Hows your drag back hangin,,

[robnrob2]

O.k. Now that I got my Hydrolic feed dialed in I built my Board drag back system, and it works well, I have it set up so I can stow it  easily by pulling on a cable and its up out of the way,,
Couple of things tho,, I think I now know why WM uses basicly angle iron, for the lack of a better term, on theres,, at 1st mine was just streight down, and as I was pulling the board back, of course as it was comming off the cant, it would begin to raise up,, so I pulled the 1/2" pin and removed it, and added a piece of 2" fat bar { I love falt bar } across the top of the 1"
flat bar,, that now keeps the board from raising up,,, Most of the time this system will be used with a helper,, I can see where its benaficial on the opening cuts,,,
O.K. the other thing,, I made the drag back arm hang down below the blade by 1" so of course when I drag back the board I gotta raise the blade by 1 1/2"

How low does ya'll's hang below the blade,,,

[Fla._Deadheader]

We used individual bars, 3-4, can't remember. They are ¾" below the blade. When we bump up the blade for return, it engages the board as you gig back / They swing just past center, so it kinds wipes the board off the cant ???  Hardly ever use it, though. It's bungee'd up out of the way.

  An offbearer works MUCH better.  : ;D ;D ;D

[Chuck White]

Had a drag-back on my mill (previous owner(s) made/installed), but I tried it for a while and it just wasn't doing anything for me, so I removed it and it now hangs on my garage wall!

I like the off-bearer, like Fla._Deadheader. 8)

[coastlogger]

I have never even seen a drag back so have a couple of questions.:Why do you have to raise the blade if you are dragging the just cut board out of the way?If you are cutting anything thicker than the drag back"s "protrusion"wouldnt you just leave height alone and gig back? Just trying to get a clearer picture in my mind of how this could work for me.
Other question is,without a dragback,I have seen several references to raising blade before giging back. Does everyone(except me) do this all the time?? I often dont raise between cuts unless blade was rising  or doing bad things.Im just real careful until back of band is "started" back over cut face. I find this tells me whether I had a climbing prob on last cut as well as by watching blade on way back ,its action"plowing"residual sawdust kind of tells if cut was wavy or not. Just wondering if others do this or??

[Fla._Deadheader]

  We found that "sometimes" there might be a SLIGHT crown on the board. When you stop cutting with the blade still hovering over the log-cant, I suppose IF the blade is stopped, you could gig back without bumping up.

  We NEVER stop the blade running, unless there is a problem.

  Drag backs, you must run the blade out of the log-cant, until the drag fingers drop down to allow them to engage the board on gig back.

[ely]

i do that too coastlogger, sometimes i think it may dull the few teeth that touch the cant, but i rarely raise the band up on return..

[Tom]

A running band brought back through the kerf or resting on the cant has all the possibilities available to be pulled off of the band wheel.   There is nothing to prevent it when going in reverse, as there is when going forward.

A stopped band, ie Woodmizer's braked and clutched band,  is less apt to be pulled from the band wheels, but there is still nothing holding the band on.

The raising of the blade on gig back clears the blade from contact with the cant.  The dragbacks are usually hanging 1/2" below the band so that 1/2" is all that they need to be raised to clear the cant.  It doesn't really matter how far they hang below the band as long as you are aware of how high you need to raise them.  The further below the band the dragbacks hang, the safer the band will be on gig back.

I have found dragbacks to be one of the most convenient tools that have been put on a bandmill.  If you operate remotely, there will be times when the end of the slab might be too thin to drag back, but for most slabs and boards the dragback works fine.  Even with an off bearer, it makes his job easier by delivering the board to him at the end of the mill. 

I never was fond of having anyone, even the off bearer at the foot of the mill and cutting toward him.  The reason is that a broken band or a band that comes off of the wheels is more apt to go in his direction.  I also don't care for his having to reach toward a running band to grasp a board.  With the off bearer at the entry point of the band, he is far away from the running equipment when he reaches for the board.

[Chuck White]

I have seen several references to raising blade before giging back. Does everyone(except me) do this all the time?? I often dont raise between cuts unless blade was rising  or doing bad things.Im just real careful until back of band is "started" back over cut face. I find this tells me whether I had a climbing prob on last cut as well as by watching blade on way back ,its action"plowing"residual sawdust kind of tells if cut was wavy or not.

I disengage the blade everytime at the end of each cut.
I also just bump the blade up about ½".  I find that if I drag the blade through the sawdust on the cant, it ends up stuck on the blade belts!
I can see where coming back through the sawdust will instantly show a wavy problem, if there is one!  I usually just rub my hand down the cant and find waves that way, if they're there!

