Need Help to Toung and Groove

[wewacountryboy]

I feel like I'm beating a broken horse here, but I can't find a simple answer. I have read many post of how to toung and grove flooring. I have an 18" powermatic planer. I have looked at the 4 sided molders and they look great only if the price was a little lower. I plan to toung and grove around 5000 foot a month. Any help or ideas would be great.

[brdmkr]

You might be able to get by with a shaper and power feeder, but I supect that would get old pretty quick.  Are you going to relief cut the backs? 

I intended to cut my own flooring using a woodmaster planer molder with a router attachement.  I decided against it given the time that would have been required relative to the money I would have saved.

[beenthere]

5000 ft a month will be a lot of extra work without the right machine.

If it was flooring for your own use, then being off on the tolerances might be tolerable. But sounds like you will be marketing flooring, and will need closer tolerances for good fit (hard to get with hand work and running pieces one face or edge at a time past a shaping head.

I think it is an investment you won't regret.

[wewacountryboy]

5000 ft a month will be a lot of extra work without the right machine.

If it was flooring for your own use, then being off on the tolerances might be tolerable. But sounds like you will be marketing flooring, and will need closer tolerances for good fit (hard to get with hand work and running pieces one face or edge at a time past a shaping head.

I think it is an investment you won't regret.

What machine would you use?

[red oaks lumber]

wewa,
we make between 15-20,000 sq. of floor per month if you arent setup with all the right equipment you will struggle not only with the volume but, your quality will also suffer. flooring is the highest toleranced product made.you'll need a gang rip saw of some make, a doulble sided planer, at least a 5 head moulder of some make.
you can for go the first 2 peices of equipment if you buy your flooring already in presized blanks. are you planning on endmatching your floor? if so then you will need one of those also, before you endmatch you'll have to defect cut every peice, you'll need one of those as well. even if you can find all good used equipment you can spend $50-100,000 plus all the duct work in the shop.
to answer your question regaurding t&g flooring there is no magic pill with that volumn, sorry.

[wewacountryboy]

I guess that's what I needed to know. I have toung and grooved a 1000 board foot of 6" cyrpess with 2 routers in a jig I built. It took forever to do it. I burned up 2 routers and went through 5 sets of bits.

[Logosol Steve]

Hi wewacountryboy,

Not sure if you have checked out our two-sided planer/moulder or not. If money is a concern this may suit you. Here is the link http://www.logosol.com/planers/dh410/   Let me know if you have any further questions.

Steve

[Dodgy Loner]

wewa - It sounds like something is wrong. My dad and I T&G'ed 1600 lineal feet of white ash and 500 lineal feet of cherry a few years back using the same bits and router. Last fall I dusted off the bits again and made another 100 B.F. of T&G cedar for wainscoting, and the surface was still excellent. I've never had to sharpen the bits.

Are you trying to hog off all the material in one pass? Routers aren't built for that kind of treatment. I usually use 3 passes for T&G: The first pass removes about 1/2 the material; the second pass cleans up most, but not quite all, of what's left; the third, and final, pass removes just a whisker of material and leaves a perfect finish.

Good luck, I know how T&Ging with simple tools can test the patience, but I do enjoy sitting back and seeing the product of my labor

[moonhill]

I have done some T&Ging with a router in a table with a stock feeder.  It is a pain.  I have switched to a slot cutter, 1/4" x 9/16" deep.  I gang cut free splines then feed them through the planer and hand route the grove in the edge of the board or plank as it goes down.  It does the job I need. I am not doing 5000' a month either. 

Tim

[ARKANSAWYER]

  I used to make T&G flooring and siding with my Grizzly shaper and carbide bits.  It was some work and had to take some time getting every thing right.  Now I have a LOGOSOL PH260.  It is much faster and does alot better job.  Boards need to be sized and skipped planed before feeding in but in one pass they are done.  We do around 30 to 40 mbdft a year in flooring and most if it is wide pine.  I would not like to feed it much hickory with out carbide bits but it will cut it.  For the coin it is the best buy. 
  Also Baker has the M412 ( it is amazing what I know) which is knock off of the PH260 but does go a bit wider.

[Cedarman]

Since flooring is 6" or less wide, I would look for a small moulder.  There are some used ones out there for less than 10 grand.  I bought a Dominion 2x6 about 10 years ago.  One of my best investment.  It will run at about 25 feet per minute.  Takes a bit to learn the set ups.  Don't ever get in a hurry.  Take your time and get it right.  Once right, takes very little to keep it right.
I only do cedar so do not cut a arelief notch.  I preplane, straight line 15 to 20 boards at a time on the WM.  Run the wood through the molder and then through a small grizzly sander to get rid of any molder marks.

You will need a dust collection system.  You can do that for a few thousand dollars.  Electrical will be a fair expense.  Don't forget that.

[JD350Cmark]

 
( it is amazing what I know)

ARKY - you're gonna do well in politics..  ;D

WEWA - I have been doing a lot of T & G ing lately.  I plane the material and then run it through a shaper with power feeder.  I have to run the entire batch through cutting one side, either the tongue or the groove and switch the cutters and do the other side.  Lots of set up, running test pieces.  If I did much more I'd want a tool that could do all of this in one pass.  I like doing it & like the finished product.

Here is some Fir flooring I did a couple months ago.

[wewacountryboy]

  Now I have a LOGOSOL PH260.  It is much faster and does alot better job.  Boards need to be sized and skipped planed before feeding in but in one pass they are done.  We do around 30 to 40 mbdft a year in flooring and most if it is wide pine.  I would not like to feed it much hickory with out carbide bits but it will cut it.  For the coin it is the best buy. 
  Also Baker has the M412 ( it is amazing what I know) which is knock off of the PH260 but does go a bit wider.

That's a sweet machine, and it's in my price range!