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Plumbing with pex

Started by Larry, April 28, 2009, 02:55:51 PM

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Larry

I hired pro's to plumb everything under my house slab.  They brought pex above grade and have all the manifolds installed.  Considering finishing the job myself to save money...pex does not appear near as complicated as my first look indicated.

It appears there are now a lot of do it yourself fittings on the market. So...what type of fittings seem the best?
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

Raider Bill

Larry,

Pex is easy to work with but my problem with it is when you take a 1/2 inch pipe then put in your fitting it restricts you down to say 3/8th inch.

I have great volume coming into my house until it hits the pex.

I used 3/4 to my hose bibs but then redid them with cpvc for this reason.

I notice it at the sink and tub mostly.

Not sure I'd use it again at high flow faucets. House is done with 1/2 pex.
The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

Dodgy Loner

I like pex a lot.  It's much more forgiving than cpvc.  I prefer the copper compression fittings.  My whole house is done in 1/2" pex and I've never had any problems with the flow.  Plumbing isn't a tough job, but be sure not to cross your hot and cold lines when you plumb the shower.  I've been to a couple of homes that were plumbed by homeowners where I got a rude awakening in the shower.
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Raider Bill

I'm not familer with those fittings. I bought all of mine at the blue store as nobody else carried it.
Mine have a brass fitting that slides into the pex then a ring that you compress around the outside.
The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

HOOF-ER

The crimpers are pricey. If you do alot I would buy the one with the copper sleeves that you compress. I don't do alot and bought the one with the stainless slip clamps. The crimper was about $100 cheaper. I works great , never had one leak..........yet. ::)
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crowder888

PEX is fantastic!  I've used it in many projects.  In fact I once bought a house that had been vacant for some time and someone had come in and cut out all the copper piping right at the slab.  The PEX is so easy to work with that I had replumbed the entire house (900 sq ft) in about 4 hours.  Like some of the others have said the crimper is somewhat of an investment but you more than make it up in time saved.

Warbird

I can't say enough good things about pex.  You can rent the crimpers if that is the style of connection you want to go with.  If doing it yourself saves you enough, you might consider going with Shark Bite connectors.  They are super simple and super fast, but they are expensive.  I use them because they let me go directly from copper to pex and back again.

ps.  If you go with Shark Bites, be sure to get a couple of the tiny release pieces.  It slides over the pex and pushes down on the fitting making it so it will release and you can pull the connector off.  Very handy if/when you get one put on sort of sideways and need to take it off and do it over.

pps.  While Shark Bites are super fast, take the extra 10 seconds at each connection and make certain it is seated properly.

IMERC

cake and pie...

read the mfgrs how to .pdf's....
and don't be tempted to mix brands on the tube or fittings.... select one and stay with it all the way thru...
life will be easier down the road...
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moonhill

Soldering is going to become an art form.  Pex is a way to take the art out of plumbing.  It comes in red and blue so you don't get the pipes crossed and end up with cold showers and hot toilets, although that will cut down on the tank sweating in the summer, and by adding colors you could become an artist if you are creative. 

Tim
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scsmith42

I converted over to pex for some of my farmhouses and buildings about a year ago, and have really enjoyed it.  I use 1/2", 3/4" and 1", and my 1/2" and 3/4" crimpers are the "side-opening" type so that I can use them in tight plalces (such as in a crawl space).  I recall that someone a while back posted an e-bay link with some crimpers that did multiple sizes of tubing.

Bill, I too was concerned regarding the flow loss, so I brought 3/4" into the houses and ran some of the infrastructure with it, and neck down to 1/2" when I penetrate a wall.  No problems whatsoever with flow!

Larry, I'd suggest stopping by your local professional plumbing supply house and seeing what brand they carry.  The local's here use the brass style fittings with the crimp sleeve, and sometimes the "push on" style if they are working in a tight space and $ are not an issue.

Scott
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Raider Bill

Quote from: scsmith42 on April 29, 2009, 07:23:36 AM
Bill, I too was concerned regarding the flow loss, so I brought 3/4" into the houses and ran some of the infrastructure with it, and neck down to 1/2" when I penetrate a wall.  No problems whatsoever with flow!

Larry, I'd suggest stopping by your local professional plumbing supply house and seeing what brand they carry.  The local's here use the brass style fittings with the crimp sleeve, and sometimes the "push on" style if they are working in a tight space and $ are not an issue.

Scott

Theres where I went wrong. I used 1/2 mostly with the brass inserts. Presure from my pump is 65 lbs. Shower and kitchen sink flow is very low.

