TimberJack skidder

golden foot · December 06, 2009, 12:59:08 PM

Hi All,
I just bought a Timberjack skidder and need some help figuring out what year and model it is. I have noticed that some of you guys are pretty knowlegeble on these older timberjacks. I was told that it is a '76 or possibly a '77. It is orange. It has a winch that says "Hercules" on it. Oddly enough it has a two stage grapple arch with a bunching grapple with 360 degree rotation. It has an Allison transmission, 453 Detroit.
The other Question is what might be wrong with the tranny or hydraulic system. The front blade and grapple cylinders chatter when raising and lowering like "cavitating", at the same time the machine is reluctant to power forward or reverse when given the throttle. Is it a hydraulic only problem, or a tranny and hydraulic problem?
Any ideas on what brand winch it is, or model?
Any help would be appreciated so that I can start looking for the right manuals etc.
PAT

Mark K · December 06, 2009, 04:38:10 PM

I would say it might be a 240 but I dont know when they came out with the 300 series. Can you post some pics. On my 225 there is a model-serial plate in front of where you sit right below the air cleaner on the frame. Hercules is the manufacture of the winch. If it were me I would flow rate the hydraulic pump, you never no it might just be a relief valve. I would not run it to much until you get that solved or it might be costly.I get my parts from lyons equipement but that is here in NY.

cuznguido · December 06, 2009, 06:35:01 PM

Hard to accurately diagnose something from a distance but it sounds like you have a hydraulic flow issue. First make sure any hydraulic filters you have are clean and flowing, then check the GPM capacity of your pump(s), and then check your relief valves as already mentioned. Wouldn't hurt to do a pressure check all around. Does it do this when warm, when cold or both?

golden foot · December 07, 2009, 11:25:58 AM

Thanks for the advice guys. I haven't taken delivery of the machine yet because of the cold. yone When I do Get it I will look for that number. I am hopeful that it is just a hydraulic issue but won't know until I analyze it.
Does anyone know about the Hercules winch? Are they good? I had never heard of them before. Thanks again.

Mark K · December 07, 2009, 09:50:31 PM

My 225 has a Hercules winch. I completely rebuilt mine and havent had a bit of trouble with it. Getting the brake set to release while free spooling and getting it to hold when skidding can be a pain. Very strong winch, it will stand the skidder up.

timberjack240 · December 07, 2009, 11:26:41 PM

hercules is a good winch. the 225 my pap has has one.. it pulled million after millions of feet outta the woods my dad had a 240 w one.. im pretty sure they never had any trouble w it. our 225 E has an eaton but it looks the same they seem to work good.. the only thing i dont liek about the hercules is what we call the double slam when you are pulling trees away from power lines etc. it shakes the trees. when you push the lever it lets the cable down just a little before it winds in umlike a gearmatic or john deere.. when you get on to them not a problem some do it worse than others all in how they are set but other wise good winch

240b · December 08, 2009, 08:08:28 AM

The eaton / hercules winch is a 20,000lb winch. it is easy to work on. Keep the oil changed in the winch gear box, there is a bronze ring gear and steel worm gear- dirty oil will chew the bronze one up. If it is dropping the load- I remember replacing a couple of little flow restrictors in the line between the winch and the valve. Model ? 350,380, 450

golden foot · December 09, 2009, 12:16:29 PM

you guys are a big help. Incase anyone is still checking on this post: is the Hercules winch made by Eaton? Is the hydraulic system for the blade and grapple seperate from the transmission? Can I damage the machine loading and unloading it on the lowboy with the hydraulic/tranny issues? Can the spare rebuilt Allison tranny that I got with the machine be checked out for function before I install it in the skidder if needed? I still haven't taken delivery on it because of the -25 temps. so I will know more later and keep you all posted. If it is a 225 or 240 how much does it weigh?

