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? type steel for shear blade to buck up wood??

Started by whitepine, October 26, 2009, 08:08:53 PM

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whitepine

Hi OK so winter is coming and months of cold and snow and I am thinking of a fabrication project. What kind of steel would one use for the blade to  buck up wood into say 16inch lengths (like the chopper) and should the blade go to a solid stop like an anvil  cutter on steel or pass thru a slot beyond the cut? When I look at firewood processors the big fault I see is the idea of getting the wood to the  processor the chopper has a good idea but way to complicated others I have seen have bunks that the wood has to be loaded into requiring a loader so the plan is to use a rope winch capstan affair to get the wood to processor than figure out how to force it into machine for the shear cut than drop it  to splitter. Any help or suggestions would be great ( I do not need to be told I am  nuts my friends and family  do that for me already) Thanks Tom in Minnesota

beenthere

You're not nuts.  ;D

Going to be moving logs to the processor from ?  a log pile? far from the processor, or will the processor move or be moved to the next log pile?

I'd say look at the blade specs first. That seems to be the biggest roadblock to a chomper-style processor. Not sure where some numbers would be, but know in the past there have been developments for knife-cutting hardwoods. Tree-fellers were once the new kid on the block, that "chomped" off trees. Seems they've given way to chainsaw heads or heavy teeth in a circular blade. The splintered wood in logs from knife-cutting was a drawback (not as much a problem in firewood, but may distract from a neatly split product) but splinters may be hard to sell.  :)
Takes some heavy duty hydraulics for chomping hardwood, I'd think. Using the chomper blade to push the piece through the splitter wedges seems the best part of that processor idea.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

whitepine

Would make it moveable on an axle for working  on a log pile most likely  100 inch sticks. They used shears up here alot when I was a logger but noone uses them now because of the damage they did to the wood. I would not want to rule out use on tree length wood either.

red oaks lumber

tom,
i would talk to a good machine shop first. i would use either 4140 plate steel machine the cutting edge then heattreat it, or hotroll steel machine the cutting edge then carboize and harden the edge.
the experts think i do things wrong
over 18 million b.f. processed and 7341 happy customers i disagree

barbender

I'd just try a piece of grader cutting edge myself. What's wrong with the chompers winch set up for feeding the logs? Seems about as simple as it gets.
Too many irons in the fire

whitepine

Chompers winch set up looks ok to me also thanks for the suggestions on the steel will check them out. Grader blade good idea have to think about that as the blade needs to be as long as diameter of wood sheared.  Thanks guys

sawdust


The Chomper blade passes through a slot. I was thinking of a tab sticking out the down stream side of the blade that would crack the new block in half. The tab would be set higher than the actual knife edge so it would not run into the slot the blade passes through. I doubt that the tab would actually be able to split the block in half, I just want it cracked so it will dry.
What diameter of wood are you wanting to process?
David
comforting the afflicted and afflicting the comfortable.

whitepine

Birch maple ash most well under 18 inches here. There is another  device that used a deal like that saw it at logging show used for sale they had a wedge downstream side of blade stuck out about 5 inches to split the wood. I would run it thru a splitter.

sawdust


You are going to need a huge ram to shear 18 inch hard wood! I measured a Chomper it was built to process 14 inch and it has a 6 inch ram.  A 13 inch half dry spruce would make that thing grunt really badly and that was avoiding the knots.
I think the biggest Chomper manufactures is a 16"

I would love to see pics as you go. I am collecting parts to build a shear for doing tops. 10 inch max.

David
comforting the afflicted and afflicting the comfortable.

whitepine

I have heard they do not like dry wood and most I will use it on would be under 12 inches. Right now I am pricing parts and that ram is a tough one to find. I am sure I will have more questions as time goes.

sawdust

I am going to attempt twin smaller rams with the same total cross section I think I need.

dc
comforting the afflicted and afflicting the comfortable.

