Do it yourself blade sharpening, or send-em out?

[panman]

Just wondering if it's cost effective, and that much of a hassle to sharpen your own blades?
Or should a guy just get in the habit of sending them out.
Gotta tell you, I like to be involved with everything I do, and I make, fix, and repair about everything I use.
Anyone have a used sharpener for sale?
Jim

[Chuck White]

Hello Panman and welcome to the Forestry Forum. 

I bought a sharpener and setter last June, and over the summer and into the early fall I had set and sharpened 95 bands for my mill.
Now that wasn't 95 individual bands, it was obviously several of the same bands over and over!

The way I figured it, it would cost around $7.00 per band, counting shipping and everything to send them to resharp.
Now I have my own sharpener and setter, and my outfit will be paid for before I sharpen 400 bands.

I would recommend that if you have the time, get your own sharpener and setter. 

Look around, you may find a used one in good condition!

[Magicman]

Depends upon how many blades you will dull in what length of time to determine cost effectiveness.

Do you want to spend your spare time "sharpening" or "fishing".....      Seriously, it can't take too much time to sharpen, but I still use that time "fishing"..... :D

[bandmiller2]

Jim,it depends how much milling your planing to do if just for your own use it may not pay. Try resharp for a wile and look for a used setup you can make a setter if you find a grinder.I sharpened bands for a wile by hand with a shaped stone on a bench grinder,that gets old fast,but is doable.Frank C.

[bandmiller2]

Jim,it depends how much milling your planing to do if just for your own use it may not pay. Try resharp for a wile and look for a used setup you can make a setter if you find a grinder.I sharpened bands for a wile by hand with a shaped stone on a bench grinder,that gets old fast,but is doable.Frank C.

[moonhill]

I also sharpen with a bench grinder and find it not "getting old fast", it works and well.  It takes 6 minutes, and that is the max time, to sharpen one band, that is twice around with a light sharpening.  You don't need a mass produced sharpener, small scale sawyers should try this method as an alternative.  You need to be able to shape the grinding wheel just right, this is the most time consuming part, as I imagine it is with the other grinders out there.  I get 12" long sample blades sent with my bands to test the grinding wheel with.   I have been using this method for 15 years.   

Tim

[wewacountryboy]

I also sharpen with a bench grinder and find it not "getting old fast", it works and well.  It takes 6 minutes, and that is the max time, to sharpen one band, that is twice around with a light sharpening.  You don't need a mass produced sharpener, small scale sawyers should try this method as an alternative.  You need to be able to shape the grinding wheel just right, this is the most time consuming part, as I imagine it is with the other grinders out there.  I get 12" long sample blades sent with my bands to test the grinding wheel with.   I have been using this method for 15 years.   

Tim

Moodhill

Do you have any pictures of your grinder?

[Tom]

I started off sharpening my own because I knew of no company that sharpened the bands.

What I learned from doing that is that everyone should sharpen their bands and not necessarily use the economics as a reason.  Yes, I found it much cheaper and more reliable to do it myself, but I have always felt better being in control of myself than farming it out anyway.

When you use good sharpening gear, you learn what makes a band cut.  You can judge whether it was sharpened properly or where the other person missed the mark.  It's an education that every sawyer should treat  himself to whether he sends his bands out to be sharpened or not.

I generally used two and sometimes three bands a day.  When I got home, I went straight to the sharpener and set and sharpened those bands.  It took about an hour and most of that time was on the sharpener, slowly polishing the tips of each tooth.  Usually I finished well inside of the hour, but it was enjoyable, wind-down time.

As my workday lengthened, I began stocking bands and sharpening on the weekends.  That's when it could become drudgery.  But, if I found that I wasn't in the  mood, Sharpening three bands assured me of another day of sawing and I went fishing.   It's being able to be my own master that is important to me.  

I also was able to play around with configurations and found it fun.

If you can justify the cost of a sharpener, you are being remiss if you don't get one and use it.

[Chuck White]

Absolutely agree with Tom's philosophy.  ;)

I usually get home from a day's sawing right around supper time.
When supper is over, I'd retreat to the garage and sharpen the days bands.  Sometimes it's 2 and other times it's 3.
I, like Tom, also find this to be a relaxing period of time!
Then I take those bands and put them in the back of the box.  I usually rotate sawing with either 5 or 6 bands.

