I can't decide, Wood-Mizer LT-40 or TimberKing 1600

[GoGo]

I'm going to get a new mill, the Wood-Mizer has a few more hydraulic features and is bit more expencive, both have have hydraulic log lifter and turner. The TimberKing has a 20 HP motor and the Wood-Mizer a 28 HP   Any thoughts.

[flip]

Run one of each before you buy.  My .02

[DanG]

Hi GoGo, and welcome to the Forum.

You didn't say if you're an experienced sawyer, or if this will be your first mill.  If you're already active and just upgrading, you probably have a pretty good idea what your needs are.  It then becomes a matter of observing the mills in action, and hopefully doing a bit of sawing with them yourself.  That should tell the tale.

If you're a new sawyer, you have to rely on input from the guys who know, and you've sure come to the right place for that. ;)

[GoGo]

Hi Dan
    I've never owned a mill, but have worked (volunteered) with a similar Wood-Mizer. Basically new to sawing.

[jpgreen]

Oh that's an easy descicione..  :D

[DanG]

I'll have to speak(type) in generalities, since I'm not a bandmill sort of person.  Things you must look at when selecting a mill revolve mostly around how you will be using it.  For instance, if you're doing portable custom milling, set-up time(and effort) is a real important factor, but it has little importance if you're stationary.  If you expect to saw alone, then look for features that make that easier.  If you expect to have help most of the time, you'll may want to emphasize faster hydraulics and more power, even if you have to buy a used machine to get it.  Those are less important for a solo sawyer because he spends most of his time doing things other than sawing.  The speed of the mill has less impact on his productivity, but automated features such as a board drag-back have more impact.

Another consideration that most new sawyers overlook is ergonomics.  That is where it really pays off to get your hands on the mill yourself before you make up your mind.  For instance, I wouldn't want a LT-40 in a full-time operation unless it had the Auto-clutch feature.  I'd have to factor the cost of that upgrade into the purchase price if I was shopping.  Other mills have similar fallacies that might be a problem for one guy and not for another.  Some mills have features that make sawing a possibility for people who couldn't even dream of sawing on most mills.  Sometimes, it isn't so much the feature as it is the layout of the controls.  Since Tom is out of town, I'll talk about him a little bit. ;D  He has some mobility problems, mainly in his shoulders, that make it hard to reach up over his head.  That would make sawing nearly impossible on most mills, but the controls on his big Baker are all on a panel at waist height.  The hardest thing for him to do is reaching the key to start it up.  After that, he can run an army of off-bearers right into the dirt.  For another example, I love my old MD saw, but if I was 5'6" instead of 6 feet tall, I'd spend a lot of time on a stepladder.  The controls go up with the head on this one, and I can barely reach the key when it's all the way up.

These are just a few rambling thoughts I have gathered while playing with a number of different mills and watching a lot of others at work.  I hope it helps you make a wise decision.  Keep us informed. ;)

[Bibbyman]

I always advise calling the companies (in this case Wood-Mizer and TimberKing) and asking for names and contact information of owners in your area willing to demo their mills.  Preferably, they will select owners of similar model mills you are interested in or are doing the same things you are interested in doing with the mill once you get it.

I did this when I was comparing mills.  I went and visited a couple of owners and called a couple of others.  This experience decided it for me.

[saw4you]

That is a no brainer, you never go wrong with a Wood-Mizer. Great mills ,I have one and just about to have another one, the 40 Super.

[Dave Shepard]

I love the Mizers too, but I think GoGo needs to make a comparison to see which one fits the bill the best.

Welcome to the forum, GoGo!


Dave

[musikwerke]

If you keep it and run it long enough to need parts, you'll be glad you went with Wood-Mizer.  Not that the other manufacturers don't have parts for their mills but the people at the Wood-Mizer home office are the best.  I've never been so impressed or pleased with any other company.

[saw4you]

I have to agree with the last guy, the people at Wood-mizer are all about making you happy with your mill, new or old

[Brad_S.]

There is a timber show in Booneville, NY in less than 2 weeks. In the past, both manufacturers you mention have been there as well as many others. I know a few Vermonters have made the drive in the past so it can't be too bad and might help you finalize your decision.
https://forestryforum.com/board/index.php?topic=26540.0

[Firebass]

Don't be afraid of swing mills ;D

Firebass

[Kcwoodbutcher]

The TK 1600 comes with a 25 HP Kohler, the older ones had the 20 HP. They're built like a tank. Parts are never an issue and customer service is great ( of course I live in KC and can just drive up and get them). I have a 1600 which I abuse regularly and it takes it in stride. Are you looking for new or used?