[Banjo picker]

I would say Cooks hang down about 1/2 inch...I usually cut by my self and would hate to do without it...Without going to look I think there are 6 fingers of 1/2 x 2 inch plate 14 or so inches long...Tim

[Dave Shepard]

When sawing on the manual mill with an off bearer, I stop the band, and slide back under the board. Never had a band come off, and it keeps the off bearer hopping. :D

[coastlogger]

Sooo why do drag backs hang below band? Seems to me they could actually be a bit above band and still drag a board of any thickness back?

[DR Buck]

I love my drag back and use it all the time.   The WM version has an adjustable range at the bottom end of the drag back.  I keep it about 1/4" below the blade.  That way I only need to "bump-up" the head before I start the dragback.

Board return Mod for WoodMizer

Command control, dragbacks and working alone

[DR Buck]

Sooo why do drag backs hang below band? Seems to me they could actually be a bit above band and still drag a board of any thickness back?

Only till your blade comes off.  :D :D :D :D    Ask Dan Shade about this.  I think he has experience in this area.  :D ;) :D ;) :D ;) :D

[Banjo picker]

Sooo why do drag backs hang below band? Seems to me they could actually be a bit above band and still drag a board of any thickness back?

Go back and read some of the previous quotes....I stop the band....I start back real slow...

When I am sawing I just about never stop the band and I rarely throttle it down...Just a bump on the computer ...up she comes and back at you...in a heartbeat...Tim

[Brucer]

The Wood-Mizer manual says 1/4" below the blade.

[robnrob2]

This is the info I'm a needen,, Also I went and read the other  drag back info that Dr_Buck posted,,
I may have my drag back a bit to long, but nothin a chopsaw and welder cant fix,, Many of you mentioned the safty issue and bein carefull with it,, I absolutely agree with that,, but with the Hydrolic feed, the main concern I would have and I am aware of it, is, if draging the board back, and this would be working alone,, that the board could drop down into a bunk, { but thats why we have other wood, or ply to cover the bunks } or possibly hit a fence or just what have you, and Oh S_ _ T ,, A train wreck,,

[Magicman]

I was just wondering if/why you felt it necessary to remove each board as you saw.  Especially when sawing alone.

[Chuck White]

I go along with MagicMan.
Like I said before, I don't use the board return!

Once in a great while, I'll saw a log or two by myself.
I leave the cant there and the sawed boards on top until the whole cant is done!
The only place I would forsee a problem would be the additional running of the up/down motor!

[pineywoods]

I don't have a drag back, wouldn't use it if I did. Can't see any use for it when sawing alone. With an off bearer, a drag back might be usefull, but I don't have that luxury and probably never will. I'm gettin too old and feeble to pull off every board, so I just saw like MM and Chuck, then lift the stack off with a fork lift.

[bandmiller2]

We have a dragback on the LT-70 pinned up never used.Worked offbearing with a fella that has a big timber harvestor he always used drag you got to be carefull sometimes the slab or board will veer off and get you ,or pinch your fingers between some part of the mill.If you have rollers you can pull back a good sized timber.It does keep everything at one end of the mill.Frank C.

[Magicman]

As information, WM's Operator Manual states:  "WARNING!  The automatic board return is intended to assist a second operator in removing boards quickly.  Do not use the board return when operating the sawmill alone.  Serious injury, death or damage to the equipment may result".

I realize that many sawyers use this feature when sawing alone and apparently safely.  That's their option, and I respect it.

Very soon after I bought my mill, I removed the board return.  It limited the size of the log/cant that I could handle.  I have never regretted this decision.

[york]

Well guess what?i would not have it on my mill alone or with somebody,

I did buy it from TH,paid 178.00-watched other mills with it and said nope,leave it new in the box-its for sale,cheap-half going to forum...Bert

[Brucer]

I bought an unused one that someone had removed from his LT40 super. I use it pretty much all the time (working alone).

It pretty much depends on how your site is arranged and what type of product you're sawing. I doubt that I would use one if I was doing mostly mobile work. Now that I'm more or less stationary, I've made the dragback part of the work flow.

If I was running a Super, I might be a little more hesitant to use one while working alone. The extra speed and power of the drive motor could make things a little hairy.

[amberwood]

I have a Super and woking alone in  a semi permanent setup, use it every day. Mostly to drag back waste slabs, and unedged recovery boards. Edged product is hand unloaded off the tail of the mill.
It is a pain when it limits the cant size, but is more than offset by its back saving capacity.

