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How much to pay for some logs.

Started by oakiemac, October 15, 2003, 12:59:48 PM

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oakiemac

I've been given the opprotunity to buy some logs from a  local landowner who is dropping and skidding the logs. I've never bought logs before, so I thought I'd come to the source of information. Here's what's being offered: about 8, 8' long 12 to 16" dbh cherry logs; 6, 8' long 12 to 14"dbh Sasafrass and then some Pin Oak.
Does anyone have any idea what sasafrass lumber sells for? I know wood workers like it because of the unique grain patterns. Also is Pin Oak worth anything? The Cherry I know I can sell so I'm not worried about it.
I want to make this guy happy because he has a large track of huge Maples, Oaks, Aspen that he eventually wants to harvest and he doesn't trust any logging company because he got severly ripped off a few years back. Thanks for any help.
Oakie
Mobile Demension sawmill, Bobcat 873 loader, 3 dry kilns and a long "to do" list.

Ron Wenrich

Sassafras lumber used to be quoted as the same as red oak prices by the Hardwood Market Report.  I think you can do that good.  I've also seen it get lumped in with black ash.  

Pin oak isn't good for much more than low grade material.  It is prone to shake, mineral, has lots of knots and stinks.  I'm told it doesn't dry all that well.  

We saw it into RR ties and pallet cants.  What little good lumber there is can be sold as red oak grade, but it just doesn't look as good as red oak.
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

MemphisLogger

Ron's right on the pin oak--stinky, mineral stained, check prone junk. We sawed a couple logs last year and put it up to dry thinking that the mineral stain might be interesting but it's all stickers now.

The sassafras will fetch good dollar if it's wide, well figured and marketed directly to a woodworker.

Since it's not very abundant, big brokers probably won't show much interest.  
  
Scott Banbury, Urban logger since 2002--Custom Woodworker since 1990. Running a Woodmizer LT-30, a flock of Huskies and a herd of Toy 4x4s Midtown Logging and Lumber Company at www.scottbanbury.com

ARKANSAWYER

   I pay on the Doyle scale $500 mbdft for cherry and Sassy and $150 mbdft for pin oak if it is big enough to make a tie and does not have any shake.  Sassy air dries real well and goes for $1.25 bdft as fast as I can get it.   Saw some thick as it makes nice carvings and boat paddles.
ARKANSAWYER
ARKANSAWYER

oakiemac

Thank you all, this is the info that I needed. I might try and use the Pin Oak for some fencing that a friend wants me to cut for him.
Mobile Demension sawmill, Bobcat 873 loader, 3 dry kilns and a long "to do" list.

MemphisLogger

Be sure and tell him not to let 'em touch the ground--they'll rot in a heartbeat. I'd also advise using only one nail at each rail unless they're dry.  
Scott Banbury, Urban logger since 2002--Custom Woodworker since 1990. Running a Woodmizer LT-30, a flock of Huskies and a herd of Toy 4x4s Midtown Logging and Lumber Company at www.scottbanbury.com

Frank_Pender

Oakiemac, out here in Oregon I cut some 1000 + board feet of Pin Oak last Summber and have sold it for $5.00 a board foot.   :)  I acquired the logs from one of my students who is not in the tree service business, from free.  8) I did have to pay for them to be hauled by a self-loader friend, for $120.  ;D The lumber was made into 5/4 by 8" x 12'.   A lady wanted it all for plank flooring for her house remodel. :)
Frank Pender

oakiemac

All right Frank, how in the world did you get somebody to buy Pin Oak at $5.00 a board foot??? >:( I sell clear northern red Oak for around $1.00bdft. You must be a good salesman. ;D
Mobile Demension sawmill, Bobcat 873 loader, 3 dry kilns and a long "to do" list.

Jeff

$5.00! WoW  it must cost a mint to live out west. We sell pin oak here for 50 cents BF
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

DanG

OK, I got a question along a similar line. :P

A guy up the road has cut down a bunch of pecan trees. I talked with him yesterday, and we agreed that I can buy some or all of the logs, but we have to settle on a price. The only problem is, he has cut them up into approx. 6' pieces, so he could skid them with his little tractor. ???  Boy, I wish I could have talked to him sooner.  The six footers will still be ok for cabinet and furniture wood, I think, but I feel the logs are worth less bucked that way. How much should I deduct from the price, and how much are pecan logs going for these days?  The logs I'll be taking range from 14" to 20" and it looks like 25 or 30 of them are worthwhile. :)
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

Ron Wenrich

He certainly didn't do you any favors.   On the open market, you won't get any better than 1 Com for that lumber, unless you can find someone buying on the Select grade.  

Pecan gets sold with the hickory markets at the commercial side.  I saw one mill that was paying $280/Mbf on the Doyle scale for logs like that.  

You could back into by saying that log prices = lumber prices less expenses.  But, you have to know your expenses and have a good feel for the market value for pecan.  Market value would depend on yield.  Your expenses also have to include profit and carrying costs.  Many mills don't have a grasp of their expenses.

Now, if Frank used this formula, he could pay big bucks for pin oak.   :D
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Captain

When buying logs I generally consult my tree service friend who sells a lot to local mills when he does lot clearing.  He does right by me as he will usually drop a partial load of lower quality softwood here rather than dispose of it elsewhere.  

I know what the commercial sawmills are paying here in the area.  We have SO MUCH Eastern White Pine here, that I can get all I want for free, therefore I do not pay for it, but I will haul it away.  For hardwood, I will pay between 200-400 per MBF depending on quality LESS TRANSPORTATION COSTS.  Logs that are further away are worth less to me if I have to spend 2hrs making a round trip for them.  I hauled 960 BF of some nice red oak from 18 miles away last week, and the customer's net payment was $0.11/BF.  

I took Arky's advice on questionable logs and started not paying until they were sawn.  Tough to justify top dollar for an oak log with a checked pith or a Maple log with tramp metal or ceramic insulators in it.  I am not good enough yet to tell what they will look like when they are opened up.  On caveat to this rule is that I can not always cut the stuff immediately, and will sometimes break this rule and pay to keep the seller happy.  I've been burned.

The toughest thing for me is keeping up with hauling logs with my old 1 ton truck using the "parbuckling" method with a winch.  I really need a log loader to put on my old fire truck chassis, but its all money........

Captain

DanG

I'm thinking of offering about $200mbf Doyle for my pick of the logs.  Pecan is popular for cabinets in this area, and I already have individuals asking about small amounts for home projects. My expenses will be minimal, since it is only 2 miles up the road, access is easy(drive right up to them), and the logs are clean. It will be nice to cut something that hasn't been dragged through the mud. :)  These logs are straight with little taper, so they should yield nicely.
He also has a nice Red Oak that is sickly, and he wants me to help take it down, so I can buy that one as well. It is about 16" dbh, with 25-30 ft of clear, straight log.
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

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