[Brucer]

I have a slightly different perspective than Tom.

I know myself well enough to know that I simply do not have the patience to spend that little extra bit of time to get it just right. I have no trouble with one-time setups, getting things just so. But with repetitive tasks, I'm hopeless.

So I accept that I will have to give up that extra bit of control and the ability to experiment. I admire people that can take the extra bit of time, and I understand why they will do things differently.

For me the bottom line is, I'm more productive sawing than sharpening and setting.

[sdunston]

I sharpen and set my own blades. I like others find it to be relaxing an it gives you a close look at what is going on and seeing the teeth that are broken and trying to remember what ya hit. I sharpen for myself and no one else I think that would make it a job in stead of fun 8)
Sam

[Dave Shepard]

I'm from the other side, I send all our bands back to WM Resharp. They do several operations to the band above and beyond sharpening and setting. I think I figured it to be about $8 with shipping. If there's a bad band, they replace it. Chuck White, you said you'd have it paid for in 400 bands, does that include a wage for your time at the sharpener? Just curious.

[moonhill]

I also sharpen with a bench grinder and find it not "getting old fast", it works and well.  It takes 6 minutes, and that is the max time, to sharpen one band, that is twice around with a light sharpening.  You don't need a mass produced sharpener, small scale sawyers should try this method as an alternative.  You need to be able to shape the grinding wheel just right, this is the most time consuming part, as I imagine it is with the other grinders out there.  I get 12" long sample blades sent with my bands to test the grinding wheel with.   I have been using this method for 15 years.   

Tim

Moodhill

Do you have any pictures of your grinder?

Sometimes I do find I am moody.

I just don't do pictures on the FF.  I do have a video and will try to get it onto U-tube in a few days.  Stand by.

Tim

[pineywoods]

I have a sharpener, if I didn't I would build myself one. Setting one tooth at a time can get to be a pain, so I'm going to build myself a dual-tooth setter. I pile my dull blades in the sawshed until I get down to the last sharp blade, the take a bunch of time to sharpen a dozen or so.  ;D
Whether to sharpen your ownn or send them out ?? I think there is no definite answer, I can advantages for both ways. Just depends on time available more than anything else. Definitely can make more money sawing than sharpening blades if you have enough sawing to consume all the available time. Like Tom said, there is a learning curve, that can be very beneficial..

[bandmiller2]

Moonhill Tim,when you grind the bands do you use anything to support the bands overhead.??I always wanted to put a wooden roller over the grinder so holding and feeding into the grinder wouldn't be so tiring on the wrist.Timberwolf had the directions for modifying a bench grinder,don't know if they still have them,they even had a vidio.Frank C.

[panman]

Just curious, I have a number of tooth setters for hand saws, anybody ever try one on a band saw blade.
Jim

[Chuck White]

Chuck White, you said you'd have it paid for in 400 bands, does that include a wage for your time at the sharpener? Just curious.

Dave; I am just figuring the "dollars"!
My sharpener and setter cost me $2,455.00 to my door.
I'm figuring around $7.00 for resharp of one blade.

$2,455.00 ÷ & $7.00 = 350.xxx blades to come out near even.
Now, myself, I enjoy the time spent sharpening and setting, much as my enjoyment while sawing. 
I also come away with the satisfaction of knowing I sharpened the blades that work so nice.
You can't really put a $ figure on something that you enjoy doing!

[backwoods sawyer]

I am with Tom on this as well. I have spent time working under a sawfiler from Holland while in the production mill, and feel that the more you do in house the more control you have over your whole operation, I don't farm out my millwright, or electrical work either.
Where I differ from Tom is that I keep about 50 saws on hand and hang them from the rafters, folded up. When the 4x4 marked "Dull" starts getting full I schedule some time for sharpening saws. I like to do them in batches of 20-30 saws. When I pull a saw off the mill, I make notes on it with a felt marker so I know what to look for on sharpening day. I also keep track of the saws cutting history. I like to be the one who decides when a saw is due to be replaced and when to take a little extra time to see if it can be salvaged as well.
When I bought my mill the sharpener was disassembled in a box all rusted up in a corner of his shop with several parts missing, so I sent the first saws out to a local saw shop, they came back with badly burnt teeth and course grinding marks on them. The first cut cost me a $100 log as that saw took a 6" dive before braking. I went in right then and there and ordered the parts to get my sharpener up and running and have not sent a saw out for sharpening since.

