warped boards.

okie · May 20, 2008, 01:49:50 PM

I just cut up a hackberry that fell down winter before last that was about 13" dia 9' from the butt. This log has been "hung up" off a mud ledge and supported by the tops of other trees so I pulled it down yesterday and cut a log out of it and sawed it up just a while ago. Sawed it into 4 2x4's, 1 2x6, 2 1x4's, and 2 1x2's. The 2x6, 1x4's, and 1x2's come off just fine but the stinking 2x4's warped while I was cutting them.... no Joke you could actually see the cut open up 1/2" when I was half way through my horizontal cut. The lumber was dimensionally correct the whole length of the boards so what causes this? I am sure there is a simple answer but I am greener than polk so please forgive me.
Morgan

Dan_Shade · May 20, 2008, 01:54:26 PM

what you witnessed is caused by tension, it's quite common in certain species. You can offset this a little bit by rotating the log 180 degrees and taking a few boards off the cant and flipping it back and forth. also, the orientation of the growth rings will effect the way a board moves.

okie · May 20, 2008, 02:13:07 PM

Thanks Dan. I got a lot to learn I reckon but I'll enjoy every minute of it. You reckon most hackberries are like this? I hope not, it cut like butter.
Morgan

Fla._Deadheader · May 20, 2008, 03:12:59 PM

I have been sawing Leche Amarillo, for several days. Most lumber lays pretty nice, maybe a little bow and warp. Yesterday, I sawed a 20' leche, into 2 X 4's, and MOST bowed 6-8 " , forming a domed roof line.

Measure from end of board to end of board, and the highpoint was 14" different from the end points. :

:

I can saw from the top or from the side, with my Peterson. Didn't matter one bit.

While I was sawing, it sounded like thunder, from the log splitting as I relieved the tension. :

;D ;D

Y'all got it good, up there. :D :D :D :D

ladylake · May 20, 2008, 03:16:14 PM

It's the worst when the outside of a log gets dried down some and the inside is still wet. Steve

Ironwood · May 20, 2008, 03:34:29 PM

Similar to the Tree of Heaven I cut yesterday. Tension, it can even be released in the shop after drying and you take too much off one side on the jointer. This will also pull the board out of wack.

Ironwood

D Martin · May 20, 2008, 05:26:04 PM

The maple I am planining and ripping into flooring I had to cull abou 30% due to warping ,twisting, cupping, bowing etc.. It was hapening as I was cutting but hapend more during drying. Good thing I put it on the top of the pile or it would have lifted up the nice straight red oak. I like red oak much better. The maple was fairly straight when it was standing too.

HOOF-ER · May 20, 2008, 08:31:32 PM

OK :D Gotta ask the question. Ironwood what the world are you doing with the Tree of Heaven. Inquiring minds want to know. Well maybe just my mind.

Ironwood · May 20, 2008, 08:49:24 PM

Just playing w/ it to see what it looks like. I am thinking of marketing a conference table to a local group of nuns ;D. Actually I have seen the one local group Sisters of Charity clearcut an entire hillside

. I hope they spent th timber money wisely, there won't be any more for 80 years. NOTHING LEFT!!

Ironwood

okie · May 20, 2008, 08:49:51 PM

Looks like this is a real common occurance. One of these days with y'alls help I'll have all these things figured out.

Dan_Shade · May 20, 2008, 09:05:03 PM

some wood is excellent for rocking chairs.

another trick when the cant is moving, is to flip it over, take an 1/8" or so cut, and then drop the inch. that keeps the "thick and thin" boards to a minimum.

Dale Hatfield · May 20, 2008, 09:11:27 PM

Stink wood has some pretty nice grain. But thast comming from a guy that thinks hardwood floor should be elm ifn it wasnt such a bugger to dry.

STINK WOOD = Tree Of heaven an Invasive species. Will grow right right in the middle of the sidewalk, If it rains right after seeds drop.

okie · May 20, 2008, 09:49:05 PM

Dale, What is stink wood.
Dan, I am running a Lucas mill so I would have to turn the whole log in order to cut from the other side, I am not sure if that is feasable. I am brand new to this though, I doubt if I have cut 1000 bdft, probably closer to 600. I have just been tinkering with it right now on logs that are expendable before I really tie into it. I want to learn all the tricks I can on the scrubby little logs I got laying around, I will build me a building for my mill out of this "practice wood. I will say though, the only board that I have had that was more than 1/8'' off the dimensions I was trying for was a board that I was cutting out of the very bottom of the log trying to get one more board out of it. I got 3/4 through the cut and the whole (what was left of it) log shifted foreward and I got a wedge shape for the last 1/4 length of the board.