[fishman]

i absolutley love my TK, am upgrading to a B20 this fall, the few things i have needed have been recieved in 2 days (including one saturday delivery) they are very easy and pleasent to deal with, call matt and ask to see one of their mills close to you

[MartyParsons]

Hello GoGo,
We sell Wood-Mizer's and Wood-Mizer has many things to offer you. Blades, Service, ReSharp, Cantilevered Head, 30 Day Money Back, 5 year warranty on frame, 2 year warranty on everything else. We do many shows and that is the best place to see the mill in operation. We have found that the Wood-Mizer mills sells themselves. You are a little out of my sales area but you are welcome to give me a call and I would be glade to answer your questions. We can find a Wood-Mizer close to you and go talk to the owner. You can go to a show and talk to Wood-Mizer owners their also. The LT40HDG28 is the most popular mill we have, I would check out these options. HSS (Hydraulic Side Support) or the Bibbyman Kit  ;) , Debarker.
The Lube Mizer option is also another nice option if you are sawing species with sap that would deposit on the band blade, like Ash, White Pine etc. The Auto Clutch is also nice but with the 28 hp engine you should have no issue, If you are looking at the 34 hp Diesel then we recommend the Auto Clutch.

You should ask many questions to all of the manufactures listed that support the Forestry Forum.

Thanks
Marty

[ADAMINMO]

I say you try to go to the Boonville,NY show and give all the sawmill manufacturers a go.There will be many there to look at.There is good and bad in all machines.To me they are customer preference.It really depends on your application for the mill.Hope to see you at the show.

[Warren]

GoGo, Welcome to the forum.  This is the basic Chevy, Ford or Dodge question...  

I am running my second Woodmizer mill (LT40 SHD) and have been pleased with both.  Five other band mills within 40 minutes of me. Two WM's, two TK's and one Baker.  Everybody is happy with their brand of mill and the service they receive.  As DanG and some others have pointed out, try to go see the mills in action, at a show, at somebody's shop, where ever.  Then decide which one has the options and layout that best suits you and your situation.  

IMHO, all of the brands can turn out good lumber and good production numbers when well maintained and run by an experienced sawyer.   Personally, I started off with a small manual mill (WM LT15) to minimize initial outlay and minimize the cost of "mistakes" during the learning curve.  When I decided to go full time, I sold the LT15 and upgraded to the LT40.

Just my $0.02...

Warren

[Todd]

Hey GoGo...welcome to the Forum!

You're in the same position that I was 2 years ago...hard to decide on paper!
I'd recommend that you see them in person and talk to the guys from the factory at a show...even have them show you how to run it.  After I looked at about 8 different mills, I decided on the Baker based on price and features.  The 3667D that I've got has been great, and parts and service help is always first rate.  I really like the sturdiness of the machine, and it's handled everything I've thrown at it (with the exception of a concrete patch and a 5/8" bolt in a Maple log)with ease. 

Plus...Blue is wayyyyyy prettier than orange ;D)
(here comes the fight!)
Todd

[Dave Shepard]

IS NOT, IS NOT! Just kidding. :D


Dave

[jpgreen]

Tell you one thing that really turned me off about TK was the salesman's need to tell me how woodmizer's saw inaccurate lumber due to the wobble in the cantilever head.  They were dead wrong on that one, and quite envious of WM's sales I think..  ;D

The monorail frame has a distinct advantage over a rectangle in rigidity from end to end and side to side. It's basically a superior design IMO and there's no small reason they are the number one selling saw mill.

Look at the hardcore sawyers here on the forum (myself excluded)... they run orange..  8)

[Dave Shepard]

I am going to play devils advocate here. Can you go wrong with a Woodmizer? I doubt it. I run two of them and they are great mills. However, that doesn't mean the other mills out there are to be ignored. I would think that anybody wanting a mill would go out there and try to see as many different mills as possible. If possible, you should try to have an idea of what kind of sawing you are going to do, as the type of sawing will make a big difference in the type of mill you will need. I often think that the most people jump over the decision of what type of mill to get and go straight to what brand should they buy. As you have run a Woodmizer, I am guessing that you know that you want a bandmill, so you have made that decision. As for the cantileaver head? No worries there. If I can see any gaps under a six foot level on top of the cant, I know my band is dull. I find it hard to find any measurable deviation with a sharp band.

