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Woodworking club/ Memberships

Started by RK Ron, August 22, 2007, 09:39:17 PM

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RK Ron

Hi Fellas,
My bride called out and asked me what I was doing.  I was in my office chair, feet elevated and on the paperwork atop the desk. "I'm busy" (she's heard that before)  Well, I was- sort of.  I was thinkin' of having a woodworkers club- A group of people who ante up a fee/membership and come in, buy my lumber, wear a ballcap w/my logo on it, and  build something their spouse wanted in my shop.  I'm not sure but I think what happened next came as a result of me leaning too far back, my head below heart level and my feet above it, for next I saw something called "profit" and it was cozied up to "less effort".  They had this aura, or glow about them.  Then came some who shelled out the big bucks, and rarely used the place. Others, the disciplined, finished their projects, posted photos on the "board of success" bulletin board and circled me dancing w/praises and song.( I like those people)  One fella was slinking about in the shadows, looking for opportunity to take advantage of me- a contractor.  Outside through the window I saw commotion. There was a crowd of people all laughing and pointing to someone in a suit who seemed to be in a terrible twit- or experiencing one heck of a wedgie.  Ah, my insurance agent- I know him...
So many people approaching me, signing on the dotted line. I wasn't me anymore, nope- I morphed into a teacher, mentor, rescuer, yes- a savior.
When I came to I did what Thomas Edison was said to have done when he experienced similar revelation- wrote it down.
Here's the question,  Anyone have one of these where you are?
Why are my feet so numb?
RKRON

logwalker

I think it would take a very SKP* to put up with the levels of frustration that would result. And the insurance would be difficult. But there are people doing it and it could be interesting.

*Special Kind of Person
Let's all be careful out there tomorrow. Lt40hd, 22' Kenworth Flatbed rollback dump, MM45B Mitsubishi trackhoe, Clark5000lb Forklift, Kubota L2850 tractor

crtreedude

No knowledge for you but just wanted to say I appreciated your writing style. I think you might make more money writing about the experience than doing it...  :D
So, how did I end up here anyway?

Tom

That was an interesting picture you drew.  :D

The subject has come up before.  I don't think we have pursued it too far here, but, Wood Magazines General discussion group has gone into it in great detail in the past.   The problem with researching it is that, unlike us, they deleted their old posts.  If they have Archives, I fear that they would be on the order of "how to make a box" rather than "how to start a business.

Every time this subject has been broached, I have had it described as a high-school shop class for adults and the general consensus has been that the liability is too great for most individuals.  You have to understand that there are 100 people that will tell you "no" for every 1 that that say "yes" or "maybe".

There are people doing this and making money.  Usually they are artists in their own right that are teaching the craft.  Getoverit, a member from Florida, just came back from a luthier's school where he learned to make a guitar.  He is now trying to develop his own business in that trade.  My brother, Charlie, went to a class on carving spoons last winter.  He did it just for fun, but it fits right in with his trade which is turning on a lathe.

I'm sure that a situation as you describe could make it, especially in an urban environment.  There are many young people and apartment dwellers without the room to have a shop who may "rent" time in yours.  Being close to Navy bases, I know that the sailors like woodworking too.  They have shops on base that cost them practically nothing, but they get caught up in scheduling problems with equipment and may look outwards toward a personal membership in a club as you describe.

Good luck, but don't take the liability issues lightly.  Woodworking equipment is inherently dangerous and someone who suffers and accident in your shop could take all that you own or would have any hope of owning.

Furby

Tom, I thought you taught Charlie how to carve a spoon some years back ???
What's he going to school for ???

Fla._Deadheader


  Maybe Charlie could post a little info about what he learnt ???
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

low_48

Woodcraft Corp. bought a business that had several Woodworking Club locations. It worked on the premise of something like a health club, but all woodworking. From what I heard about it, the reality doesn't match the plan. Some of the downfalls; all the members want to schedule the same work times, after work and Saturday mornings. Keeping member numbers up and signing members up for a second year was very tough. Several of the machines had waiting lines behind them all the time (table saw and thickness planer). Members would want to bring in their own wood, read that as NAILS!

I bet insurance is the really big hurdle. Only get the Saw-Stop table saws!!!!!!!

