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How do I heat my shop without burning it down?

Started by brdmkr, January 19, 2008, 08:26:14 PM

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brdmkr

It is cold (At least for S. GA it's cold).  Anyway, I got plenty to work on in my shop, but it is too cold to be over there.  Today, I bought a wood stove and stove pipe in hopes of warming things up some 8)  However, I could not find the piece that insulates the pipe from the surrounding wood.  Are there any homemade remedies for running the pipe through the wall?  The shop is all pine, and I'd prefer not to send it up in flames :o

I have been thinking about concrete backer board, but I don't really know how well that would stand up to the heat.   I also thought about cutting a hole in the siding and putting a piece of sheet metal over that and running the pipe through that, but I think the sheet would have to be too large to be an effective insulator.  Any ideas (or pics ;) appreciated)!  Is there a rule of thumb regarding how much space I should have between pipe and wood?
Lucas 618  Mahindra 4110, FEL and pallet forks, some cant hooks, and a dose of want-to

Radar67

Here is what the Fire Protection Act says-

You should not pass a stove pipe through a combustible wall for a hook-up with a chimney flue. However, if there is no alternative, the stove pipe must be passed through a thimble or collar. NFPA has set these standards:

    —A ventilated type 24-gauge metal thimble must be at least 12 inches larger in diameter than the stove pipe. (It can be made by a local sheet metal company or tinsmith.)
    —A metal or burned fire-clay thimble must be surrounded by no less than eight inches of brickwork or equivalent fire-resistant material.
    —Otherwise, all combustible material must be cut out of the wall to provide at least 18 inches of clearance on all sides of the pipe. Material for closing this opening must be noncombustible and insulating.

Is concrete board non-combustible? I'm not 100% sure.
"A man's time is the most valuable gift he can give another." TOM

If he can cling to his Blackberry, I can cling to my guns... Me

This will kill you, that will kill you, heck...life will kill you, but you got to live it!

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SwampDonkey

How much space you heating? It can get pretty hot in a little shop when it's not even frigid out. I have to keep my door open all the time or go into melt down.  Off the top of my head  ::) , my shop is 12' x 30' and 8' ceiling, inside my barn. :D :D The barn is more than twice as large. Lumber storage and such ya know. ;)
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

brdmkr

I hear ya Radar, but the problem is nobody has a thimble!  I have a 6" pipe, so I suppose an 18" diameter pipe through the wall would work, but that is larger than the spacing between the studs. 
Lucas 618  Mahindra 4110, FEL and pallet forks, some cant hooks, and a dose of want-to

Radar67

No, you have to cut a 42 inch square hole in the wall and center the pipe. If concrete board is non-combustible, you could cut it down to 42x42 (remember to allow overlap for nailing), cut a 6 inch hole, for the pipe, in the center, and nail it up on each side of the hole. Of course, you would have to install a header in the opening, like you were framing for a window.No thimble needed.
"A man's time is the most valuable gift he can give another." TOM

If he can cling to his Blackberry, I can cling to my guns... Me

This will kill you, that will kill you, heck...life will kill you, but you got to live it!

"The man who can comprehend the why, can create the how." SFC J

WH_Conley

Just wait a day or two and you won't have to worrry about it.

On the other hand SD might have to read up on the codes. :D :D
Bill

CHARLIE

It's hard to believe that you can't find an insulated steel chimney. They are sold at places like Home Depot and Lowes.   I'm sure there are places nearby that sell steel fireplaces. In fact, I'm surprised that the place you bought your woodstove didn't sell them.  If I were in your shoes.....I wouldn't mess around with "make do".  I'd do it to code.  First, your home insurance company might frown on you having a woodstove in your shop.....and surely would frown if you didn't use a "to code" chimney.  If your shop did catch fire, you wouldn't want your insurance company to not pay because you were not to code. That's my 2¢.
Charlie
"Everybody was gone when I arrived but I decided to stick around until I could figure out why I was there !"

brdmkr

I was surprised that I could not find the stuff I needed to run through the wall.  Charlie, you are right regarding safety.  Whatever I wind up doing, it will be safe.  I checked on the backer board and it is considered non-combustible.  I think I am going to cut a hole for a window and then install 48" x 48" backer board in the hole.  I'll run the pipe through that and then replace it all with a window during the remainder of the year.  I'll have to study up on a way to be able swap between window and wood stove, but I ought to be able to figure something out.

