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Author Topic: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?  (Read 29023 times)

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Offline Firebass

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #20 on: November 30, 2007, 07:37:49 pm »
Oh Man 8) 8) 8)

30" Swinger.... You got to do it.  If you don't I will ;D

firebass

Offline Dan_Shade

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #21 on: November 30, 2007, 07:53:18 pm »
as my uncle used to say when we'd get stupid on the dirt bikes:

"you boys, wear your helmets"  :)

Woodmizer LT40HDG25 / Stihl 066 alaskan
lots of dull bands and chains

There's a fine line between turning firewood into beautiful things and beautiful things into firewood.

Offline StorminN

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #22 on: November 30, 2007, 09:11:01 pm »
I was going to suggest the 30" MD blade, but I thought that might be a little too much...  :D :D Silly... what was I thinking??

But say you build a 30" swinger... what would be the advantage of this over a stock MD mill? I guess instead of your max size being 8"x12" you could cut 12"x12" or 12"x24" with a double cut? How does the double cut work on your mill?

-Norm.
Happiness... is a sharp saw.

Offline brdmkr

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #23 on: November 30, 2007, 09:26:50 pm »
30" swinger.... hmmm, wouldn't you need a pretty wide carriage?  Of course, you would be able to handle a ..... fairly large log ;D
Lucas 618  Mahindra 4110, FEL and pallet forks, some cant hooks, and a dose of want-to

Offline Firebass

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #24 on: November 30, 2007, 10:21:46 pm »
This would be a excelent episode of Junk yard wars ;D

Offline metalspinner

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #25 on: November 30, 2007, 10:28:23 pm »
It's not a matter of if you should, rather a matter if you could.

 smiley_headscratch Or is it...

It's not a matter of if you could, rather a matter if you should.

I do what the little voices in my wife's head tell me to do.

Offline brdmkr

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #26 on: November 30, 2007, 10:33:53 pm »
Oh, somebody just do it... and post lots of pictures ;)
Lucas 618  Mahindra 4110, FEL and pallet forks, some cant hooks, and a dose of want-to

Offline Captain

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #27 on: November 30, 2007, 10:47:48 pm »
I think somebody should do a study of the effects of gyroscopic force on that blade before standing next to it ....with all of its inserted teeth....in the midst of swinging the blade.  OK, I'm game  :)

Captain

Offline Furby

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #28 on: November 30, 2007, 10:49:31 pm »
I think the blade will be too big for most gearboxes that you'd like to use.
It's gonna take a lot of ponies to run something like that.
That leaves 3 phase as your only easy option.

Offline solodan

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #29 on: November 30, 2007, 10:50:14 pm »
How big of a log can you guys handle on your mills? I know My Lucas can handle about a 60" log before I would have to block it up. I have sawed a 62" sugar pine once and had to remove the handle to roll under the top bar. :) I think the Brand X will only cut a 36" log, and the Petersons come in a wide or narrow frame. Firebass, what will yours do, and how wide is the carriage? Dangerous what about yours?  Inquiring minds want to know. :)

Offline hansbaba

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #30 on: November 30, 2007, 11:06:46 pm »
If the blade zings or rings when exiting the log, does this imply a problem. Mine does sometimes but I cant corelate the sound with bad cuts. Sometimes it zings and the cuts are still accurate and sometimes it zings and I find the blade has dipped down 3/16 or an 1/8.????

Offline Firebass

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #31 on: November 30, 2007, 11:33:59 pm »
I think somebody should do a study of the effects of gyroscopic force on that blade before standing next to it ....with all of its inserted teeth....in the midst of swinging the blade.  OK, I'm game  :)

Captain

That sounds kind of fun.  Gyroscopic force testing. Bet it don't pay real well though..  Maybe take a old trashed MD blade in a un-supported  swing frame powered by a old yugo motor then feed it (remotely) into a log till it till it grabs and forces the swing frame to do the HURKY JURKY. :o   I Wonder if the blade would bend, break or just simply stall.  As for the gryroscopic force to rotate the carraige manually I don't think it'd be that bad.  If it was too much you could always go hydraulic. or mechanical.  my carraige is fairly heavey and I use a counter weight to equilize the Swing Frame.    I once acctidently gave my mill full throatle with out the swing frame latched.  Surprisingly it was no big deal, I just felt a little pull on the handle but nothing drastic. Maybe bigger would only add more mass making it even more stable.  But the torque that  50 or 100 HP could produce may be differant ball of wax.  For me testing would most likely be on a near complete prototype.

