iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

RIM SPROCKET SYSTEMS

Started by fencerowphil (Phil L.), September 22, 2003, 08:55:45 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

Since I am faced with buying a few 404 chains for my mill, I am planning to change over to the rim sprocket system.  The idea will be to have three chains, each with its matched replacement rim(s), so that they will wear together.

My first Stihl chain lasted far longer than the teeth on the original spur gear on my Stihl 090.  This was in spite of the fact that I cut at least sixty pieces of nail and fence with that chain.  By the time I had ground away half the teeth on the chain,  the spur looked awful.  My question for you guys is this:  
      Should I team up a pair of rims for each chain, rather
       than one rim for each chain?   In other words, how will
       the rate of wear on the rims compare to the rate of wear
       on the chain.
      
Phil L.
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

Kevin

 Phil;
I think Rob mentioned this the other day but it's geared to two chains per rim.
The problem with milling is the chains get loose with heat and the wear is more severe than normal use as I am sure you are well aware.
Rims are cheap, I think all you can do is watch for the wear when you clean the saws after each use.
Dressing the bar and proper chain tension is a must when milling, that alone will save the chains, bar and rim.

Kevin

... and lots and lots of bar oil.  :D

blue_eyed_devil

Just curious if you have compared cutting rates between  .404 and 3/8 pitch ?
I always thought .404 would bag out even the biggest saws!
262 xp,395 xp,built my own chainsaw mill

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

The original Stihl brand ripping chain lasted so long, that this is the first time I have had reason to change chains.  Over the period of a year and a half, I have probably cut between sixty and seventy small nails and pieces of fence, as well as screws and a few 12penny and 16 penny nails with this 404/.063 gauge chain!  Tough chain on a 41" bar.

Of course, bear in mind that the Stihl 090 power head is 137cc.  - big and heavy.    I think I am right in thinking that I can simply change a rim (without changing the clutch hub), and be able to try smaller chain.   The question is whether rims will be available for the Oregon 12004 rim system for that 3/8 chain.

Thanks,  Phil L.
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

woodbeard

Yes, indeed. You can get 3/8 rims in 7 or 8 tooth for that drum. Also .404 in 7 or 8 tooth and .325 in 9 tooth.
I have basically the same setup, and have been using the .325

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

 8)
I found out that Madsen's in Oregon had the Oregon brand goods I needed for the Stihl 090:    The rim sprocket system was #12004, available with a variety of rims.  (This number does not show up on Oregon site.  While the rims were on sale, I ordered two .404 7-tooth, one .404 8-tooth,  one 3/8 8 tooth, and two .325 9-tooth.  Oregon also has set-ups for the old Stihl 075.  (I have one of those, also.)  #22271X is the system which includes a 3/8" 8-tooth rim for the 075.

Woodbeard,
The idea of the .050 GB bar with  .325 / .050 ga. chain and a 9 tooth rim is still something I want to try.  I'll have to wait a month or so and come up with the coins for that, too!  Thanks for the info.!  Even Madsen's guys were not aware of this option.   One word of caution, which I hope I remember:   I would definitely save the .325 set-up for metal-free logs.
Phil L.
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

Oregon_Rob


QuoteYes, indeed. You can get 3/8 rims in 7 or 8 tooth for that drum. Also .404 in 7 or 8 tooth and .325 in 9 tooth.
I have basically the same setup, and have been using the .325

Please expound on your work with the .325 chain on the big saw. I have been contimplating giving it a try on my "Big Orange Dog" 2100
Chainsaw Nerd

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

Hey Oregon!

I'm just too good (at expounding).   8)  

The first step would be to find the Oregon rim sprocket system to match your 2100.   If the Oregon (brand)  site doesn't have it listed,  Madsen's in (the state of) Oregon can tell you what it is, and they will probably have it "on the shelf".   The most flexible category of their rim drive splined cups(drums) is called "7-spline standard".   Available tooth counts for the rims, which slide onto the cup/drum, range from 7 to 9, with nine available for the .325 only.  Chain pitches range from .325 to .404.  GB also makes some rim sprocket systems, but not as many different types to fit particular crank dimensions.   When you first purchase a "system", you get the splined cup and one rim.  This system has a particular model number, applicable to your saw model.