[barbender]

I have a jig I set up for a bench grinder that work ok, it needs a little tweaking. I finally sent a box of blades to a saw outfit cause I was shot on time, I thought they did a very poor job. They only touched the face of the tooth, burned the teeth, and they didn't clean the blades  so I doubt they set the teeth. And it only took 2 months to get the blades back. :( Needless to say I wasn't real impressed. I will never do business with them again, whether it is sharpening or buying blades.  I do a better job with the bench grinder.

[Dave Shepard]

WM will resharpen any of their blades, and they will make blades in custom lengths. I have not had any problems with the ReSharp program.

[coastlogger]

Question: when you guys (Moonhill, others?) say you go around twice do you do the whole profile on the second pass or just the back of tooth. Somewhere Ive read they cut best if back is tweaked last.
I too would not want others messing with my bands.
clgr

[Jim_Rogers]

Interesting post.....

When we first starting milling there was no resharp program at WM. So we had to do it ourselves.

Which we did for many years, until the resharp program came out. When it first came out they said you "had to" send in two boxes of ten at a time. Well to do that you had to have two boxes to send in, and two to have on hand while the first two were being sharpened. And maybe even another one just in case. So that's 5 boxes at $200 a box (back then).

I didn't have the money to do that, as I didn't have $1000 to put into blades. So we continued to sharpen and set our own.

Well the setting part is a real drag for sure. At least to me. So I tried one of the crank setters where you turn the crank and it sets both left and right teeth and then moves on. What a piece of junk, at least to me it was. I shouldn't say that too loud I think someone from the forum bought it from me, years and years ago.

The was no way to check the set to make sure it was setting it enough, and adjusting it to set correctly wasn't easy at all.

Later on I was at a pre-logging equipment show seminar being held by WM at Springfield MA, and they asked who was sharping themselves and who was using resharp......

Well the speaker pointed to one owner in the back and asked him why he didn't raise his hand and vote.....

He said he didn't know how to vote as he was using blades until dull and then grinding them himself. After a couple of grinding he would put them back in the box and send them in. And let them be cleaned, set, and resharpened correctly......

What a great idea, I said to myself.....I can do that.....

So now I grind a few times and then after the set has been mostly ground out, I send them back. I haven't set a blade in years and years, but I grind some all the time.

It made a great improvement in my blade performance and greatly reduced the amount of blades I used per year.....

Well sorry for the long post but that's the story from here.....

[dmulac]

Well you first have to answer honestly are you running a business or just a hobby? If it is a hobbythensharpen your own but, if you are running a business then sharpening is an expense. Also, as someone pointed out, are you getting paid to sharpen them?? I send all my blades out as I run as a business.

[John Bartley]

Well you first have to answer honestly are you running a business or just a hobby? If it is a hobby then sharpen your own but, if you are running a business then sharpening is an expense. Also, as someone pointed out, are you getting paid to sharpen them?? I send all my blades out as I run as a business.

There really are several questions that need honest answers : Do you make more sawing than you pay to sharpen? If you do, then a resharp service is a justifiable expense. If you don't, then a resharp service is an expense that can be eliminated to increase profits. Also: do you enjoy sharpening your own? and do you sometimes sharpen to suit the wood? If the answer to either of these is "yes", then you might want to sharpen at least a few of your own. And: do you just plain "hate" sharpening? If so, then send them out.

There's no "one size fits all" answer

cheers

John (I clean, set and sharpen my own - and there's nobody hereabouts who'll do a "decent" sharpening job for less than $15-$20/band)

[panman]

I'm sure I'll be sharpening my own, sooner than later.
I like be involved in all aspects of everything I do, doesn't matter if it's cost effective or not.
I'd like to see a few pics of your homemade grinders, if I can I'll probably fab up my own.
Jim