So, go out and have fun shopping, and maybe we can add a member to the Orange Team. If not, then we get another member for the Blue Team, or Red Team or.....


Dave

[MikeH]

 Get the woodmizer with a seat and you will be riding in luxury. Unless you will need to make extra money with the saw to pay the difference in price. Money can be a tricky thing to get when you start out. Some people like to walk with saw but I walk all day at my regular job and like to sit on my saw. ;D

[Dan_Shade]

how difficult is it to reach the handles for the hydraulics in the seat?

[Bibbyman]

It's not difficult at all since you have to run the head down to the contact strip area before you can use the hydraulics anyway.

[DanG]

So, JP, an overly enthusiastic salesman caused you to make an emotional decision on a major investment?  One of Woodmizer's major selling points is the cantilevered head.  One of TK's major selling points is that it does not have a cantilevered head.  Each of these mills can stand on it's own merits, and not have to worry about the other.  They both work very well and cut excellent lumber.  Either of them may have a distinct advantage over the other for GoGo's intended operation.  If he get's around a bit and see's a lot of mills, it may be that some other maker's product will fill the bill for him.  It may even be one that is not a Forum sponsor(Heaven forbid).

Bottom line, let's try to help GoGo make a well thought-out decision, and give him the best chance of becoming a successful sawyer.  Choosing the right mill is the first step toward that goal.

[GF]

Since all the manufactures of mills you are looking at are sponsors of this forum I think you cannot go wrong with any of them.

[jpgreen]

So, JP, an overly enthusiastic salesman caused you to make an emotional decision on a major investment?

Heavens no... TK tried to get me to make an emotional decision.. :D I was going to buy a swinger..   : :D But after buying a Woodmizer based on a solid business decision, I found they were wrong that's all, plus that claim was in their promotional material at the time and their CD even.

Hey I think gogo should look at everything as I did. But it doesn't hurt to give my opinion on WM, as anyone else would be passionate and happy with their make is entitled to do.  I can't make up gogo's mind and neither can some salesman, but I think he would probably like to hear all sides...  8) 

[Dave Shepard]

The real question is where is GoGo going to find a Certified-Pre-Owned Gen-u-wine Hootiemobile to load logs onto the mill? :D


Dave

[pineywoods]

For fixed instalations, there's not much difference between the two, but if you're talking portable, the mizer is much easier and quicker to setup. Unhitch the tow truck, drop the jacks andstart sawing. don't overlook resale value. the mizer is hard to beat there. MY first mill is a wm manual lt40 and I'm sold on the cantilever head. Will it saw wavy, thick-thin lumber? yes, but when it does it's always the loose nut on the controls
Drop a big heavy log on most of the 4-poster mills and see what it does to alignment. I've severly abused my mizer but the alignment stays put. Sometimes I wish for a little larger capacity, but in truth, anything an lt40 can't handle really needs a swinger.

[MikeH]

 and make sure you have a CHEVY to tow it!!!!!!!!!!! 8)

[Bibbyman]

and make sure you have a CHEVY to tow it!!!!!!!!!!! 8)

Now see here.  What's wrong with pulling it with a Dodge?  ;D

[TexasTimbers]

GoGo. Fairness to other companies and superficial "unbiasness" be dammed. When it comes to buying something so expensive you want the best machine made by the best company with best customer support. Woodmizer is not perfect but they are, hands down, far and away, the best sawmill on the market IMNSHO.

Woodmizer also does not rely on bashing the other companies to get business. This was the biggest turn off to me to see this in print, and hear it on the phone, that I have ever experienced when weighing what company to go with. It is outright slander because the comapnies engaged in slamming the cantilever head design KNOW FULL WELL that it is actually a superior design and not inferior. So what does that say about the integrity of a company that would knowingly misrepresent the truth?

Why should you get the Woodmizer?

• Superior engineering
• Superior customer support
• Knowledgable technicians
• Long term company stability
• More models to choose from
• Greater number of attachments/options available
• Upgrades/improvements available after your purchase
• Cantilever design is superior to 4 post design - did I mention that?
• It is Orange
• Resale value!

