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110v vs 220v

Started by jim king, October 12, 2009, 10:48:57 PM

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jim king

Any electricians out there ?¿

I would appreciate an opinion on which has more electrical shock ability or simply which is more dangerous or are they the same ?  110v or 220v.

I have always been told they are about the same as far as shocking power and that the voltage is not the dangerous part of electricity.  I guess you can tell I am not an electrical engineer.

isawlogs


I aint an elactriciatien either               call me a wimp if you want ,   I am afraid of both .  :o  I am of those that sweat alot and for no other reason then just swet, so I am prone to being well grounded , if , if anyone around is to get a shock , DanGit it is me , so ya  i am afraid of both  :-X :(  I cant tell ya wich zapps most , they both hurt like hell  :'( :'(
A man does not always grow wise as he grows old , but he always grows old as he grows wise .

   Marcel

fstedy

Its the amperage thats dangerous it only takes about 30 milliamps to kill a person. Did you every see that demonstration where a guy touches a high voltage source and his hair stands on end. Thats very very low amperage and very high voltage. Its not recommended though for the unexperienced.
Timberking B-20   Retired and enjoying every minute of it.
Former occupations Electrical Lineman, Airline Pilot, Owner operator of Machine Shop, Slot Machine Technician and Sawmill Operator.
I know its a long story!!!

PineNut

In the United States, if you grab hold (not recommended) of either of the hot lines and get a shock, it will be the same for 120 or 240 volts. 240 volts is the voltage between the two hot wires.  The voltage between either hot wire and the ground will be 120 volts. If you grab hold of one hot wire in one hand and the other hot wire in the other hand (again not recommended), now you will have the full 240 volts and it will hit you twice as hard. Doing either one of these experiments could very well be a one-time experience as you may not be around to try it again.

Brucer

To add to what fstedy and PineNut said, it's the current that kills you, but it's the voltage that drives that current through you. Your body is basically a resistor. Connect it to a power supply, and the current you're exposed to is the voltage divided by your body resistance. Double the voltage and you double the current.

Contacting a 10,000 volt electric cattle fence doesn't kill, because the fence charger is designed to limit the current actually delivered.

The power supply to your house, on the other hand, is able to deliver a current up to whatever the circuit breaker is rated for -- at least 15 amps, or about 500 times the lethal amount fstedy mentioned.

As it turns out, not all bodies have the same resistance. Mine is apparently about twice the average (had it tested once). That probably explains why I survived a couple of "mishaps" when I was younger ;).
Bruce    LT40HDG28 bandsaw
"Complex problems have simple, easy to understand wrong answers."

pineywoods

I think part of the confusion is a result of 2 different standards for 220 volt service. In the USA, 220 volt service is  actually 2 110 volt supplies of opposite polarity, giving 220 volt difference. . Most other places 220 volt service is just 2 wires, one ground, the other hot with 220 volts, enough to really light your lite bulb.. Either one is more than enough to kill...
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
100k bd ft club.Charter member of The Grumpy old Men

DanG

Yep, either one will kill you, and that makes them equal in my book.
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

Ianab

As the guys have said, it's the amperage that kills or burns you. But it's the voltage that causes the current to flow. All things being equal, you will get twice the current through you from the 220v source. It may be hard to tell the difference when you wake up on the floor, but it could be the difference between waking up, or not.

Low voltages (12-24v) are reasonably safe because your skin resistance is high enough that the current is less than you can feel. Main danger there is the current being able to melt watch straps and screwdrivers. Higher voltages can overcome your skin resistance and make you part of the circuit.

If you are worried, an Earth Leakage Breaker (RCD) is a good investment. It monitors the line and if the hot and neutral are carrying the same current then things are operating normally. If there is more current going in than returning, the missing amount may be going to earth via you, so it trips the breaker.

My electrical training was a few years back, and only went to 240v / 10a (standard NZ mains socket). But thats plenty enough to fry you.

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

beenthere

Ianab
On this side, we call your RCD a GFI (Ground-fault interupter).

Good read on the voltage.  :)

I agree with others...both 110 and 220 are dangerous, and only semantics as to the 220 being "more" dangerous.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

caver

220-221,,,whatever it takes.

