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Forwarders

Started by Horselog, February 27, 2010, 12:18:53 PM

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Horselog

Wondering if anyone has experience with smaller forwarders, like maybe an Iron Mule, Franklin 132, or Hanover.  I'm trying to gather some basic information on them, like how much they weigh, what's their average payload, what's the capacity of their loaders.  Would these loaders be feasible to use loading log trucks?  What kind of rig would you need to haul one?  I've seen some people hauling them with 1 ton trucks and tandem dual flatbeds, wondering if this is really a good option.

Any other pertinent information would be good.
Benjamin Harris
Appalachian Mountains of Virginia
horse_logger@me.com

treefarmer87

a buddy of mine had a iron mule and sold it, he says he wishes he never would have sold it because it takes care of two machines you skidder and loader, he would take it in the woods cut em down, cut to length, load them, the go load the truck. he is still trying to find one but he doesnt want to spend too much, and they are kinda scarce around here
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Bobus2003

I have been lookin too buy a JD440 Forwarder. Small and not aot heavier than the Skidder so its still haulable with a 1 ton Pick-up and GN trailer. Found many small machines in Wisconsin.

Blue Sky

I picked up a Franklin in '97. Don't know the actual year it was made because there are no serial numbers anywhere.  I think it is either a '72 or'73.  A 132. Wonderfully small compared to the behemoths of today.  I can get around 1200 bf on its bunk .  12' bed, maneuver easily in the woods and load flat beds.  I use a low bed.  It still is heavy and I do not want to risk its life or others.   Enchanted Forester

woodmills1

check the metavic trailers at

payeur.com


there are also other forwarding trailer, I have one it is sweet
James Mills,Lovely wife,collect old tools,vacuuming fool,36 bdft/hr,oak paper cutter,ebonic yooper rapper nauga seller, Blue Ox? its not fast, 2 cat family, LT70,edger, 375 bd ft/hr, we like Bob,free heat,no oil 12 years,big splitter, baked stuffed lobster, still cuttin the logs dere IAM

barbender

The outfit I hauled for this winter would build a 3 feet high ramp to load off of with the forwarder, and this is a new John Deere. With the high bunk trailers popular around here, its hard to see the top of the load. But if your trailers aren't real high, or your loading flatbeds, one of those small forwarders would be dandy. One of the members on here has an Iron Mule, I can't remember who it was, but if you do a search it should come up.
Too many irons in the fire

pasbuild

If it can't be nailed or glued then screw it

Frickman

I have a Tree Farmer C5-D that's a handy machine but I wish I would have gotten an Iron Mule as it's be a little smaller. I use it to load trucks and it works great. It's a little too big to manuever in the woods though so I just use it to haul prebunched piles to the road. It's still smaller than many of the new units out there. I don't know how you could maunever one of those unless you're in real nice terrain.
If you're not broke down once in a while, you're not working hard enough

I'm not a hillbilly. I'm an "Appalachian American"

Retired  Conventional hand-felling logging operation with cable skidder and forwarder, Frick 01 handset sawmill

Pretend farmer when I have the time

Horselog

What size trucks were you loading?  Did you ever have any big logs that were a problem for the loader?
Benjamin Harris
Appalachian Mountains of Virginia
horse_logger@me.com

mad murdock

My brothers and I had a logging business in northern Wisc. back in the late 70's thru the early '90's, we had both a Iron Mule 4501, bought in new in 1982. It was the smallest model they made, and could haul 1 1/2 cords of wood per load.  The machine weighed about 18,000 lbs, and had a 3 cyl. perkins diesel, was easy on fuel and was a nice mahcine, though we were pretty hard on it by routinely overloading it, instead of pacing ourselves, and working within it's limitations, always trying to get out more wood.  It withstood the abuse pretty well, but about 2 years in, we had to replace all of the planetaries, which in that year of machine were kind of a pain ot deal with, as they were inside rather than outside planetaries.  I think that the 5000 series mules are better as they are a bit bigger, and built to take 2-2 1/2 cords a load.  the 4501 had a 16 ft boom loader, and we routinely loaded trailers with it.  It did a fine job.  Later my brother traded it off towards a Franklin 132 pak-a-bak, and it was a machine of a forwarder!  Had a Hawk loader mounted on the cab with a 20 ft boom, and could haul 3 cords at a whack!  the machine weighed 26,000 empty.  to move either one, you needed a low-boy and tractor.  The Franlkin was built like a tank, and took anything we put at it.  It had a 100 HP turbo Allis-Chalmers engine.  It was a wide machine, and depending on what you are doing with the forwarder, the 'mule is better suited to select cuts and working in areas where you want to leave "no" trace, so to speak.  It is much more maneuverable than the Franklin, and is less expensive to feed as well.
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Frickman