Dan_Shade · May 20, 2008, 09:58:47 PM

ok, you have to work slightly differently with swingmills to deal with tension. Maybe some of the swinger guys can come in and help you with how deal with tension.

Ianab · May 21, 2008, 03:15:18 AM

Only so much you can do with those banana boards :

Best results seem to be flat sawing and keeping the growth rings centered. That way the boards mostly just bow in the flat direction. Then you can stash them on the bottom of the drying stack and hope they dry reasonably flat. If they bow AND crook, which they can if they are rift sawn, then you have a challange.

Leaving the right hand slab attached to the log will also reduce the whole log bowing as you take one side off. If the log does develop a serious kink you can also skim a thin layer off to get things flat again.

Ian

adrean louis · May 21, 2008, 10:08:23 AM

i cut some 20 inch hackberry logs this winter, they worked great, they were cut about 14 months ago, very nice boards but heavy

LeeB · May 21, 2008, 03:05:09 PM

Kep practicing with that hackberry. When you get to where you can keep it straight, anything else will be a walk in the park. Hackberry, because of it's interlocked grain, has a big tendency to move on you.

Ironwood · May 21, 2008, 07:59:08 PM

Tree of heaven also has the interwoven grain (like Mahogany), it was a MAJOR pain to cut. What a hassle. Two blades choked full of pulpy nasty garbage and not such a straight cut. Color and grain were nice though, I may NOT mess w/ these again.

Ironwood

okie · May 21, 2008, 09:08:02 PM

Ok time for me to look like a moron again. What is a tree of heaven?

beenthere · May 21, 2008, 09:27:03 PM

Stinky!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ailanthus_altissima

Ironwood · May 21, 2008, 09:51:43 PM

Thanks for the link. Several fairly large ones locally on the streets have had a fairly obvious "cross hatch" appearence on the bark. I cut the freshest one today and the other may be FUNKY as it was cut last year, I may also play with it to see if it spalts or just goes bad I am a glutton.

Ironwood

okie · May 21, 2008, 09:59:00 PM

Thanks for clearing that up.

olyman · May 21, 2008, 10:11:02 PM

from the article beenthere posted---you can have that tree---yechhh!!!

WDH · May 21, 2008, 11:15:09 PM

Quote from: LeeB on May 21, 2008, 03:05:09 PM
Kep practicing with that hackberry. When you get to where you can keep it straight, anything else will be a walk in the park. Hackberry, because of it's interlocked grain, has a big tendency to move on you.

I am with Lee on the hackberry. Pretty, but a bugger to cut and get straight lumber because of the interlocked grain. One year the cells that make up the wood tilt in one direction, the next year, they tilt in the other direction. Like elm and sweetgum and blackgum. Makes it almost unsplittable. Sycamore too. That is why most of them are pallet wood these days.

okie · May 21, 2008, 11:30:06 PM

WDH, the replies on here about interlocked grain on hackberry surprise me. Reason being, for the last 3 years I have been heating almost exclusively with it and it splits real well for me with a maul. I get a few blocks that are stubborn but usually find a knot in there. I got a buddy that wants em gone theyre " taking up perfectly good pasture land" so I have been cutting there every year for the last 3 with no problems. Now elm, I wont repeat the profanity that come out of my mouth the first time I tied into a block of that. For splitting firewood here my picks are ash first, hackberry, and some oak (you can keep the black jack). Ash is a dream to split. As I watch the slab pile grow, I am thinking that my firewood cutting days are numbered though ;D.

WDH · May 21, 2008, 11:42:25 PM

Hackberry is in the elm family, so it is an elm cousin. I have sawn some hackberry, and some of the boards dried nice and straight and some warped badly. I have to say that I have never split any hackberry, so it nice to hear that it is not as bad an actor as elm.