Lucas 618  Mahindra 4110, FEL and pallet forks, some cant hooks, and a dose of want-to

DanG

A woodstove store isn't the only place you can buy a woodstove.  I see used ones advertised all the time, and those folks don't usually stock extra parts. ;)  The problem at the box stores is probably that they only carry 8" or 10" chimneys and Mike has a 6" outlet.

Here's an idea for ya, Mike.  Place the stove in front of a window, then open the window and insert a piece of sheet metal with a hole in it.  Run the pipe through it and up to 3' above the roof peak.  In about 6 weeks, you can take the whole thing out and store it until next Winter.
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

SwampDonkey

I've seen what Dan is suggesting, but don't recommend it.


WH, I have a proper flu, the stove is a little old fashioned, but I'm warm. :D Hey the stove came from Georgia, who could complain.  ;D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

DanG

The main reason I suggested that is for expedience.  Mike works full time and is very active in Church, so his time at the shop is very limited.  By the time he scrounges up all the parts to build a "proper" flue, and gets it put together, he'll be looking for a place to put the air conditioner.  I should point out that the shop is not located at his home, so shouldn't be affecting his h/o insurance, and he will be there and wide awake at any time the stove is burning.  Another point is that Mike maintains his stuff.  He won't be letting creosote build up in that pipe, and the real reason for all that clearance if for chimney fires.  That 30x30 piece of sheet metal with a 6" hole in the middle gives him about 12" clearance to a metal window frame, and with a normal fire in the stove, it will hardly even be warm to the touch.

Another point is, I don't think he is going to be happy with his flue going out through the wall.  It is going to be hard to keep a 6" uninsulated pipe warm enough to make the heater draw the smoke out if it is outside, so he'll probably want his permanent installation to go through the roof, or high up in the gable.  I didn't want to recommend an expensive solution that would only be temporary.
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

Brian_Rhoad

I bought a roof chimney kit from Tractor Supply. It is a stainless steel double walled pipe with insulation and an air gap between the pipes.

tim1234

A few things to keep in mind:

:) Clearances for single wall black pipe.  I think it is 12" or more.
:) Clearances for double wall black pipe.  I think you can go down to 8" (check the manufacture specs).
:) Any bend in your chimney creates resistance which hurts your draft
:) You want your flue to stay as warm as possible to prevent creosote buildup.  When the inside surface of your chimney drops below 250° F the creosote can condense.  If you take your chimeny to the higest point possible while still in the shop, then your chimney will stay warmer giving you better draft and lower creosote build up.
:) When your black pipe passes through any partition, wall, ceiling or roof, you need to trasition to double insulated Class A chimney pipe with the proper transition collar.

If you can run you chimney straight up through your roof near the tallest part of the peak you will be able to use the most amout of black pipe (way cheaper) and then use the proper transition collar for a slopped roof and then transiton to Class A pipe outside (expensive).  Remember the top of the chimney needs to be 3' higher than anything within 10' (horizontal) of the top.

I've seen people use a sheet metal plate in a removed window to take thier pipe outside but it is no where near code and like said before your insurance company would most likely not appreciate it if anything happened - nor would you ;)

Check out www.woodheat.org for some good info to.

Tim
You buy a cheap tool twice...and then you're still stuck with a cheap tool!!
Husky 372XP, 455 Rancher, Echo CS300, Alaskan 30" Chainsaw Mill

rebocardo

brdmkr,

Let me preface this by saying I am by no means a stove expert, just that I installed my own and it has been working fine and I heat my whole house (its 19 F outside and 70 in my bedroom) with one wood stove.

fwiw: It is the wrong time to buy stove parts as most places will be out of stock for the season.

You can buy the thimble inside GA, but, you need the triple wall SS pipe to use it because the triple wall has the outside venting built in.

In the Atlanta area there are several fireplace sellers that normally stock all you need, at much higher then mail order prices. Since you said South, I assume you are too far away to make the trip worthwhile.

Some helpful info:

http://www.cdc.gov/nasd/docs/d001001-d001100/d001052/d001052.html

This is the thimble I installed (didn't order it from these people)

http://www.northlineexpress.com/itemdesc.asp?ic=5CO%2D69631&eq=

Click on the links in the photo to get the connector you need for your black pipe.

rebocardo

If you need the 9" stainless steel that goes inside the thimble, I have one, I needed a 12" because of my brick wall.

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