If you have seen the movie Mr. Mom you will get the joke.
Baker HD18

easymoney

even 12 volts can be felt. if you lay a sweaty arm across a 12 volt car battery or touch your tongue to the terminals of a 9 volt battery. neither one will do you any damage but they will give you an uncomfortable feeling.

stumpy

They will both kill you so fast that you wouldn't be able to tell the difference :o
Woodmizer LT30, NHL785 skidsteer, IH 444 tractor

woodmills1

and don't be touching any of it just as you own heart is on an upstroke, :P cause....................
James Mills,Lovely wife,collect old tools,vacuuming fool,36 bdft/hr,oak paper cutter,ebonic yooper rapper nauga seller, Blue Ox? its not fast, 2 cat family, LT70,edger, 375 bd ft/hr, we like Bob,free heat,no oil 12 years,big splitter, baked stuffed lobster, still cuttin the logs dere IAM

fstedy

If you have a fixed amperage flow when you double the voltage the amperage is halved. Thats why power transmission lines are very high voltage they can carry equivelent current on much smaller wire. If my math is correct for example you have 15 amps at 100 volts you will have .015 amps at 100,000 volts.
Timberking B-20   Retired and enjoying every minute of it.
Former occupations Electrical Lineman, Airline Pilot, Owner operator of Machine Shop, Slot Machine Technician and Sawmill Operator.
I know its a long story!!!

DanG

If we're gonna turn this into a basic electricity course(which is a good thing) we can't forget about resistance.  The current(amps) in any circuit depends on how much current flow the resistance will allow.  Given a constant resistance(ohms), a higher voltage will cause a higher current.  If the voltage is constant, lowering the resistance will cause higher current.  In an electrocution situation, your body is the resistance part.  It may vary slightly as it cooks, but for all intents and purposes it is constant.  The higher the voltage your body contacts, the more current you pull and the quicker you cook. 
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

Toolman

How many amps run through your finger when it's a dry winter. You rub your feet across the carpet and touch the end of your dog's wet nose.  :D...my poor dog used to hate the dry weather when we were kids.
"A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have" (Thomas Jefferson)

DanG

That static charge is very high voltage and tiny current flow.  According to what we were taught at the phone company, it could be up to 20,000 volts.  We had to wear grounded wrist straps when handling some of the electronic stuff as a spark could damage it.
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

Toolman

Anybody remember the Van Degraf generator? It was a round ball that sat on a pedestal and had a motor running a belt that created static electricity. You laid your hand on it and your hair stood straight up on end.
"A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have" (Thomas Jefferson)

Ianab

Dont underestimate static charges. Walking on dry carpet, Ven Der Graff machines and Thunderstorms all work on the same principle. Just that a thunderstorm is BIG, and can store a lot more charge. But the spark that jumps to your dogs nose is exactly the same as a lightning bolt, just scaled down a bit.

Dang is correct that that sort of discharge is enough to damage the tiny transistors in an intergrated circuit.

Another place it becomes a hazard is a hovering helicopter, or refueling an aircraft. They can generate and store enough static to make things interesting.

Also a big enough static discarge is enough to set off a dust expolsion. Not a worry in the smaller dust blowers we use, but in bigger systems, bigger sparks = BOOM

Ian
Weekend warrior, Peterson JP test pilot, Dolmar 7900 and Stihl MS310 saws and  the usual collection of power tools :)

ibseeker

Ian,
I only touched that dog's nose one time! How was I supposed to know that he would have bowel control issues. If he hadn't been so focused on that female dog, he probably wouldn't have bit her ear. Anyway, my wife said the carpet will probably be able to be cleaned but if not we can cover that stain with the end table. One of these days he might even trust me again.

The worst I ever got hit was on an induced voltage. We were rebuilding a pole with 69kV and a double run of 12kV and I got between a grounded drill frame and a hot guy wire. It was about 600v to ground. It really rung my bell! Not only painful but embarassing. I had to explain at a Safety meeting all the safety rules I broke. No one wants to be the topic of a safety meeting. Kind of hard on the ego.

Worse than being well grounded is to be between a load and a source...you don't want to be a conductor. That really hurts! I still see GE across my eyeballs from when that refrigerator cycled.
Chuck
worn out poulan, Stihl 250SC, old machete and a bag of clues with a hole in the bottom

easymoney

back in the good old days when radios had tubes i serviced 2 way radios for the police and such the plate voltage on some of those old radios could really get your respect in a hurry. the highest voltage i ever worked with was a broadcast station thet ran 6,000 volts on the finals. no one had to tell me to  keep all interlocks in place.

shinnlinger

The saying is "Volts jolt, mils kill"  Tazers can have over 100,000 volts and you won't like it, but they have very few milliamps so they shouldn't kill you.

I read somewhere about a navy tech who read the resistance of his body with an ohm meter which was powered by a 9 volt battery.  He decided to lower his resistance by puncturing both his thumbs with the probes and he did such a good job that it threw his heart into fibrillation.  Since he was alone in the lab at the time he ended up dieing.  Who would have thought a 9 volt could kill you?

Oh and your average electric chair only has about 7 amps, less than half your typical house circuit.
Shinnlinger
Woodshop teacher, pasture raised chicken farmer
34 horse kubota L-2850, Turner Band Mill, '84 F-600,
living in self-built/milled timberframe home

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