Stephen Alford

Hey whitepine, after much trial and error found the safest way to position the cylinder was to put in a piece of heavy pipe. When things go south the containment helps. A good choice for a cylinder is a stablizer leg from a highmac. They are designed to apply down pressure and hold it . Kinda ended up looking like  the black night in monty python. Good idea to have inline pressure gauges to help see what is taking place. Goodluck :)

logon

sawdust


Exposing my ignorance, what is a highmac?

sawdust
comforting the afflicted and afflicting the comfortable.

Stephen Alford

Hey sawdust, highmac is a term we use to refer to excavators, more specificly those that were four wheel drive some with timberjack undercarriage. They had stablizer legs that went down while the boom was operational. At one point they were used to build access roads to woodlots stumping and ditching as they went.  :)

logon

sawdust


Thank you Stephen, Any idea the diameter of the cylinder?
comforting the afflicted and afflicting the comfortable.

Stephen Alford

Hey sawdust, the cylinder is about 6'' with a 3'' ram.  The thing here is the advantage of using the steel pipe to mount it. Allows you to mount pretty much any cylinder at whatever height works.  This is a pic of it from the other side maybe it will give you a better idea. Make no mistake there is a lot of force involved with this concept.  Take your time with the welds. It is a hydraulic press with wood application :)

logon

sawdust


Stephen, thats something that had not occurred to me it appears you are using that blade to split the blocks.
comforting the afflicted and afflicting the comfortable.

Stephen Alford

Hey sawdust, the blocking and splitting occur at the same time, but ya got to pay attention. :)

logon

sawdust


I got it! I did not recognize it was two sides of the same device. I had not thought to make the splitting wedge so long, why not! Have you ever tried posting video clips to youtube? It is really easy and that thing would make a neat clip.

I would like to make my vertical so that gravity will feed the shear. I can transport (and lift) eight foot tops to load into the thing. Only problem I forsee is very little clearance under the machine to get the blocks out.
comforting the afflicted and afflicting the comfortable.

Stephen Alford

Vertical why not ! Some of my early customers called it smacher wood. Said he shoveled it in the furnace ,but ordered a couple more loads.  Most customers  will take about 20% maybe 30 cause a lot are frequent fire starters and like the kindling. Also works great for campfires and those little chimaneas that seem to have become popular. It drys quicker and can be handled easily if one has back issues or little ones to keep busy. Wood has to be tightly limbed and ignorant stuff feed in backwards. U shaped blocks from the stump are the most dangerous. Keep posting ,great to see how your getting along.   :)

logon

splitter

Have you looked at a E-Zee cord machine? Their made in canada, I have been working on something like it for a year or two, have not had time to work on it lately. My blade is hardened steel forgot what number the steel is. I have talked to the man that builds the E-Zee cord machines by phone stated to me that mild steel will not do the job. Look up E-Zee cord machines on your computer, if nothing else it will give you some good ideals. Splitter 

splitter

Whitepine, go to (twister industries) to see a E-Zee cord machine. You can't find a good picture of one for some reason. It looks like the site has almost disappeared. Hope this helps. Splitter

splitter


whitepine

Thanks I think I actually saw that machine at the logging show in Grand Rapids MN this year before they painted it. My plan now is to get the parts together before I start as some are expensive no way around it I can figure I  appreciate the input from all of you. Thanks Tom

maple flats

This would surely need lots of pressure. My brother has a shear on his 85 horse ASV, 2700 psi and a 6" cylinder. This complains when cutting. It will cut max a 15" diameter but does much better on 12 and under. A 15" log takes time it moves real slow on heavier and harder woods. The cutter on his is some high grade steel, not sure what, and it is over an inch thick, tapered to a sharp edge, slightly faster than the taper on most axes but not much. Most hydraulics work at a mechanical disadvantage but this cylinder pushes very near the end of the shear bar. The bar is way heavier than a plow cutter edge.
logging small time for years but just learning how,  2012 36 HP Mahindra tractor, 3point log arch, 8000# class excavator, lifts 2500# and sets logs on mill precisely where needed, Woodland Mills HM130Max , maple syrup a hobby that consumes my time. looking to learn blacksmithing.

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