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Skid Steer vs Tractor

Started by Fairchance, September 10, 2009, 10:43:02 PM

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chevytaHOE5674

Are you only ever going to use it to load logs onto the mill? Or possible use it for other things?

I have both a skid steer, backhoe, and a few farm tractors. I can not possible imagine how the skid steer is as versatile as a tractor with a FEL. The tractor can load and move logs, as well as get them out of the woods. The tractor can also plow and disc fields, make hay, push or blow snow, mow, etc. And as mentioned 3pt attachments for a tractor are relatively cheap and abundant.

A big skid steer would be perfect for loading logs and other bucket related tasks, and then marginal/ no use at other tasks.

It just comes down to what you want out of a machine. IMO

gunman63

just a partical list of skidsteer attachments
forks   many different kinds
dirt buckets   many differnt kinds
snow plow
snow blower
tele booms
tree shears
post augers
backhoes
brush hogs
concrete hammers
grapples
rock buckets
root buckets
landscape rakes
landscape levelers
log spliters
bales spears
brooms
stump grinders
receiver plate
tree spades
wood chippers
wood processors
concrete buckets
post drivers
dozer blades
roller packers
roter tillers
and i know i missed some.


chevytaHOE5674

Quote from: gunman63 on September 13, 2009, 07:18:25 PM
just a partical list of skidsteer attachments

brush hogs

Last i priced one it was like 4k for a good 60" brush hog for a skid steer, I paid like 1500 for a 72" for a tractor 3pt... Thats a huge price difference.

nas

Back to the original question...
If I were looking for a machine specifically for loading logs on my mill, and I had an area to do it on that was hard packed all year, I would get the skid steer.  If there was mud to deal with, or I was going to use it for log skidding or wagon pulling, I would get the tractor.  As for the safety issue, both are safe if used within their limits. 

Gunman63
Yes there are a lot of attachments for skid steers, but they usually cost 2-3x what the equivalent 3ph attachment costs. 

Nick
Better to sit in silence and have everyone think me a fool, than to open my mouth and remove all doubt - Napoleon.

Indecision is the key to flexibility.
2002 WM LT40HDG25
stihl 066
Husky 365
1 wife
6 Kids

gunman63

yes  i will agree cost attachements are usually higher but need to compare apples to apples when comparing prices,  ive seen them for $1500 for a tractor mount,  but no where as heavy built as the skid steer. loook at post hole augers, no comparsion on tractor mount to  skidsteer,, cost isnt much difference on them, skidsteer style is self leveling, easy to move side to side front to back, way better than a tractor. but what it comes down to is what the one spending the money  thinks is better. I just have learned  that just cause its cheaper doesnt mean its better to buy

nas

Quote from: gunman63 on September 13, 2009, 09:21:06 PM
but what it comes down to is what the one spending the money  thinks is better. I just have learned  that just cause its cheaper doesnt mean its better to buy
I agree 100%, BUT... if I had to choose between a tractor or a skid steer for general use around my mill and woodlot it would definitely be a tractor.

Nick
Better to sit in silence and have everyone think me a fool, than to open my mouth and remove all doubt - Napoleon.

Indecision is the key to flexibility.
2002 WM LT40HDG25
stihl 066
Husky 365
1 wife
6 Kids

Fairchance

Thanks for all the input guys!

Ironwood

Gunman, I wonder what that list would cost?  $$$$$

Never met a forklift I didn't like. Have a small tractor and FEL, and,.....uhmmmm several forklifts. I do ALOT of material handling and on/off, forklifts are the way to go for me. I have many in the 20-40 year old range. All resonably priced and generally dependable. If I had ton of construction style work to do perhaps a SS, but I just rent them when needed or better yet find a HUNGRY construction guy with equipment and hire him!!!

Here are a few of the lifts, I generally keep them well maintained and painted up. I have two others not shown. All differing sizes and capacities. 3000-4500-6000-8000-14,000. If one breaks I always have a backup  :D I will likely sell a couple when the market improves, as I upgraded a bit during he last downturn ::)


It seems to be tha case that you can always find inexpensive GOOD lifts around if you keep your ear to the ground. I perfer Cats/Towmotor, Yale, Clark and newer imports (more $$$), but all good. I tend to like shuttle shift and pneumatics w/ common engines (Continentals, Chrysler 6's, w/ propane). Avoid older lifts w/ carbs as the Ethanol has begun to haunt them, or convert yourself to propane. One of mine is a diesel which I tend NOt to like as it is cold blooded. 


Ironwood






There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Don K

This thread almost sounds like an elementary school "my daddy is stronger than your daddy" Each person has their own preferences. Most people as stated had a life before sawmilling and Most people own acreage whether it be woodlot and/or pasture/cropland. They most likely owned a tractor before hand and used it in a bunch of ways. Technically skidsteers were developed for the industrial/construction field. Just recently have they been adapted for forestry type uses. Nobody in their right mind would buy a tractor and put a mulching head on it, though I have seen them at Moultrie. The tractor is not built for that.