Kornfused yet? :P    ::)

The diameter and length inside the collar where the needle cage resides is matched to your particular crankshaft, so that the rim sprocket splined cup replaces your existing clutch cup/drum.  On the other hand the rims, which slide onto the cup, are interchangeable, letting you change bars and gauges and chain pitches by merely changing the $4 rim.  Neat, huh!

Below are some notes I made about the bars for my saw :

[  Note:   GB makes a .050 bar which will fit a Stihl 090, available thru Foster's.
        You can use a .325 chain, .050 gauge and use a 9 tooth Oregon .325
        rim.    This would only be feasible on a certified metal-free log!
        36" GB bar for .325, .050 ga.  $55.00  shpg.  $7.00
        42" GB bar for .325, .050 ga.  $75.00      "           "]

Kevin has a quick set of links to all these.  Go to . . .

http://www3.sympatico.ca/kvn.rob/millingmasters.html

Note that Foster's is in his group of "Chainsaw Mills" and the others fall under "Suppliers".
Phil L.
         P.S.  Well, you said "expound"!   :D ;) :D
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

Oops, I'm sorry, did you mean for Woodbeard to expound? :'(

He musta' been busy! ;D

Phil L. :P

                 You probably already knew most of this, but
              others may be curious about this topic.  I had to
             learn a lot, QUICK, when I got into the stuff.                     Woodbeard helped.

Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

Oregon_Rob

Phil,
I thank you for your great knowledge of the conversion. I was really wanting to know about the differences in cutting/milling with .325 and what improvements and or problems were encountered in going with the smaller chain set up.

Best regards,

Rob
 :P
Chainsaw Nerd

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

I know the feeling.

You might try a direct contact with Woodbeard.   He claims good experience, faster feed, etc.   He also said he has not hit any metal, however.   Another very experienced miller is Ralph Foster, owner of Foster's Sales:

Ralph@fosterssales.com

His comments appear widely on the Yahoo Milling Group:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/milling

When I ordered the rim system from Madsen's,  the guys there were very skeptical about using .325 on big bars.   They did not know about the GB bars made to fit the 090 at .050 gauge, either.  This is understandable.   After all, the heritage of the Northwest includes big timber and big saws, running .404 and 1/2" pitch chains.  To them 3/8" pitch is probably small.  (In contrast, my local Stihl dealer thought that I had to mean the 009 model, not the 090, when I recently ordered flocked air filters.  Different type demand in our area.)

Here is an example of Ralph's work, dated 12/2/03 on Yahoo:

[   Hello Rob

   You have been posting some great stuff lately.

   I have been using .325 for milling for a couple of years now.
   It's great stuff. I've used it on my 088 and it stretches but does not
   break.

   .325 chain comes in professional grade chain, unlike 3/8 Low Profile chain.

   It cuts about 25% faster than 3/8 50 gauge chain and about  10% faster than 3/8 low
    profile chain with out any of the negatives associated with it.

   Big saws cross cut faster with standard 3/8 chain.

   For milling I use the same file or stones I'd use with standard 3/8 chain, I believe it opens    up the chain and allows it to move more saw dust.

   .325 chain cuts faster and smoother than any thing I have tried so far and I've tried
    everything I could think of except 1/4" chain. And that should work well on saws that are    border line for the job they are doing now.

   Ralph
]

You can get more info there, for sure!
Phil L.
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

Aha!

I see we are meeting ourselves coming and going.

You're in two places at once!

Phil L. :D :D
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

Oregon_Rob

I jsut know there is a WILD GOOSE around here somewhere.
I'll just keep hunting till I find it. :D
Chainsaw Nerd

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

Well, at least we now have a good bit of information "in black and white" for others to use.   It will save them a good bit of time.

Got to go to work.   :( :'( :(

Or, as Maynard used to say to Dobbie Gillis ,   "WORK!?" ;D

Phil L.
                P.S.   See Bailey's cat.# CA25
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

Gus

Good coverage guys,
I was going to put .325 on my 2100 when I started milling and the guy at the saw shop talked me out of it. Thinking the screamer would break it I suppose. If you can run it on a 090 or 088 I would certainly think we could run it on a 2100.
Thanks guys,
Gus
"How do I know what I think unless I have seen what I say?"