If you are going to consider another mill instead of Woodmizer for whatever reason, or because you want a four post design I would look to Baker and not because they are nice guys alone, or because they upgraded someones mill for a real good deal. But because they are not going to let you down either in quality or service, nor rely on bashing other companies to try and scare you into buying their equipment.
Now having said all that, if you are going to buy on short term price alone, which you should not, look at Cooks.
Just my, um, humble (nose getting long) : - opinion.

[LeeB]

and make sure you have a CHEVY to tow it!!!!!!!!!!! 8)

Towing with the chevy is fine as long as you know someone with a Dodge to tow the chevy. ;D ;D :D :D

[fishman]

 ;D and someone with a ford toget the other 2 home :D :D :D

[JD350Cmark]

GoGo,

All good info here so far so I see no need to repeat it.  I'll just say that I was sorta in the same boat as you and I went with WM.  I ran one LT40 for a few hours and did hours and hours of research - alot of it on here.  I've had a few problems along the way and the support from WM was 100%.  I know someone about an hour away with a TK, not sure the model, it has hyd's though and I am glad I went with WM. 

[trapper]

I am sure TK is a good machine but like the others their advertising bashing other brands turned me off

[Bob_T]

I am sure TK is a good machine but like the others their advertising bashing other brands turned me off

Me too.  I know they follow this forum and there have been similar comments about their advertising in the past.  I don't know why they continue with it since it sure seems like it's losing sales for them rather than gaining.

Bob

[DanG]

They not only follow this Forum, they are a Sponsor.  I went and checked out their website because of some of the comments in this thread.  All I see is that they say their product is of high quality and that they believe their design is superior.  I don't see anything there that could be construed as "bashing."  I haven't looked at any of their other advertising tools, though, but the only bashing I've seen so far is right here on this thread.

[Dan_Shade]

Here's the problem:

http://www.timberking.com/faq.cfm#3

[flip]

I like my TK and will buy another in the future.  I think a lot of the debate is chosing a mill and learning it's quirks and how to make dust efficiently with it.  I have not run a Mizer personally but for the cash I had at the time TK was a better choice for me, I got lots of mill and hydraulics as well as portability and a stationary operators station.  Look at what a band mill is: an engine, blade and wheels, deck, stops and clamps.  The only real difference is what color it is and who the operator is.  As far as production you can bust  your n*ts on either and you'll end up with about the same at the end of the day.  Blades still have to be changed, fuel and lube. still has to be added.  Pick one, forget the bologna marketing each uses to show how superior their product is and buy as much mill as you can REASONABLY afford and start making dust (you're wasting time).  ;D

[jpgreen]

No bashing on this one.  Just facts.  They've got the evil cantilever head wobble in their promo CD, stating its problem with sawing accurate lumber.

Also- they told me I could spend up to nearly an hour re-aligning a Woodmizer LT40 after transport, as they go out of alignment easily..  :D

I don't like smoke blown my way. It really chaps my you-know-what when they went on with that scrappola.  I would not waste a syllable on this if it wasn't so false, and so blatently missleading.. :

[flip]

It's the same as adds for cars and trucks. Brand X has 5,000 lb towing capacity, our truck has 7,500.  This car has X# cubic feet of leg room our car has 5 cubic feet more.  The consumer is responsible for cutting through the crud and making an informed decision.  In small niche markets, like the mill market, everyone feels like they need that ONE thing to set their product above the the others.  I don't like how they focus on the head design myself but marketing plays a big part when a lot of sales are sometimes sight unseen.  I would hope most do their home work before throwing $25K at a mill and basing it solely on what they've seen in a brochure or web site.  Refer to my post above about what a mill is.  Names and designs are slightly different but they all do the same thing in the end. ;)

[Jeff]

DO any of a few of you long time members have a clue on why you are able to post on this forum?  Its the sponsors. It would help us tremendously if you considered those facts when you formulate your posts.  Do any of you have a clue that they are currently the soul support of this forum and of the family that runs it?

Advertising smazmetizing. You guys oughta be sticking to whats the real deal.  How much a mill costs, the support you got once you buy it, what it takes to up keep it, the features you get with it, and how satisfied you are with the choice you made based on your choice, not the things you ruled out. If you aint run or owned the one you are complaining about, then you dont know JACK.

If the advertising did not win you over for a product, that is not your problem as the buyer. People asking for opinions here are not looking for cheerleaders with pom poms and bull horns and colorful things to say about the other guys mill. They want to know about YOUR MILL and YOUR experiences. NOT your perceptions if you have nothing to base them on other then sales pitches and the liberties corporate america can, do and will take in advertising.

