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wood-boring insect in interior timbers?

Started by FrankLad, June 16, 2008, 03:44:52 PM

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FrankLad

Hey guys!

We have a contract with a pest control company, and someone comes by our house every few months to spray for bugs.  They also give it the once-over indoors.  My wife and I are not a fan of the indoor stuff and, although they say it is safe for kids, my wife and boys head into town and run errands for a couple hours, leaving the windows open.

Anyhow, the insect guy said he "noticed some activity" by one of the posts.  I checked and sure enough there was a single small pile of fine powder on top of the baseboard near one of our posts.  I traced it up and found the small, round hole (pin hole, maybe 1mm in size), which I'm guessing is apparently the exit-hole of a powder post beetle.  The exterminator didn't seem too concerned with it - just mentioned it in passing.

I've done some searching here on the forums and on the net.  Found lots of info about these beetles with regards to attacks in timber stock, or floor joists in areas where there may be moisture (like crawl spaces and such), and places like exterior parts of log cabins.

Read on several places that infestations can be better suppressed in moisture-controlled/central heat environments.

As the timber was never kiln dried (don't know of anybody around here that has successfully dried timbers), I'm hoping this is a scenario where the larva was in the wood and just emerged indoors (possibly due to changing moisture content in the wood?).

I've also read more than one mention on the websites of log bed builders who advise their customers that bugs may emerge from the wood after it has been in their house for a while, and to not be alarmed.  (Of course, this may be some other type of bug...?)

Obviously, I am concerned, but I'm hoping it's nothing too serious.

Any thoughts with regards to powder post beetles attacking interior timbers?

This is cypress, by the way.

Thanks for any advice!

Don P

It is about the time of year when they hatch out to mate. If you cork that hole she can't use it to lay in again. If there aren't many holes it probably isn't a problem. True ppb's aren't near as fussy about high moisture content as you might think. I've been in old houses and barns where I think they hatch, fly up to mate and lay right back in the same holes. An ever increasing population.
I sanded off the finish, borated, resanded and refinished the TF we've been working on after I saw several frass piles. I've not seen more but it doesn't mean they didn't just hatch out and leave. I didn't have finished materials down yet and figured it was my last "easy" opportunity to treat the timbers.
I'd just plug holes and watch the next couple of years carefully.
If the infestation is bad, you have a ready supply of pioneer baby powder.

FrankLad

Thanks, Mr. Don!

Ha ha - "pioneer baby powder".  I hope it never gets to that point.  Gives me shivers thinking about it.

I'm planning to go ahead and order some BoraCare.  More expensive than Timbor, but better penetration from what I gather.  Even if I don't use any on the inside, it'll be good to use on the exterior.




Don P

Also google Shell Guard. The glycol used in Bora care is ethylene glycol. Shell Guard uses polyethylene glycol and propylene glycol, both low toxicity if that is the concern inside.

PineNut

I have been using a home made version of Bora-Care. Cost about $20-22/gal with ingredients available at Wal-Mart. I tried a version of Timbore but not any more. The Bora-Care equivalent is much easier to apply and I believe much more effective.


moonhill

That powder gives me slivers thinking about it.

I like the content of this thread.  I have been putting up with pine borers, black stain, mold and such in my winters project.  With the on set of warm weather all these things have concerned the owner.  They are only visiting for the summer and won't come back, I consul.  I feel lucky I don't see much in the line of PPB's.  Knock on wood.  When the young pine borers are about to come out as adults they seem like something out of a science fiction movie.

You guys seem to have a different opinion on what borate product is safe for inside use.  Could one of you post a link for further reading?  Thanks,      Tim B.
This is a test, please stand by...

FrankLad

Good info here, and great to get other opinions.

I've been reading that BoraCare is safe - but that is info from the sites that sell it - so I'm glad to have feedback from folks who don't have a vested interest in the company.

Bottom line is I want to do whatever is the safest.

PineNut:  Would you mind sharing your formula?  I stumbled across one here in the forums that involved heating the ingredients and mixing, etc.  If it's different than that, I'd like to hear it.  The price looks nice as well!

Thanks!





Don P

Bora care is safe. Safe, as many things is not an either/or kind of thing. The glycol carrier is safer in Shell Guard than the glycol carrier in Bora Care. I did not infer by that that Bora Care is unsafe  :). Ethylene glycol is toxic at about 4 oz's I believe... which would be hard to ingest in the mix but is not out of the question from the jug... I saw babies in your avatar and jumped to the conclusion you might not want it around. Polyethylene glycol and propylene glycol will probably cause a case of the runs. The borate itself is pretty low tox and tastes bad enough I don't think you could ingest enough to cause trouble.

In areas with alot in the groundwater the men experience a certain disinterest in some things. I've used a fair amount and can't say that it's helped  ;D.

I don't use any of the pre mixes. I use Solubor from the Ag supply, it's usually around $50 for 50 lbs. Mix 1 lb/gallon of water for a 10% solution, I add glycol according to the drying conditions of the day and site, from a quart to a half gallon/ 5 gallon batch. Stir well, hot water is best, and spray,roll or brush on, repeatedly. If you have leftover you aren't done applying. Use it up and clean the equipment well.

PineNut

My mix is:
3 ½  lb of boric acid (roach powder)
4 ½ lb of borax
1 gal of glycol antifreeze
Heat to 260 F

It is possible to get boric acid cheaper from other sources if you want to get 50 lb bags.

Dilution:
1:1 or 1:2 for hardwoods
1:3 for pine

Generally I use 1:2 for hardwood and wet the wood good. Due to the quicker absorption in pine, I use a 1:3 dilution. I get about the same coverage for a unit of stock solution. I find that I can leave the dilute solution in a sprayer for a couple of days without problems.

I have not used this on dried lumber but expect that it would be best to use two or three applications of 1:3 to 1:5.

It would probably be best to dead stack the lumber for a day before sticking it. I do this sometimes but it adds extra work so most of the time I don't.

If you use a mix without the glycol, you will probably encounter two problems. (1) The solution will crystallize in a sprayer and (2) crystals will form on the surface of the wood. That means that part of the boron is on the surface and not in the wood.

Hope this helps you.


FrankLad

DonP: Thanks for the info there.  I usually err on the side of caution.  Sorry for jumping to a quick conclusion.  Glad to read that it is indeed mostly safe, although I'm really thinking about giving the homebrew mix a try, to save some bucks.

PineNut:  Looks like a good mix!  Much appreciated!  Who is your source for the borax?

PineNut

Cheapest source I have found for borax is Wal-Mart. It is in the laundry detergents section. Another source of boric acid is thechemistrystore.com.  They sell 55 pounds for $90 and about $30 shipping   

FrankLad


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