Bobcat_pa

PHIL L:  the .325 does not hold up too well to metal ?   3/8 better ?

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

Hey Bobcat!

The .325 pitch comes in at least these flavors:  .050 gauge. .058 gauge, and .063 gauge.   I have ordered some of the heavier ga., since it will go right on my bar.  Also,  the thicker gauge should be strong.

What I have my doubts about is how the .050 ga. would handle hitting an ingrown eyebolt, for example.    If the kerf is smaller,  I would like to use this thickness for metal free wood, only.

Before I learned how to properly tighten the Alaskan mill to my saw,  I cut half way through one of the grade six hardened bolts which clamp the frame onto the saw bar.  The .404/.063 ga. Stihl chain not only did not break;  it didn't even lose a tooth!  Now that is what I call tough.

Yep, I wondered where all the smoke and noise was coming from.  Yikes! :(
Phil L.
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

woodbeard

Well, I've cut into the bar clamps on mine with a chain that got a little loose. Not the same as a bolt, but the chain was fine, just chipped some teeth.
 Now that I've been getting into some wider cuts, I'm starting to notice the saw bogging down a lot more. Wondering if maybe the .325 can't clear the chips out fast enough.
 Another thing I often think about is that Ralph Foster's experience with .325 has been on an 088 which is a much faster saw. Even with the 9 tooth rim, the chain speed of the 090 is much less than the 088.
  Sorry I've dropped out of these discussions lately. Been kinda busy and also not sure where I'm at with the chainsaw mill right now. Fried the clutch pretty good recently, so she's on the sidelines for a while.

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

Since I usually cut big stuff,  and with .404,  that tired, bogged-down feeling is familiar to me.   ;)Because of this, I am looking to the .325 to get that improvement in speed and reduction in bogging,  compared to .404.  From the quote above, from Ralph Foster,  it looks as if the ripping speed could be about 40% faster, comparing .404 to .325.
 :P
I have found that I can bog down anytime I want.  It's a combination of four factors:  The hook angle on the teeth, the filing of the depth gauges, and the pressure applied, and, finally, the width of the cut.  So, in other words, you can bog any chain.   A few times I have had the depth gauges filed a little too deep and had trouble avoiding bogging down.  

Strangely enough,  "bogged down" sometimes actually cuts faster, but there is a ripple/washboard effect on the board surface which is bad, especially if the chain has become a little loose.  When the 090 is running slower at max. torque, it seems that a time coefficient comes into play, allowing each tooth time to dig deep, rather than "skate".   As a chain dulls, this effect is more pronounced.  (It skates worse at high speed, but cuts at lower speed.)  Just don't like the look of the cut and don't like the "grunt" of the engine, when this is going on.  But the 090 will surely grunt right along!

I "spun" my clutch and am waiting on the rim system.  All UPS orders should converge on Dublin Dec. 11.  Hope to be cutting Dec. 13 with .0325
More later.
Phil L.     :(
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

Oregon_Rob

 :P
In looking back through the archives of the Yahoo, milling forum, I came across a post in which our good friend and expounder of great knowledge, Lumber Dennis pointed out that if you double the RPM, you quadruple the force of the clutch shoes contacting the drum, what I will call, "lock up force". This is an interesting piece of information, when put together with two people spinning their clutches on a, high torque, low RPM saws.
Might be worth considering, with discussing loading your saw to achieve a lower rpm, but peak torque. This is probably where the 088 pull ahead. I have experienced similar conditions on my 2100, that by loading it up, the clutch will brake loose.
Chainsaw Nerd

jokers

I just noticed that Jeff Sikkema has the GB Pro Top 36" bars listed for $49.50. Jeff is the largest retailer of GB stuff that I know of and he often has items that other GB dealers can`t readily get. He also has the new mills being sold by GB, they look really good.

Russ

S&S Saw Shop  Jeff Sikkema //www.snssawshop.com

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

That's  a good point,  Oregon.

My problem was of a more peculiar nature.   The clutch did not slip, and I don't seem to have had that problem.  Instead, the clutch assembly slipped on the shaft  :( - a much worse problem.