Please look to the left and make a little consideration on how those names do more then simply make and sell products. They are ALL doing a lot for you and me, Lets not take that for granted eh?

[fencerowphil (Phil L.)]

This thread was one that I saw early on and thought it didn't apply to me,
since I own a swingblade which was produced by one of our sponsors.

Got curious.  Decided to check it out.

Excellent thread.   If it revealed some shady slogans,  some "un-truths"
used by sales people, so be it.   Maybe those sales people need to realize
that they are on a dangerous course.  Of course, they just do what they are taught
by the trainers and sales managers.  (I was in sales thirty years ago, and
hey, I still remember the bull I was taught.   It took getting into service
work and restoration to really see how full-of-it the trainers were.)

Surely a wise sponsor could learn a think or two from this thread.  Hope so.
Much needed, it seems. 

Phil L.

[Haytrader]

I think some of you should heed the bosses words.

I do not own either manufacturers mentioned products but have videos and literature from both. I have talked by phone with the TK folks and I will say I never experienced any negative talk about the competitors. Maybe they have a bad apple as a sales person. Any company can have this. If they do, as some of you have mentioned, they need to replace that person and let the quality and price speak for themselves.

There are a lot of good mills out there. Some are not sponsors here but should be.
;) Let us members stick to helping each other and maintain a positive attitude. A mere mention of somthing you didn't like is enough. Bashing just doesn't sound right here.

I am getting off my box now.
Haytrader

[DanG]

Jeff said it better than I did.  The original poster, who has probably become disgusted with this commentary and gone somewhere else, was asking about the quality of the mills.  He didn't ask about the advertising campaigns of the various companies.  He didn't ask about the emotions of the various sawmill owners, either.  Let's get real here, people!  Brand loyalty is a fine thing, but ain't a cottonpickin' religion, for cryin' out loud!

[Greg Cook]

Cotton-pickin' religion, DanG? Is that The Church of the Holy Boll? Or the Faithful Fiber-Pullers? Do you have to give up something for Lint?

Jes' wunnerin'

Greg

[crtreedude]

I was recently on the phone with Baker and was very pleased with the call. My needs are a bit different, but perhaps not. I need something that is reliable and simple. After all, I have to read the manual and explain it to people in Spanish.  : The other thing that appealed is that they said their design has been the same for a while. That is great because I can't be working with  a prototype or first generation saw that still hasn't had it's bugs worked out. They also said that all their components are pretty standard - i.e. I can get replacements here without having to ship from them.

Woodmizer sounds like an excellent company and there is dealer in San Jose, the only problem is that I would pay a 30% hit more for it from that dealer than I could buy in the USA.

I have looked at pretty much every one of the sponsors and if I have any complaint - there are all too good. In other words, I would like to have one of each, but I don't think my budget could stand that... :D

[ladylake]

When I bought my TK B20 it cost over $5000 less than a Woodmizer with the same features. Stationary operator, chain turner (much faster than Woodmizers old style) hyd toe boards, log loader (I was not impressed with TK plan of loading them, picking up 100#'s and putting them on the machine. 2 hours of work later I made a little bracket so I could swing them up.) Computer setworks stanard, I would'nt be without it. ( I had troubles with them untill I figured out the cord reel TK puts on is junk, even brand new. I bought a industrial one off Ebay for $100, setworks have'nt goofed up for over 2 years now). As far as engineering I'd take TK's any day. It's a lot simpler, no electric over hydraulics, no rheostats or foward and reverse switches and most parts can be bought locally. What little service I've needed in 5500 hours (mostly the setworks untill the new cord reel) has been excellent. Setup takes me 15 minutes so you gain a little with Wm there. Far as head design it doesn't make much difference as we all know.    Steve

[jpgreen]

Jeff said it better than I did.  da original poster, who has probably become disgusted with dis commentary and gone somewhere else, was asking about da quality of da mills.  He didn't ask about da advertising campaigns of da various companies.  He didn't ask about da emotions of da various sawmill owners, either.  Let's get real here, people!  Brand loyalty is a fine ting, but ain't a cottonpickin' religion, for cryin' out loud!

What'd Jeff write?  I put him on da ignore list. 