RK Ron

Thankyou fellas,
Riving knives, sawguards, push sticks and a check out instructional  initialed by the member for table saw use. A magazine writer was using a Saw Stop and had it's "brakes" go off during a normal dado run.  Not pleasent.  I don't know if the insurance cost overall would offset the price of Saw Stop.  But it COULD be a marketing ploy...
LORD have mercy on me, on that day when I reach those pearly gates my answer to St. Pete's question as to why he should let me in would be, " I operated a business that caused my fellow man to wait in long lines---"
Very small numbers of people in shop at one time, a different approach than a "fast food" type business plan. Would rather have them on a waiting list TO get in than waiting after they got in. 
Whatever the ultimate cost will be for coverage and protection will be included in the "membership" price.
Elements of danger are forever present in woodworking. Insurance reps got big cars and homes gambling on peoples "what if " fears.  High density housing is a common term and it's all around me.  Retirerees can only play so much golf.  So many people lookin' for something to do.  And people are dropping Big bucks on fitness memberships and time shares they rarely use. 
Just "nosing" around here, fishing if you will...
RKRON

woodhick

I have often thought of the same venture but insurance questions always shied me away from doing it.  I am a member of a local woodworking club that runs about 50 members.  We have very little shop equipemnt and it is used for demonstrations only.  Members don't use club tools to build there own stuff.   All members have their own shops.   A local crafstman strated doing classes such as you ask about recently and some of his students come to our meetings.  When he started he was tied to a state college, so they were probably covering the insurance.  He has since dropped working with the college and doing it on his own.  Not sure how he handles liability.  I will try to contact him and find out, since I'm also interested.   He's about 50 miles from me and we would not be competeing against each other.   
Woodmizer LT40 Super 42hp Kubota, and more heavy iron woodworking equipment than I have room for.

Cedarman

If insurance is a problem, are sky divers insured?  Just how much is the insurance per person to use these facilities?  Most people do have an aversion to hurting themselves. People over 30 that is.  Training classes mandatory. Think of the ways to make it work.  And it will work.
I am in the pink when sawing cedar.

TexasTimbers

I see ads in the back of mags all the time trying to rent their shop space. The concept is not new maybe just figure the best way to do it.

Call it an association on the bonus plan (can use the tools for free as a member of the paid association haha). Must provide proof of own insurance or agree to pay you for it and also sign a waiver of liability.
The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

metalspinner

It's not just the insurance.  It's people screwing up the equipment and leaving the shop in disarray.  What if a guy runs a piece of barn siding through the planer with dirt and grit imbedded in it? Who's responsible for that?  Is there an intermediary board for disagreements between members?  I think these type of things will take a club down before anything else.

I do what the little voices in my wife's head tell me to do.

beenthere

Maybe need someone to run it like Jeff runs da forum....it's work, but it works.

When the guy that runs the board through the planer with paint on it, or debris, he learns right quick what it is like to replace the knives - ( true, a pain for the one in line to use it next ).  Seems it would have a lot of newbies using the equipment, so a learning game for all (or most).  ;D

Maybe some of the early basic training would be how to use, maintain, and adjust each piece of equipment. Planer, jointer, table saw, etc. , and run them safely. Shop teachers must have that routine every year in shop class.  ::) ::)
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

crtreedude

We are starting up wood shop down here - pretty full shop. I am thinking what we will do with newbies is that they start by maintaining equipment - then they graduate to sanding for example (or something simple even I could do.  ::) ) - and then gradually move up. But they start with care of machinery.

So, how did I end up here anyway?

TexasTimbers

Fred start them out by having them maintain a fresh and full pot of coffe at all times, then onto the less important machinery like planers and saws etc. :D
The oil is all in Texas, but the dipsticks are in D.C.

Kelvin

Howdy,
I've thought of this when i see all my expensive machinery that will never wear out in my lifetime sitting around most of the time doing nothing.  What i come up with is renting a large ex-factory/wearhouse setting where everyone can set up there own shops.  A co-op, i've seen this in magazines before and near where i live, Lansing MICH, GM and everything with them is leaving, or has left town, leaving lots of unrented commercial buildings cheap.  They have 3 phase and would make running old big machines cheap.  Here is the catch!  All members have their own little space, with their own little machines (maybe very bigspace comparatively actually, like 30x60), but all under one roof.  You work there with your lumber storage and sales and they pick through and buy from you, while being a memeber of a non-profit co-op that you run.  You also buy old huge, cheap iron to run in a central place, couple of big planers you bought for $600 (see them a lot) couple of 36" bandsaws for $350,  16" jointers and so on.  This is monitered by co-opers and shouldn't get messy as they take everything back to their bothes, where each person has a contractor (saw-stop mandatory) lunch box planers, small jointer.  THis stuff is cheap, and combined with the big industrial stuff you have a perfect situation. They wreck their stuff and trash their bothe, no problem.  Supervisor sells lumber, watches big machines, maybe central dust collector, big one to all bothes, dumpster, bathroom, coffee sales.... see.  Cheap insurance, cheap rent.  Not your stuff, keep headaches away from your home.  Bring in local talent for specialty classes.  What do you think?
KP

low_48

Here's a great link to a business in San Francisco. They have laser engravers, cnc routers, cnc mills, computers, etc............. It's more prototyping work/metal work, but it has a great plan for you to look at. They get the monthly fee plus charge for a mandatory instruction class for the complication machinery.

http://techshop.ws/

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