Here is the sad, embarrassing tale:   :-[

Once upon a midnight dreary, while I tinkered, weak and weary,   first the Stihl 075 was cleaned and its needle cage lubed, then reassembled.  Next, came the Stihl 090.  As I put it back together, little did I know that I had been abused by a vacuum cleaner.   >:( Sabotaged and left to suffer!  I should have gotten the book of lore! (Service manual)

Hint:   The Stihl 075's clutch assembly does not have a spacer to provide pressure to a Spieth adapter.   Guess what!  The 090 does!   So, when the vacuum cleaner reached out and grabbed the spacer washer off the shaft of the 090, without asking my permission to do so,   I was led to believe a lie!  What gaul that sucker had, to cause my saw to gaul its parts!   So,  my error was not discovered, until I had been cutting a while.     I am glad that the original spur gear was worn out, because I had to destroy the shape of the clutch cup/drum by removing the assembly with a sheave puller!

After quite a search in my shop,  I realized that the only place the missing spacer could be was in (you guessed it) the shop vac!
Phil L.        Spin and burn...; live and learn !


Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

woodbeard

My problem is thus:
 The linings on my shoes were worn unevenly and I was having problems with the clutch not engaging at all and breaking springs. My fix was to remove the linings altogether and grind the faces of the shoes to fit the inside of the drum.
This worked great, except that it raised the speed at which the clutch is fully engaged. So when the 090 was chugging along like it does, the clutch was slipping just enough to build up a lot of heat, but not let the chain stop. It actually melted one end of the needle bearing cage which appears to be some sort of plastic composite. >:(
 It happened while I was milling some 14" cedar, so I was able to finish the job with my 046.  I had 3/8 full comp filed to 0 deg. on the 46, and it cut the cedar just as fast, if not faster, fed more evenly and left a much nicer surface.
That is what got me thinking about the operating rpm / chain speed / chain size thing  :P ???
 In any case, It may be a while afore I get back to it, as I will be going to pick up my new ( used ) Peterson sawmill tomorrow. 8)

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

Hey Woodbeard,

Boy, that's hot.   (not the needle cage,  I mean the Swinger)
 :)    :)      8)      :)    :)
From the very first time I studied all the different mills, the Peterson swing blade has been the, er,....
          object of my affections!

For quickly cutting without moving the log and being able to handle reasonable amount of metal without serious problems, it seemed like the way to go.

Back to the other hot stuff:   I have a theory for you.

The design of the 090 clutch carrier permits the shoes to not only move in and out, but also to align to the drum surface.  I noticed that the wear pattern on my two-year-old shoes was slightly uneven.   My first thought was,  " Will the shoes get full traction on the inner surface of the Oregon rim drum, considering the uneven wear?"  The next thought reminded me of the fact that the shoes can pivot laterally in the carrier.  It was then that I remembered another minute area of wear which I had seen:  The divider portions of the carrier, which act as guides between the shoes had a little wear.  That wear could affect alignment.

To take the thought further,  if any burr exists along the edges of these dividers, then the shoe might have a problem achieving lateral alignment.  This would be no problem on a typical crosscut, but would be in ripping.  In addition,  if the inside diameter of the Oregon drum is different, even slightly from the worn Stihl drum it is replacing, then a different radius will exist.   The curve of the face of each shoe would not be the same as the inside curve of the new drum.   The side-to-side difference in wear would also be an issue.   Last, but not least, when a drum heats up, the increase in diameter is not even.  Since the part of the drum near the engine is restrained by the side body of the drum, it cannot expand at the same factor as does the edge of the drum at the open side.  

So there we have it:   Worn shoes in a new drum will cause more heat.  That additional heat increases the mismatch between the parts, as normal distortion of the new cup creates an even larger amount of lost area of contact, especially along the open side of the drum.

