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Pulp Prices

Started by TexasTimbers, January 07, 2009, 08:45:55 PM

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TexasTimbers

Many of the ranchers in my area are pulping their timber for $5!  :o

I am watching load after load of "pulp" going past my place and most of the loads are sawlogs. They load pulp trees all on one and sawlog worthy trees on another. They aren't bucking them in the field though.

They aren't pulping those sawlogs are they? There's a mill in DeKalb that will buy those sawlogs and that's got to be where they are going. I haven't dropped in to nose around on any of the sites yet but am going to.

What are pulp prices in y'alls areas?
The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

CLL

Don't know about Texas, but in Missouri, cedar pulp is $5-10 on the stump. Of course you always get people that swear they pay twice that, but their not cutting,just talkin, same people that say they pay 60 cents for saw logs.
Too much work-not enough pay.

TexasTimbers

On this track right down the road they are taking everything, including walnut. Ash, White and red Oak, and on one track I know of but haven't seen they are taking the boxelder off the creek. I know about that because the guy called and asked if I wanted the boxelders. I offered $20 ton if they were bucked and set aside. Said he'd talk to his logger.
The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

Ron Wenrich

We've never had much of a pulp market.  More of ours would be going to firewood.

There are lots of reasons for cutting, but market conditions isn't one of them, right now.  It seems that someone is strapped for cash. 
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

SwampDonkey

I'm assuming the $5/ton is stumpage? If I had a plantation that needs an intermediate thinning I could see that as being reasonable, because wood would be 6-8 inches and I'd want a good job done and not scun up and high graded. But, if it's clear cutting $5 don't even come close, I'm assuming it's not all pulp quality. I agree with Ron, someone is starving and is in liquidation mode. No harvest buffers on creeks in Texas? Just curious. There is suppose to be here, but doesn't seem to be enforced in some areas.  ::)
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

TexasTimbers

Quote from: SwampDonkey on January 08, 2009, 07:38:48 AMNo harvest buffers on creeks in Texas? Just curious.

I don't know what a harvest buffer is. Sounds like a regulation.

But on the strapped for cash theory. The one rancher who's tract that is down my road about a half mile is not strapped for cash. I am not his accountant, but out of everyone on my road, except the few actual time clock-punchers who have real jobs, I am probably the low guy on the financial totem pole, and we aren't hurting.

Surely not enough to sell quality hardwood saw logs for $5 a ton essentially give away good timber on a large scale.  This same rancher ~ mostly they are ranchers here in my immediate area although I use the term farmer too liberally/out of context ~ allow me to log thier timber on the limited small scale that I do.

The other guy who called me, he and his wife are both teachers at Bonham HS. I don't know there financial situation but they never struck me as bad money managers. They do have a lot of acerage there though in excess of 100 acres so maybe they need help on the property taxes. On the other hand I know he has it farmed so those shouldn't be too bad either.

The puplers and loggers moved in here over this past year because there is a huge lake going in ~ Lake Ralph Hall, named after our illustrious Democrat/Republican (he was demo and switched to repub during the repub revolution ::) ) but these tracts do not fall anywhere near the land getting lost to the lake.

Nope. I don't get it. There's too many people doing it for me to think they are all in the poor house. This pulper must be a door-knocker with a silver tongue. I guess the lure of several thousand tons @ $5 a ton is too much for even "ol Jack the rancher to pass up.


The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

SwampDonkey

From the outside looking in, appearances can be deceiving. I've learned people can't be judged that way. The poorest looking often have the most in the bank. And many I've seen bragging have been left with their tail between their cheeks.  ;)
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

TexasTimbers

Oh yes I know that. I tried to give the sense I am aware of that in how I said it. But going on what I have to go on, I am saying I don't think that is the case.

But you're right it could be even though I don't think so. I have found that, surprisingly, just because I think something is so, reality will not cooperate with the way I think the world ought to be, or the way I think something is. :D
The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

Gary_C

Quote from: TexasTimbers on January 08, 2009, 10:28:04 AM
Oh yes I know that. I tried to give the sense I am aware of that in how I said it. But going on what I have to go on, I am saying I don't think that is the case.

But you're right it could be even though I don't think so. I have found that, surprisingly, just because I think something is so, reality will not cooperate with the way I think the world ought to be, or the way I think something is. :D

Yup, I know that too.   ??? ???