The man's original question was to get a comparison about abilities of skidsteers and tractors. I'm sure out all these responses he can get a few valid ideas. I'm sure his decision will ultimately come down to: how much money can I afford to spend, What will give me the most overall use in my personal application, What will be easier to service and maintain, how much room do I have and what materials will I be handling and how, etc.?

As for my personal use I have a tractor with a FEL. I have acreage to mow, plow, and plant, Logs to skid, trailers to pull, area big enough to maneuver in and the list goes on. I crank my tractor everyday for something. Yea, I drool when I see the new tracked skidsteers but I ain't gonna spend what they cost and let it stay parked for days at a time because I ain't sawing. Instead I might buy a pool, camper, atv's or something else my whole family can enjoy when free time shows up.

It's like buying cars and trucks, everybody has their favorite, but they all go down the road. ;D

Don
Lucky to own a WM LT40HDD35, blessed to have a wife that encouraged me to buy it.     Now that\'s true love!
Massey Ferguson 1547 FWD with FEL  06 GMC Sierra 2500HD 4X4 Dozer Retriever Husky 359 20\" Bar  Man, life is getting good!

Bibbyman

I've never owned a forklift but it seems to me that while they'd have no problem with bundled lumber or stuff on a skid,  they'd be handicapped when trying to handle logs because of the limited reach and fork tilt. 

For example,  how would you reach into a pile of logs and tilt the forks down at an angle to "dig" out a log?  Also, once you pick a log up,  would you have enough tilt back to roll it back against the back of the forks?  Or tilt them down enough to roll the log off?  How do they work for unloading a log truck? (Unless you have one big enough and with a clamp to take the whole bunk of logs.)

I'm guessing you'd have to pretty much keep your logs on a single layer or take the one on the bottom, front edge of the pile. 

The forks on our Terex will tilt up about 15 and under more than 90.  Sometimes the 15 is not enough tilt back to always roll a log back against the back of the forks.   I've had times when I've not paid enough attention and only rolled back the forks a little and then went down a slight slope and have the log roll off.

How are they on uneven terrain?  Our Terexes have limited give in their suspension and will high center on a bump or dip that puts say 6" of travel on the suspension.  Looks like you center machine with enclosed cab has about the same axle setup.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDE25 Super 25hp 3ph with Command Control and Accuset.
Sawing since '94

beenthere

Don K
You summed that up pretty well.  :)

And there sure is a variety of information for the future reader who stumbles onto this thourough discussion.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Ironwood

My point is this, IF you need to move material, dollar for dollar a forklift will move the most # at the least cost IF it suits your land/ needs.

Ironwood
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Banjo picker

I have one more observation to add and then i'll shut up...I use a tractor with fel....and one draw back that it has that I don't rember being mentioned is that you can't see where the forks are as good as I wished you could...seems there is a brace or something alll ways in my line of site...but I cant afford anything besides what i have...it is better that the forks on the backhoe .....though it wont pick up as much...Tim
Never explain, your friends don't need it, and your enemies won't believe you any way.

beenthere

Now if some speed is what is needed, take a look at this promo video of a new model from JD.   :)

http://www.deere.com/en_US/cfd/construction/deere_const/high_speed_dozer/764_hsd_video.html
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

stonebroke

looks like a CNH Quadra Trac. built to pull scrapers on ground with no rocks. Wonder what the tracks cost and how often you have to replace them?

Stonebroke

Ironwood

Bibby,

Some forklifts do roll forward and back better than others. I have run mine on fairly uneven terrain and even my hayfields and occasionally the woods even. I always buy ones which tilt  for/aft well. That is an important issue I had not mentioned. As far as "digging" a log out, yes, you need to stage well and I suppose have alittle more room to organize them than you might w/ your reach and all, but sacrificing a few more acres is worth the cheaper price to me. We all have addressed our "trade offs".

Ironwood
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

backwoods sawyer

Quote from: Bibbyman on September 19, 2009, 02:32:26 AM
I've never owned a forklift but it seems to me that while they'd have no problem with bundled lumber or stuff on a skid,  they'd be handicapped when trying to handle logs because of the limited reach and fork tilt. 

For example,  how would you reach into a pile of logs and tilt the forks down at an angle to "dig" out a log?  Also, once you pick a log up,  would you have enough tilt back to roll it back against the back of the forks?  Or tilt them down enough to roll the log off?  How do they work for unloading a log truck? (Unless you have one big enough and with a clamp to take the whole bunk of logs.)