Now I know all of you have more sence than attemping any of the above but I am going to add this little note:

WARNING: Do not attemp any of the suggestions or test above.   Serious bodily injury or death may result. ;) ;D

Firebass


Offline Captain

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #32 on: December 01, 2007, 06:50:42 am »
Hans, the most common cause of your intermittent scenario on us folks with portable tracks is track sag and parallelism...that is if the event happens on a horizontal cut.  A constant ring when exiting implies a problem.

Captain

Offline Nate Surveyor

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #33 on: December 01, 2007, 11:17:17 am »
You should be able to stop pushing the mill through the log, and go back and forth at ANY time, and the marks left on the lumber from doing this should NOT be deeper than the corners of the teeth. IF they are deeper, mis-alignment, track sag, or something is wrong. Occasionally stressed trees do it though. You cannot do anything about stressed trees. Are these Butt cuts? Butt cuts seem to have more stress.

Cap'n seems to have a good handle on this, (proberly alot better than me), and we are saying alot the same things, with different words.

I'm good at making simple problems complex!


N
I know less than I used to.

Offline Ironwood

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #34 on: December 01, 2007, 07:51:59 pm »
Dan,

 Why stop at 30". I have 5 PERFECTLY good 54" Frick blades at the shop, if you build it I will give you some..................... ;D, Powered by a Unimog motor........

                   Ironwood
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Offline brdmkr

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #35 on: December 01, 2007, 08:14:55 pm »
I think the blade will be too big for most gearboxes that you'd like to use.
It's gonna take a lot of ponies to run something like that.
That leaves 3 phase as your only easy option.


What about using a gearbox for a bushhog?  Those are rated at 100+ HP.  Don't know if the gearing would be right though.
Lucas 618  Mahindra 4110, FEL and pallet forks, some cant hooks, and a dose of want-to

Offline woodbowl

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #36 on: December 01, 2007, 10:39:34 pm »
The beauty of a swinger is to see a light saw head bounce it's way down the log on a swaying aluminum frame producing accurate lumber. To me this suggest the dynamic forces envolved, that overcome traditional sawing standards. There's got to be a trade off to get the desired effect, and higher RPM seems to be the reason. I am tempted to apply more power and bigger blades as well, but that calls for more hold down power, HD frame ect. Eventually it will evolve into a big hunk of machinery on the scale of a large circle mill with the ability to swing. It would be awsome, I would love to see it happen.

The question is, what is the best blade for swingmilling. There are proven, working mills with a blade RPM ranging from 1900 to 3000. This is a known working range. The direction of efficiency is to increase torque and lower RPM to find a happy medium before discovering the law of dimenishing returns. Then again there are some points to consider in the higher RPM's.
Full time custom sawing at the customers site since 1995.  WoodMizer LT40 Super Hyd.

Offline Part_Timer

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #37 on: December 01, 2007, 11:21:46 pm »
The best blade would be one that didn't find a piece of fence wire just after sharpening it. ;)
Peterson 8" ATS.
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Offline Firebass

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #38 on: December 01, 2007, 11:53:57 pm »
Has anyone ever had insert teeth come out on a MD mill :-\ 


Dan, 

Have you tried making some larger carbides?  If you not worried about kerf maybe you could cement some 5/16 carbides on your existing blade.


Firebass

Offline hansbaba

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Re: What's the best blade for for swingmilling?
« Reply #39 on: December 02, 2007, 12:02:20 am »
With response to woodbowl.

If increased torque is what were after with a swing mill and not hp. Why hasnt anyone mentioned using a diesel. I would love to smell biodiesel all day instead of regular old stinky gas!! I know it is a bit of added weight, but how about a new vegie oil mill!!!!

hans.