groove so to speak .

The same applies for so called genious tuners or enhancers of saw engines . Unknowledgable individuals will just act like teenage cheerleaders  for their favorite builder only to find out later there isn't that much to it . :D--you have to want to learn though .

[Damocles]

Is there anyway you would be able to fix some of the other things, like the chain brake, yourself, and maybe only have the shop do the more difficult stuff?  

Yes, definitely. In fact I asked one dealer if he could repair the vacuum leak and sell me the hand guard and bushings, filters, etc. He said no because he can't test it without everything being right... He may have a point. Frustrating though. Another guy said that was fine - but it wouldn't save much because he has to tear it down to scratch so doing the seals would be about $170. At that point, all the work I need to do should be done before it's put back together. So not a big savings in the end. Good thought though.

[JohnG28]

Well hopefully you can find some way to make this work out for you.  Worst case you buy a new saw, and I wouldnt really call that a worst case, always nice to get something new.  And if you decide not to keep the 280, someone will want it, everything has value to someone.  If you dont keep it, let me know, I might be willing to take it off your hands too.  Let us know what you decide, and if you have any problems deciding what to buy, theres plenty of people here that will steer you right. 8)

[Al_Smith]

I looked up a 280 and evidently it is a clam shell engine like a 270 from what I see on the IPL . Never the less of how it's made I certainly see no reason to peel it down to bare bones to change a couple of seals .

Generally speaking just removing the clutch and flywheel gets you in so you can jerk out the seal and install a new one .Then again I've never worked on a Stihl clam shell so that's just speculation on my my part . That said though I've changed a lot seals on about every saw ever made it's not a 170 dollar job for sure . Unless of course their labor rates are 200 an hour but then again things might be a little higher in NY state  for all I know . :D

[Damocles]

Al, do you want to do it? I'll mail it to ya!  ;D

Take your time - I have an ancient craftsman as a backup. It guzzles gas and weighs a ton - but it works.

[Al_Smith]

 Not really but if you search the forums I have several  threads on changing seals .

Nothing to it ,remove the clutch ,use a drywall screw to pull the seal and drive in a new one using a deep wall socket .Usually and especially on a 4 year old saw with no more hours than it would have ,if the seals would be bad more than likely it's the clutch side .

Now again if the anti vib mounts are bad it could likely have a torn intake  boot because the mounts being broken is usually what kills them .--never run a saw with a bad mount .

Thinking though ,4 years is about all you get from a carb innards with all the ethanol in the gas and that in itself might be the problem all along . A carb is easy to rebuild too in case you wondered .

[Damocles]

Drats! I am feeling another project coming on...

[ellmoe]

  Look at Bailey's for cheaper parts. I just saved over $100 on parts for my 460.

Mark

[bandmiller2]

Really life is too short to put up with homeowner type saws.Husky 365 is my go to saw it will do almost anything and its managable.Then as Al says, when you have a chance reseal your outher saw.With help from here its not too hard to do most saw repairs.Frank C.

[lumberjack48]

I can't understand having all these problems with a saw that's only cut 30 cords of wood up. I think the only air leak you have is the boot, I've had it come lose, if you have a bad mount you have pulled the boot lose. This a easy fix, loosen it up a little and slip it back on and tighten it back up, off and running. If it did tare replace it. As for as working on saws, just watch what your doing, learn as you go, take your time. There are a few good dealers but not many, they'll take advantage of people, if i seen once i seen it a 1000 times.
Like the guys say, if you want to pay to get fixed get your wallet out.
I ran saw 30 yrs, if i had to i would rebuild over night, back to logging in the morning
The trick is, if you can't fix it your self, buy a new one, run the hell out of it, just before warranty is up trade for a new one. about $100.00 to boot
If this is all the wood you cut in a year, you can rent a saw for $50.00 a day, 7 cords one day , done deal no up keep.
Behappy

[Al_Smith]

Oh my 7 cords in one day with a 280 sized saw would be a long day indeed .Fact is 7 cords with an 084 might be a shorter day but you would be just as tuckered out . :D