Just kiddn'..  :D

-ya guys don't actually pay attention ta anything I post do ya?..  ??? ??? ??? ;D

[DanG]

-ya guys don't actually pay attention ta anything I post do ya?..  ??? ??? ??? ;D

No, of course we don't. :  But some pore slob who's just drifting by might not know any better. ;D

[Bob_T]

Please look ta da left and make a little consideration on how doze names do more then simply make and sell products. They are ALL doing a lot for ya and dis yooper, Lets not take dat for granted eh?

Jeff,

I agree that we should support forum sponsors and when all else is equal, buy from them.  However, I don't think that paying for forum sponsorship should be considered an insurance policy against valid criticism.  It isn't bashing if it's true and stated without hyperbole and I haven't seen anything posted here that isn't true. 

[Todd]

I don't think there's been any bashing either, and any company would love to have the devotion members seem to have for their equipment. I know that all the other companies compare off of WM, and they do that becuase WM has more mills out there.  They sell more, so they can advertise more, so they can sell more.  Being #1 in sales means everyone is going to go after you, and I'm sure they'd rather have that happen than be #2. As long as there's no blatant trashing or unfounded criticism of a maker, I think it's something thats healthy and encourages discussion. 
Todd

[flip]

BUT!  Biting da hand dat feeds Jeff and us ultimately does no good.  Jeff is correct, lets give experienced comments about da mills us yoopers own and leave da opinions out of it.  What do ya like about YOUR mill what do ya not like about YOUR mill.  How is da support, ease of maintenance etc...  Let da scrappola fall between da bunks and under the deck.   ;)

[Bibbyman]

Ya'll know my blatant prejudice when it comes to brand of mills.  

But I don't know any TimberKing customers that were unhappy with their mills or support from TimberKing. 

The one TimberKing owner that I've had limited involvement with was a novice at sawing and over retirement age.  He was able to make good looking lumber to build a house.  He had some minor issues with his mill that an experienced sawyer would have overcome on their own but TimberKing help him resolve them.

I've visited with Will Johnson of TimberKing a couple of times and toured his facility in Kansas City.  We've bought a blower from him.

I try to look at things and put them in a positive manor whenever possible.  This is, I'd rather list what I like about one mill and not list what I don't like about another. (If you can't say something good, don't say anything at all.)

As far as some negative impressions of some sales technique,  my I suggest you send your comments to the poster in and instant message – if you feel they have some bearing on the topic.   

[DanG]

One of the things, perhaps the main thing, that sets the ForestryForum apart from other internet sites, is the fact that we don't flame or trash other people or companies, period.  If we criticize at all, it is normally done behind closed doors, either in the Full Members section, or through private messages, not here in the publicly accessable part of the forum.  When guests come in and see this sort of thing, they're likely to say, "Hmmph, that's the same bunch of jerks that inhabit all those other sites" and promptly leave.  It is the absence of this sort of thing that has brought us to the top of the heap, and I'll not stand idly by and let our reputation suffer without saying anything about it.

If anyone still insists on exercising some imagined "right" to criticize here, please send me a PM and I'll endeavor to explain my position in terms you will easily understand.

[crtreedude]

Um, DanG - I don't have to agree with eating grits do I?  I mean the rest makes really good sense, but a man can only go so far!  :

In all seriousness, what I have always enjoyed about FF is the fact that people are expected to be gentlemen (or women) and behave themselves. I think it fits since in so many forums, you have no idea who the people typing are - but here, we are people and most people know each other - and have even seen members before. In other words, this isn't fake.

What also isn't fake is that this very useful forum is supported by those people on the left. And having met Jeff before (and him grilling me about MY company) I rather doubt there is a one of them that you couldn't buy their product and be pleased about it.

[thurlow]

If you come to my house, I expect you to abide by a few rules............wipe your feet (most folks take their shoes off, but you don't have to, take your headgear off, don't spit on the stove (or floor), bow your head when we say 'grace', flush after using the toilet, if you don't like the food, just push it around on the plate without making as issue of it, put your cigarette out before you come in (THAT DOESN'T MEAN THROWING THE BUTT OUTSIDE THE DOOR), take your "chew" out and put it in your pocket, etc. 

Well, I'm a guest here...............it doesn't matter whether I agree with the rules or not;  if I don't like 'em, I can hit the road.  I've left better worse forums than this.  What's not to understand about Jeff's # 43 post above?