:D :D :D
Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.

pineywoods

$5 a ton, don't I wish...I just sold some for 50 cents a ton....took out all the small pin oak and sweetgum, left the pine and sawlog sized hardwood. Did a nice job of cleanning up the place, but I still haven't been paid  >:(
1995 Wood Mizer LT 40, Liquid cooled kawasaki,homebuilt hydraulics. Homebuilt solar dry kiln.  Woodmaster 718 planner, Kubota M4700 with homemade forks and winch, stihl  028, 029, Ms390
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TexasTimbers

yikes. piney load your trees up and bring them here. ;D

Donk what is a harvest buffer?
The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

Gary_C

A more technical term would be RMZ or riparian management zone. On timber sales where there is a wetland or stream, etc. you are not supposed to cut nor make tracks in the RMZ. The obvious reason is to prevent the riparian areas from being cleared and allowing sediment to wash into the stream or wetland.
Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.

SwampDonkey

"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

TexasTimbers

I follow yooz gize now.

On the timber by the creek, is that a national wetland thing or state regulated?

I would guess violating a wetland ordinance could get your kiester in a tight spot.  :-X

The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

SwampDonkey

Up here it is provincial. A 30 meter buffer, slope distance, and only 30 % removal, no machines within 10 meters. But, I see it violated all the time on private woodlots. They don't leave a stick except maybe right on the bank of the brook.  It happened to dad, and the logger said he couldn't pay for wood he couldn't cut. Presto, free wood. :-X
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Ron Wenrich

Around here its just common sense.   ;)   But, the state has an agency called the Fish Commission that looks after such things.  They have a tendency to get to be real nasty if they see anything in the water (other than fish).
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

SwampDonkey

Hard to reform some that were used to running skidders up a gravel bed for years.  :-X
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Texas Ranger

In Texas they are called SMZ's, stream management zones.  They are voluntarily protected,  if you have an dealings with the Soils folks, then it gets a little tighter. Tax plans usually call for SMZ's for a tax break.  SMZ's can have selective harvest of less than 50% of the stand, no tops or trash in the streams, and no drag trails.
The Ranger, home of Texas Forestry

TexasTimbers

Tex, what is pulp on the stump bringing over in y'alls neck?
The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

dsgsr

I guess from what I'm hearing I should feel lucky about our pulp prices. Here in my area of Maine As of 2-weeks ago I was getting $50.00 ton for hardwood pulp and $47.00 ton for softwood.

David
Northlander band mill
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TexasTimbers

David that wasn't stump prices though surely. You are hauling it to the pulper and getting that for delivered, yes?
The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

fishpharmer

I was told $13 per ton hardwood pulp on the stump.  $30 per ton hardwood sawlogs.  He is itchin to cut some of my land.  I am not so sure.  I would love to saw some myself.  

Then about a month ago a forester/timber buyer for Georgia Pacific told me $17 per ton for hardwood pulp.

Sounds like its across the board.
Built my own band mill with the help of Forestry Forum. 
Lucas 618 with 50" slabber
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The reason a lot of people do not recognize opportunity is because it usually goes around wearing overalls looking like hard work. --Tom A. Edison

thompsontimber

Yeah Dave, you should be feeling pretty good about those prices...ours keeps dropping down here and we might be able to afford to truck it to Maine!  Pine pulp is in the toilet so bad that the $5/Tn people are in disbelief over for stumpage could probably be bought around here for $5/cord, at least if it has to be moved right now.  Delivered pine prices have fell to sub $20/tn, and even those places are full so u can't even sell it for that, u just have to sit on it.  Hardwood pulp is in demand, and still fetching sub 30/ton

Round these parts, the prices you have been given sound exceptional fishpharmer...but its all relative to the local market, and I am not familiar with yours

WDH

Fish,

Those prices are way higher than what I see across most parts of the South.  Even in the best of times, those would be good strong prices.

Across most of the South, pine pulpwood is selling for $5 to $9 per ton on the stump.  Hardwood usually sells for less than pine.
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

SwampDonkey

The difference here is stumpage, your talking mill delivered price in Maine. I know those markets as our marketing boards have contracts over there in eastern Maine.

$8-$10 a metric tonne is about all you could squeeze right now on hardwood and aspen stumpage. In the Hay day, $15-20 was top dollar when pulp was $58 a metric tonne. The highest paying mill now is hit and miss with $54 I think, but you can't haul like there is no tomorrow. They have been called to task when they bulked at us hauling to Maine, but shutting wood flow off and on like a light switch. Apparently, it's ok to be fickle as a buyer, but not a seller. The president recently took another job. :D

"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

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