I'm loading different types of trucks, different sizes clear up to double bunk log trailers and don't have a problem. Any 16' log that I get my grapple around I can pick up. If it's a big oak I may have to keep it close to the machine, but I can still pick it up. I have only had a few, maybe four or five, logs that I could not pick up in ten years. Those were 30"+ diameter tulip poplar and oak that the grapple did not fit around very well. I used another loader, a skidder, and the forwarder to load those.
If you're not broke down once in a while, you're not working hard enough

I'm not a hillbilly. I'm an "Appalachian American"

Retired  Conventional hand-felling logging operation with cable skidder and forwarder, Frick 01 handset sawmill

Pretend farmer when I have the time

Ron Scott

There are a lot of Iron Mule photos in the Harvest Methods and Equipment thread. I have a 4510 working a job now.
~Ron

wi woodcutter

I seen a Iron Mule for sale in the Wisconsin State Farmer. They wanted 16,500 for it.
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Horselog

Good info. guys, thanks.  It sounds like a 4500 series would suit my situation best, smaller jobs and maneuverability being things I deal with a lot.  So you figure the 4510 weighs ~18k?  I heard on some other thread that they weigh  12k or something like that.  Maybe that's a different machine?

How would a 4510 do hauling a few 16 footers every now and then?

One of my goals in having a forwarder would be to have a 2 in 1 machine, loader and forwarder.  Sounds like that would work, my log truck is just a straight truck, and most of my jobs a much bigger truck couldn't access anyway.

What are the main things to break/wear out on a machine like the Iron Mule? 
Benjamin Harris
Appalachian Mountains of Virginia
horse_logger@me.com

Horselog

And what about parts availability on Iron Mule's?
Benjamin Harris
Appalachian Mountains of Virginia
horse_logger@me.com

Ron Scott

QuoteHow would a 4510 do hauling a few 16 footers every now and then?

No problem, we carry some up to 17 foot maximum. A few now and then with smaller ones loaded on top to hold them down.
~Ron

Reddog

Quote from: Horselog on March 02, 2010, 10:06:13 PM
And what about parts availability on Iron Mule's?


Depending on the model it is Massey Ferguson or Ford tractor parts for most of it.
The hydraulics are off the shelf parts.

Ron Scott

None seem to have much down time and parts are readily available, at least in this area.
~Ron

barbender

The Iron Mules seem to hold their value really well, too.
Too many irons in the fire

quietrangr

I have a 5000 Mule. The weight is 14,880 (from the book), with 23.1 tires. Mine weighs more because I put a Hood 418 loader on it. The 4500 weighs 13,500; the 4000 weighs 13,030. I drive mine most places, but have had it hauled by a one ton dually with a fifth wheel trailer.

Roland Equipment in Escanaba MI is the place for any parts you can't get locally. I also get parts from the Ford tractor dealer, and the auto parts store.

With the original loader I came across quite a few logs I couldn't lift. I lifted one end, wrapped a chain around, and skidded them to the landing. With the Hood loader, I've lifted all, but one four foot diameter oak I had to wrap with a chain because the clam couldn't grip it. I've hauled up to 24 foot length, but these have to be positioned on the outside of the bunk with other logs beneath them. It actually hauls long ones better than forwarders with headache racks.

The Hanover is an OK machine. It's component made, unlike a Mule, which is engine, transmission and differential all in one unit. Replacing a clutch means pulling the engine. Pulling the axle housings is a major task. The rear of the machine has to be jacked up out of the frame. You have to remove the cab. The brakes run in oil, and only work on the fronts. They do not work very well, IMO.

The original loader is short, and you have to park pretty close to the pile or the truck. It can be difficult to bang your ends even.

quietrangr

A couple more things: The hydraulic valves are made by Gresen, and are fairly easy to get parts for. The cylinders are oddball lengths, but can be replaced with standard lengths, and a little work on the mounts.

A recurring problem on my machine is wearing out of the bearings on the turn knuckle in the center of the machine. To replace them is close to a day job, and a couple hundred bucks for one set of bearings. There are two sets. On mine, the vertical pin bearings need replacing every year and a half or so. Consider yourself lucky if the pin isn't damaged beyond repair. These pins are something like two and a half by 14 inches.

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