[LeeB]

I own both brands, a TK 1200 and a WM LT40 super. I cut a lot of boards with the TK. It had some problems over the years and I either figured out a fix or got help from the manufacturer. There was one fupa in the assembly of the idle side hsaft, but I figured it out and fixed it. I bought a used Wm and haven't cut a whole lot with it yet. Still working out the traps the previous owner left for me. It seems to be an excelent mill. The Wm has more engineering in it than the TK. The TK was pretty simple. The WM is way more expensive but then again it is moremill than I had before. I still have the TK and don't have any real plans to get rid of just yet.
As for the original question, the 1600 will be cheaper than the LT40 but I think you will be getting more mill with the LT40. It really boils down to what yopu want to do with it and how much you want to spend. I think either way you go you will be pleased with your choice. Get out and see both mills run then make your choice from there. You may have to travel a bit to see both of them but ion terms of what you will be spending on the purchace it will be worth the expence for the peace of mind that you got what you want. Both companies put out a good product and both have good service.

[JD350Cmark]

Perhaps this thread did get off base a bit. 

Regardless, I think competition is good as it provides a better product.  -Mark 

[treecyclers]

As a proud owner of a TK 1600, I have to say that I am very pleased with it.
I've run a few thousand feet of lumber through it, hit my share of foreign objects and accessories, and gone through a couple hundred blades in the process.
I checked out every manufacturer of sawmills I could find before I bought mine, even visited their facilities to inspect their production processes.
I settled on my TK for a few reasons.
1) I trust a 4 post head more than a cantilever style. Just my personal preference.
2) I got the full hydraulic package for loading and whatnot on my rig.
3) I like Kohler motors. I can beat on them and they run like a champ time after time.
4) I spoke with other owners, and got stronger opinions on the TK over any other mill.
That said, there's a few downsides to the 1600.
1) The log turner setup is garbage.
2) The measuring magnet tapey thingy leaves a lot to be desired. One of these days I'll get a computer setworks put on mine....
But, there's also more upside too-
1) I get about 1/8 variance in a 16' log with a fresh blade.
2) Blade changes are fast and easy
3) Oil Changes are simple with the spigot extension on it.
4) Maintenance is simple
5) It cost me about 20% less than a comparable orange mill, which buys a LOT of blades.
Superdave

[sgtmaconga]

I bought my TK 1220 in november of last year. since then i have run it silly. me and dad love it and when, not if i upgrade i will get another TK.

Richard
Macon, GA

[MikeH]

 I fogot to mention woodmizer sleek yet elegant compact design when set up for travel, don't let the compact size fool you. This is one mean cutting machine. 8)

[Tom]

There aren't any undercover anything here. All manufacturers share the limelight.  While there are some members who favor one machine over another, you will find that anywhere you go.

It's not the duty of a member to sell based on anything, still, I think it admirable that some manufacturers have such a loyal following.   Most of the acceptedd post are touting the positive aspects of a manufacturer.  We all know that you can't please everyone all of the time.  It's the flaming of companies that is discouraged on this forum.  We don't delve in the negative just for the sake of complaint. 

What's being American got to do with it?   

[DanG]

Firebass, I guess you just haven't been paying attention.  Most of our sponsors are represented openly on this forum.  Many of those representatives are the founders, owners, CEOs, Chairmen or Presidents of those companies.  Several of the sponsors have employees who  participate in the forum, as well.  As far as I know, those folks are here for the same reasons as the rest of us...they like it here.  They give freely of their expertise, and seem to be genuinely glad to be of some service to their fellow members.  I can't imagine why a sponsor would feel the need for a spy. ??? :

The controversial portion of this thread was precipitated because some folks chose to flame a company that was mentioned in a thread.  It happened that the company was one of our sponsors, but the bottom line is, we don't flame people or companies here on The ForestryForum, whether they are members or non-members, or sponsors or non-sponsors.  It just isn't the way we do business.

By the way, I'm an immigrant...17th generation.

[crtreedude]

Just my dos colones which is pretty worthless usually. Freedom of Speech is a wonderful thing and worth dying for. However, it doesn't cover saying whatever you want inside someone's home - which is what this is. The Forestry Forum is not a public institution, but a private one. Being such, Jeff gets to set the guidelines to what is and is not permitted here.  It is a hard thing to make a successful forum and keep it together. It only looks easy until you try to do it.

Part of being an American is respecting the private property of others - which this is.  Jeff and the administrators spend a lot of time keeping this on track. We need to respect them for that and be grateful. Given that just about any controversy you could name is splashed all over the Internet, there really is no need to put it here too.