DTR

[DR Buck]

Leaving the boards stacked and sawing the cant thru does not allow turning the cant.   Therefor, you can not saw for grade nor can you relieve stress or tension as you saw.  This results in lesser grade lumber. 

I almost always used the drag back, with or without help.   With help, it forces the off bearer to grab the board in a safe location and keeps them from wanting to reach out in front of the mill head.    Without help, I drag the board back onto my roller/platform, drop the head and start the next cut.  While the head is traveling down the mill, I grab the board and stack it on the tractor forks.  By the time I do that the blade is just about to come out of the cut I started first.    My sawing efficiency increased by close to 30% with the drag back and the roller platform.

Everyone has their own preferences as to how they saw.   Mine is with the drag back whenever it can make things faster and still be safe.  I may charge by the board foot, but the more I cut in a given amount of time the higher my apparent hourly rate is.   So, with the drag back I make more money in less time......and time is money.

[Tom]

You've got the right idea, DR Buck.  When working piece work, the faster you get done and on to the next job, the higher your yearly salary will be.  I figured that out one time too.  What an epiphany.

[Magicman]

Leaving the boards stacked and sawing the cant thru does not allow turning the cant.   Therefor, you can not saw for grade nor can you relieve stress or tension as you saw. 

Anytime stress is an issue, the boards have to be removed and the cant turned.  That's just a fact and you have to deal with it as the situation dictates.

Being 99% mobile, I never hauled my roller tables anyway.

[Fla._Deadheader]

Instead of the drag back, we did haul the rollers, tied right on the bunks, under the sawhead. My son or myself, stood at the far end of the mill, and rolled the slabs and 2X-3X-4X lumber over the rollers, onto a trailer, truck, stack, whichever was the place to put the sawn material.

  We NEVER got close enough to the sawhead to be in danger of the blade flying into us. We could saw as fast as most any other mill, and were not really pressed for time, to remove boards, except when loading our gooseneck with 3-4 " think table slabs.

[robnrob2]

Well Last night I shortend the drag back to 1/2" below the blade, and then with my wife as the tail-girl { redhead } and I at the controls, we put it to work for the 1st time really,, and as I would pull the slab off she would thro that over in the pile in front of the chipper,, then I'd pull the flitch cut back and she'd grab that and that went on the flitch rack, and then turn 180 deg, so on and so fourth, till we got the cant,, { yellow pine }, and then I would saw thru, each time pulling off the board into her hands, she would  sticker and stack,, these pine were 16" x 8'
and we milled the customers 3 logs in 45 minutes, sept for the flitch which takes maybe 10 minutes,, so this was a bit of a production improvement,, before the Hyd feed and drag back, I would say make the jacket cut, then raise up over, retun and drop down to make the 4/4 flitch cut, leave the sawhead down at the end of the mill,, grab the jacket board pull it off and thro infront of the chipper, then grab the flitch and place on the rack,,repeat,, with the cant if sawing thru, cut, raise up return, drop to next, cut,  raise up, and as I got progressivly deeper in the cant raiseing up took  longer and getting back down took longer,, all the while the tail gir, member her,, was just watching,, then when done every thing was shut down whilst we stickered and stacked,,l Just a note er two,, all my flitch and slab go in the opposite direction of the sawing,,

I do see a bit of limatation w/ the drag back when working alone, but it is still usefull on the 1st opening cuts, and bein it stowes with the pull of the tee handle, makes it a snap to work both ways,,
I've been sawing a long time Manual, this mill infact was a bare bones, that I over the years have been adding bells and whistles to,,to improve production so that the supplement of income with it, is a plus.

[Magicman]

Sounds like your board drag back project was a success.  Congratulations, and happy  sawing.  Do you have a roller table/bench?

[robnrob2]

Sounds like your board drag back project was a success.  Congratulations, and happy  sawing.  Do you have a roller table/bench?

Thanks , , No roller table bench,, but I do have four 32" wide roller toe baords, one several feet from  each end of the sawing deck, and a couple more stratigicly {spellin} place in the mid area,, My Mill will cut up to 21'6" long, so lots a room for stuff,, But the hitch bar is 3x3 square tubing and is about 4' long, and I fabricated a long time ago, a rack, 2x6" tube with a 2" ball that slips into the hitch, and then extends out from that about another 6' , with a cross piece at the end about 36" wide,, has a jack support also at the end, where the flitch gets placed till I'm ready for it,, not to much bending over,,