The solution then?  One possibility is new shoes.
          Another possibility is an extended break-in period.
A third possibility would be to somehow encourage the new parts and the old to "mate".  (Would deer musk/lure do it?)  I wonder if anyone has applied an abrasive coating to the inside of a new drum to accomplish this.  
Here is the idea:
         Coat the inside of the drum with a water thin layer of
          an optical grade epoxy (such as Epotec 301), then
          coat that epoxy with a layer of fine silicone carbide grit.
          As the shoe wears, so would the grit and epoxy.  The
          speed of shoe wear would be increased, until the thin drum
           coating was worn away.  The shoes would end up at
           a shape which would provide the maximum surface
           contact!  In effect, the new drum would "machine" the
           new shoes into shape.
Hummmm. :P

Phil L.        
          I GOT SHOES!  YOU GOT SHOES!  ALL O' GOD'S
                     CHILLUN GOT SHOES !   WHEN I GIT TO
                HEAVEN, GONNA FORGET THEM SHOES,
                THEN I SHO' GONNA GITTA ME THAT . . .
                        PETERSON!
            :D
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

woodbeard

 :D :D :D
Thanks, Phil. I needed that!
This baby's shoes cost $200 a set.
I would be worried my son's friend's would beat me up for them. :D

Oregon_Rob

 8)
Woodbeard,
Congratulations! All of a sudden that 090 place in your heart feel a little different. Take photos and make sure to keep us updated on your progress.
Chainsaw Nerd

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

oH nO oREgON!

Here's what'll happen to Big Daddy 090:   He'll be retired to the stud ranch & Woodbeard will only pull him out once in a while to trim the ends off a biggun, or rip a log occasionally.

Woodbeard, can't you buy a new Peterson blade for a little more than those shoes' cost?  If 090 shoes cost that much,  I better put on my thinkin' cap again and figure out how to retread those shoes in a year or so....
 :P  ::)  :P
Hummmmuh   Hum.   well,  first you'd , uh, then
     yeah, probably you
could....,  then humph! ???

Maybe wifie dearest can get ME  a swinger for Christmas.

   Me:  Ouch, ouch ,  stop, you're hurting me honey.
   wifie dearest:  
+&$$##@@#####****, and I MEAN IT!
  Me:    No, honey, I meant to say a SWING BLADE, honey, not
         a "swinger" for Christmas! :-*  :-[  :-*
Phil L.
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

Ianab

Hi Woodbeard
The clutch pads on my 090 have been rebuilt by the local automotive brake/clutch shop. They can bake a new layer of pad back onto the original shoes. Seems to work good as new.
I guess the problem is to find a brake shop that can actually rebuild shoes rather than just replacing em  ???
Should work out a lot less then $200 though so might be worth hunting around :P

Oh... And Congrats on your "new" Petterson - Enjoy  :)
Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

That's a tantalizing tidbit, Ian!

When parts costs get rediculous,  remanufacturing is practical, regardless of why the cost is high.  I was ready to contact your "local brake and clutch" shop, then checked to see where you are.  It was at that point that the term "oxymoron" came to mind.   When you live in the U.S. the term "local" can't apply to N.Z. ! :D :D :D

Sample bill: ? ?
                      Zeelander's  Clutch & Brake
                                    Shoe resurfacing     -       $95 (NZ)
                                          Currency conversion  $15
                                     Shpg to U.S.                         $110  
        ::)                   Total                                     $220 (US)         ::)

Seriously, however,  could you get an e-mail address from someone at that shop.  Like Buzz-Sawyer,  I love to try new tricks.   Doubtless, there are supplier issues and training material sources - things they know that would come in handy one day!
Phil L
Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

Oregon_Rob

QuoteI just noticed that Jeff Sikkema has the GB Pro Top 36" bars listed for $49.50. Jeff is the largest retailer of GB stuff that I know of and he often has items that other GB dealers can`t readily get. He also has the new mills being sold by GB, they look really good.

Russ

S&S Saw Shop  Jeff Sikkema //www.snssawshop.com

Have not had much luck finding the GB mill on line. Anyone got a link?
Chainsaw Nerd

fencerowphil (Phil L.)

Bi-VacAtional:  Piano tuner and sawyer.  (Use one to take a vacation from the other.) Have two Stihl 090s, one Stihl 075, Echo CS8000, Echo 346,  two Homely-ite 27AVs, Peterson 10" Swingblade Winch Production Frame, 36" and 54"Alaskan mills, and a sore back.

woodbeard

I will always keep the 090, if only to aggravate the local Stihl dealers. :D
Actually, the old hoss will likely end up yoked to the Peterson frame at some point. They make a bracket to hold a chainsaw in the carriage.

Thank You Sponsors!