I'm guessing you'd have to pretty much keep your logs on a single layer or take the one on the bottom, front edge of the pile. 
If all you have is a forklift, you will find that there is more then one way to skin a cat.
I am very limited on log storage space, and maneuvering space so a forklift was my choice. I have a deep ditch along the driveway that I dump logs into it is lined with smaller logs to keep the good logs out of the dirt. As far as unloading trucks it has the lift to get the logs over the sides and has the carrying capacity to handle several at a time, sure it is not a t-rex but it does the job nicely. The tight turning radius allows me to turn 90* in a narrow one lane road and place the logs where I want them as far as unloading tilt the forks forward and give a quick stop and you are ready for more. At the mill a couple of 4x4 stickers lets you get out from under the log. As far as digging the logs out 11,000 pounds gives you quiet a bit of push, and I stack my logs high. For the log that is on the bottom of the stack in the ditch just through a chain around it and lift it out, set it on the road, scoop it up, and off to the mill you go. For going down hill with a load a fork lift runs in reverse real good so the load is held tight to the mast, and there are no worries of loosing a log. I would like to have a nice flat log yard that went on as far as I could fill it, but I have to work with what I have. A tractor big enough to handle logs with a front end loader would be to long for my needs. A skid steer would be maneuverable enough but would not be able to stack lumber in large units as high as the forklift will. Again I am very limited on lumber storage as well. To go along with the forklift one of these mini excavators would be on my short list.


Backwoods Custom Milling Inc.
100% portable. . Oregons largest portable sawmill service, serving all of Oregon, from our Backwoods to yours..sawing since 1991

Don K

Pretty neat excavator. I've never seen one with a fel on it just a dozer blade.

Don
Lucky to own a WM LT40HDD35, blessed to have a wife that encouraged me to buy it.     Now that\'s true love!
Massey Ferguson 1547 FWD with FEL  06 GMC Sierra 2500HD 4X4 Dozer Retriever Husky 359 20\" Bar  Man, life is getting good!

petefrom bearswamp

i only have  a tractor , Kubota 8540 with fel, forks and winch.
suits me!!.
Kubota 8540 tractor, FEL bucket and forks, Farmi winch
Kubota 900 RTV
Polaris 570 Sportsman ATV
3 Huskies 1 gas Echo 1 cordless Echo vintage Homelite super xl12
57 acres of woodland

Raider Bill

Pete, is that Bear swamp near Groton NY?
The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

Ironwood

Winch is for the SWAMP?  ;D

Ironwood
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

jcbrotz

What the H!!! were you trying to pick up??

On that note I have both a tc30 New Holland love it but its a compact I could and have sold a few New Hollands to a few people due to what I put it thru I haven't knock on wood broke a thing. Then I gots me a Cat 262b talk about liften power I love it would not trade the skid steer for anything.

That being said it all depends on how far and how much you want to do with it. It will always be a pissing match one way or the other.

Quote from: Bibbyman on September 10, 2009, 11:06:37 PM


Just my 2ยข ... I'm not a fan of either.   

While I've never owned a skidsteer,  I've been around a number of them.  Seems like there always somewhere between on their nose or on their tail.   The ones with tires tend to plow up a lot of ground.  I don't like the idea of climbing in and out over or under the load.

Farm tractors with a front end loader are an adaption.  The machine is not weighted enough to handle heavy loads.  Often the front axle and tires are not designed for constant use with heavy loads.  Look at a standard farm tractor and then look at an industrial tractor that is the basis of a backhoe.

A lot of people use skidsteers and farm tractors but a rough terrain forklift, wheel loader, or backhoe/industrial tractor would better fill the need.

2004 woodmizer lt40hd 33hp kubota, Cat 262B skidsteer and way to many tractors to list. www.Brotzmanswoodworks.com and www.Brotzmanscenturyfarm.com

beenthere

jcbrotz
For the explanation of that pic, you need to go to the "okmulch" post here.

https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php/topic,39019.msg561619.html#msg561619

Bibbyman 'borrowed' that pic for emphasis to his point.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Bibbyman

Welcome to the Forum jcbrotz.

Well,  I think this a good topic that covered a wide range of ideas and opinions and maybe a few facts.

The fact is,  if a machine was made to do one job perfectly,  it would do other jobs only so-so.  If a machine was made to do everything, it'd look like a five ton Swiss Army knife and would be cumbersome at every task. 

If I had a big mill that did 10-20 times as much material handling,  I'd have wheel loaders and forklifts. 

If I had one small mill for my personal use,  I'd probably use what I had the best I could.  And I've been there and done that.
Wood-Mizer LT40HDE25 Super 25hp 3ph with Command Control and Accuset.
Sawing since '94

backwoods sawyer

Quote from: Bibbyman on September 22, 2009, 08:25:34 PM
If I had one small mill for my personal use,  I'd probably use what I had the best I could.  And I've been there and done that.
When it comes right down to it the old puck up will skid log right to the mill. If you have enough room, when you fill up the area around the mill you can move it and start new stacks of lumber and edgings, thereby eliminating the need for any new equipment except for a good selection of pee-vees.
Backwoods Custom Milling Inc.
100% portable. . Oregons largest portable sawmill service, serving all of Oregon, from our Backwoods to yours..sawing since 1991

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