[flip]

I'm hungry, what's for lunch?

Had late night Wendy's last night for dinner. Mmmmmmm. ;D

[flip]

No takers ??? 

Well I grabbed a quick bite off the "roach coach" "gut wagon" "meat wagon" and what ever else name it has called.

My lunch consisted of a McRib knock off, bag of Ruffles chips (plain) and a diet Coke.  Let me tell you, I am paying dearly about now :  I am bloated an gassy :(

Anyone else want to share their lunch menu?

[Haytrader]

Tuna salad sandwich w/lots of lettuce and ruffle chips.
Cold brew iced tea.
;D

[WH_Conley]

Just came in to a pot of Pinto beans. I think the third bowl is what done me in. Anybody wanna come and pull boards for me tonight? ;D

[crtreedude]

Okay, the thread is finished, as with most threads - it ended in food. At least we didn't talk about those funny ground corn that some people eat...  :

[tim1234]

Flip,

I'm glad you had that Diet Coke with that lunch :  :

It should make up for the rest :D

Tim

[MikeH]

 So how much do they pay you Bibbyman? smiley_blue_bounce

[Handy Andy]

  When you look at the features of the 1600, it is a pretty good buy.  I have a cook mill and like it fine, but looked at the TK's and boy that 1600 package is pretty sweet. Course I thought that log turner would be great. I would check to see if the 30 hp Kohler is available yet.

[logwalker]

How much do they charge for the TK 1600 hydraulic anyway. If I remember back when I was looking it was pretty attractively priced. Joe

[Warren]

WH,  That probably trumps my cheesy broccoli... :D

[Kcwoodbutcher]

A 1600 new with all the goodies will run 14 to 15K. Used they can be had for a few thousand to maybe 12K.

[ScottAR]

I had what the local Mexican eatin' place calls "Steak Mexicano."
T bone with fajita fixings on top.  Sweet Tea to drink...  Yum yum....
My one splurge of the week... 

[Brucer]

I went with Wood-Mizer for several reasons:

• The rigid frame makes it very fast to set up.
• The cantelever design lets me process large curved logs.
• The tapered frames at either end make it easier to pull wood from the mill.
• The dealer is within a half day's drive.
• If I phone for a part before 4:30 PM on a weekday, it'll be at the local bus depot at 7:00 AM the next morning.

These all have to do with my particular business and geographical location.

You don't see many folks on this forum selling off one brand of mill in order to buy a different brand of the same type. Seems that people who buy one particular brand tend to stick with it until their business or personal circustances require a change.

One thing I learned a long time ago from a guy named Marvin Minsky: If you've done your homework and still have trouble deciding on which alternative to choose -- it probably doesn't matter.

[Bibbyman]

So how much do they pay you Bibbyman? smiley_blue_bounce

I'm not sure I understand the question.  Who is "they"?   

[MikeH]

They is the people in orange trench coats......from Firebass posts

[Bibbyman]

Oh..  Now I see who "they" are.

No.  I'm not an undercover salesman for Wood-Mizer.  Or TimberKing or Baker or Terex or Morgan or Sears or Dodge either.

But Wood-Mizer does pay me.  Mary and I sawed out about $1,000 worth of oak by noon today. (We started early.) The five year old mill with nearly 4,000 hours on it didn't fail once.  And if it did,  I knew help was only a phone call away.

[Brian_P]

Why not step up to a fully hydraulic machine.  You might check out used, like this one on ebay  120154751644.

Gives you an option at least.
Brian

[Jeff]

To Firebass: I am going to warn you one time, and one time only.  This is my website. You have no freedoms here. None. You only have privilege. Privilege granted to you through the terms of agreement when you joined the Forestry Forum.  Privilege that can be continued, or withdrawn at anytime for any reason. Please don't make me use my right to make a decision like that. Your last remark is obviously taunting and although I refrained from saying anything until now, your previous remarks were rubbish. I wont stand for it happening again.

In general. I came across a speech a long time ago made by a fellow regarding people and thier perceived rights regarding using youtube.  He says a lot of things that apply here.  I'll embed the link after my say.  His short speech regarding rights on a privately owned website and business are right on the mark. Please be advised that he does at times use some strong adult language. Just pretend as you listen to this that he is talking about the Forestry Forum, or perhaps any other privately ran website trying to perform a service and make ends meet.

Caution, there is some use of profanity in this clip.

http://www.youtube.com/v/atCF5kyR6J4