240b · December 09, 2009, 05:38:28 PM

timberjacks which I've owned 230d 380b 240b have all had hydraulic systems seprate from the transmission. 200 series machines pump is on engine 300 series pumps on back of torque convertor housing- both had chin tank for hydraulic oil( filter is in tank) So driving it shouldn't effect tranny. Weight ? hard to say not knowing what it is. It would really help to see it to know.

timberjack240 · December 09, 2009, 11:54:54 PM

i think paps 240 wieghed around 10 to 12 ton .. i would say bein that its a 453 its most liley a 240 or 380 cause ive never heard of a 225 w a 453 detroit and automatic transmission .. as far as that i have no idea with the oil ,.. we have all standard trans... but im gessin thats it a 240 since it has the hercules winch.. plus all the wider a 225 is you wouldnt be able to pay me enough to run it if it hads a grapple meanin the flip over factor ;D.. id say mostly likey a 240 or bigger but i wouldnt want to say for sure till i seen pic ..
another way to narrow it down .. is the cab offset or is it centered more . do the drive lines go beside you or btw your feet

golden foot · December 10, 2009, 06:03:30 PM

Thanks guys,
The cab is centered, the drivelines are centered, the machine seems wide, the hydraulic pump is on the back end of the engine/tranny area. It has square tubing from cab extending over engine cowling and had screened doors at one time, don't remember if the cab had square or round tubing. I am starting to think it might be a 380. I only saw it one time and bought it, but won't get it until it finally warms up here. -20f this morning. Will post some pics. when it arrives.

timberjack240 · December 10, 2009, 11:46:09 PM

sounds liek a 380 to me .. u know what rears are in it

golden foot · December 14, 2009, 11:34:42 AM

Friends,
Well, it is finally on its way, but I won't have photos for a while cause I am having it hauled to a friends in Idaho for the winter to be worked on. When I get down ther I will take some photos and post them.
When we were loading it on the lowboy I measured it and it was 9' 2" to the outsid of the tires. The tires were 24.5's x 32. And guess what the hydraulic system is all one. As in you add hydraulic oil to the tranny for everything. There is one filter on the left in front of the operator. Seems inadequate to me. The pump comes off the back of the tranny. The cab has square tubing. The machine must weigh at least 25,000 or more. I couldn't find any numbers yet. The planetarys have Timberjack stamped on them. It has 2 forward speeds 1 reverse auto. I am thinking it is a 380.
I just didn't have a digital camera with me but will next time. Paid $5,500. Man skidders are getting cheap.

donny hochstetler · December 14, 2009, 06:51:26 PM

could be a 450 ???

barbender · December 15, 2009, 10:21:14 AM

Sounds like it is newer than any of the 200 series machines, I don't think any of those were that big. Sounds like a good buy if you can get it working for not too much money.

MaineLogger · December 15, 2009, 05:34:23 PM

350,380,404,450,480 all had clark tranny/transfer units.Not sure about 330's but they are different.My guess is if it has an allison and 453 it's a 240?Pics?

240b · December 15, 2009, 06:07:14 PM

Or a 520 ?

Leah · January 11, 2010, 05:19:42 PM

Hi,
We have a 330 Timberjack and are looking for parts to rebuild the Hercules winch.
I stubbled upon your forum while trying to find a website for the Hercules Winch company.
I didn't have much luck with that. Any help would be greatly appreciated. We live in Northern NY. ???

Mark K · January 11, 2010, 05:52:09 PM

Lyons Equipement would have them. There located near Rochester. Good luck

ford62783 · January 11, 2010, 07:04:55 PM

commercial trucking and equiptment aka loggers would be able to get them in glensfalls

timberjack240 · January 12, 2010, 12:33:40 AM

lyons would and a place here in pa called blue ridge reapair might have the stuff if not they can get it

Bobus2003 · January 12, 2010, 12:53:31 AM

I have the jerkyness in my blade and steering on my JD440 when either i'm low on hydraulic fluid, or my filter is dirty

GRANITEstateMP · January 12, 2010, 10:33:53 AM

Leah,

When I needed winch parts for my Hercules, Maine Logger had me call Harold's Logging supply in Hampden Maine.(207)942-8331. They had everything in stock! Also I'll try to find the link to JD for ordering a repair man. (on CD) I think it was less than $30 and the diagrams make ordering much easier.

Matt

GRANITEstateMP · January 12, 2010, 10:36:38 AM

Leah,

Try this I just found the site. I went to www.johndeeretechinfo.com and ordered the cd / repair manual for our 230D. It paid for itself the first day, I would recommend paying the extra for shipping to get it a little quicker. It's got a pretty good troubleshooting chart too.

Matt