I would use it again but would up size to 3/4 and or use as better fitting.
The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

iffy

In my new house I installed a manobloc and make all my runs from it. This is a manifold that has the valves already installed. You make a separate run to each fixture. This allows you to turn off any fixture without affecting others. It also allows you to take a shower without worrying about who is flushing stools or running washing machines. My runs are 1/2" and I don't have any volume/pressure problems. My manobloc was about $175 for a 36 port, but you get 36 valves integral with it and you don't have to put a valve at the fixture end. You will use more pex this way, but pex is really pretty cheap.

ksu_chainsaw

I just finished installing PEX in the trailer we are living in now.  I got all the fittings and parts at Menards.  It is the style that has the coated copper crimp rings that go over the fitting.  The crimpers were the highest cost of everything, but they crimp both 1/2" and 3/4".  They also have the universal stainless steel crimp rings- the crimpers cost less, but the rings cost more.  It is homeowner easy to do it all, the shark-bite style connectors are nice for repair work, but they are too expensive to do an entire house with them.  Just make sure that you keep the same brand of pipe, connectors, and crimps throughout the house.

I went the cheap route on the trailer and did a traditional plumbing run with Tees instead of a manifold.  On all the fixtures, I crimped on 1/2" copper, then sweated valves on- they make a wonderful elbow that has a mounting plate soldered onto it- just screw it down, then crimp the pex on.  They have the bullet ends on them, so if you are not finishing an area, you can turn the water on to the entire house without spraying water everywhere. 

I would say that it would be easy enough for you to go and get a set of crimpers and finish your plumbing yourself.

Charles

sharp edge

Bill
Just checked my pex fitting on 3/4" on brass and copper. pex pipe is 11/16 ID , fitting are 11/16 OD and 17/32 ID.  A short  restriction doesn't hurt water flow very much. Lots of the new valves at kitchen and bathes have cut back flows, so you can't wast water. Like 1/8' hole in the valve. 

My house and well were done in plastic 30 years ago and still work great. 8)

SE
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Raider Bill

Well I guess I need to chaulk this up as another live and learn.
I would certainly use pex again no question about it but I would think about the flow better and up size to 3/4 or get better fittings.
The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

Ironmower

Yep, thats all I use now, great stuff :)
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woodmills1

I got a pex crimper with my free heat machine outdoor furnace install kit.  It sort of looks like a ball joint seperator, it bolts around the ring and you tighten 2 bolts to crimp.  It is slow but also cheap.  Might be a lot for a whole house.
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JSNH

I use the propex fittings and a pro pex expander. The tool is not cheep but boy does it work great. 1/2" is a breeze 1" is a work out. If you are doing alot of it you may want to be aware of that type. Expand, slide on to fitting, turn on water 30 seconds done. I installed from a 1" copper line a premade 4 valve bank and did straight runs to the fixtures, one to the shower, one to the toilet& sink, One to the kitchen sink, one to washing machine & outside facuet. Did the same on hot side. Now no more hot cold blasts while in shower. Cost $300 in pipe and fitting. Sold $300 of scrap copper.

http://www.pexsupply.com/video/PEXConnections.asp

above for video on different pex systems.

rowerwet

doing a manifold for hot and cold water with seperate runs for each fixture is the best way to keep pressure and flow constant. you should be able to do 1/2" pex this way, doing pex in series like you do with copper doesn't work due to ID of pex and fittings.
I used pex for my CB outdoor pellet boiler hookup it was easy and sharkbites are the best connection system I have found.
From reading on plumbing forums I have found plumbers who have had sharkbites in service for over ten years without a failure (how long they have been able to get them)
Husky 460, Fiskars x27, X7

Larry

I stumbled on this PDF the other day which tells ya everything you ever wanted to know about PEX.

http://www.toolbase.org/PDF/DesignGuides/pex_designguide.pdf

Should be required reading before you get in the plumbing business.

I still haven't decided which connectors I'm going to use but from the responses here and from my reading I'm leaning towards buying one of the high quality crimpers.
Larry, making useful and beautiful things out of the most environmental friendly material on the planet.

We need to insure our customers understand the importance of our craft.

mrcaptainbob

I've used pex on the hydronic floor heat (1/2") in the two baths, as well as the supply to/from (1") the owb. It is great to work with. The first time I was told to use the gray plastic compression fittings with the plastic compression rings. They dried and leaked after two years. Went to the crimp fittings on barbs and all is well. Then came the the Shark-Bites and I used them on the upstairs bath's hydronic system. Also used the Sharks for some copper work where it was impossible to solder. They are all holding steady now for over a year and I have experimented with temperature extremes to verify possible leaks on both the copper and the pex. All is good so far. Some locales have codes that deny using Shark-Bites inside of walls or ceilings or other enclosed spaces.

Raider Bill

In reading this I can see where I went wrong as I plumbed it like you would using PVC "trunk" lines then off shoots to my fixtures. Guess I have to redo somethings. ::)
The First 70 years of childhood is always the hardest.

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