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Can you ID this? Solved, Oglethorpe Oak

Started by Dodgy Loner, June 12, 2007, 06:13:58 PM

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Dodgy Loner

Since Texas Ranger killed the fun a on my last plant ID thread sooner than I expected ;), I've got a tougher one that I'm pretty sure will take a little more time to solve (as long as WDH allows it) ;D.

First, the leaves:


I'll post a pic of the bark if no one gets it right by tomorrow night :).
"There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey." -John Ruskin

Any idiot can write a woodworking blog. Here's mine.

Radar67

"A man's time is the most valuable gift he can give another." TOM

If he can cling to his Blackberry, I can cling to my guns... Me

This will kill you, that will kill you, heck...life will kill you, but you got to live it!

"The man who can comprehend the why, can create the how." SFC J

Dodgy Loner

Nope.  To give an idea of scale, the longest leaves are about 3 or 3.5" long.
"There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey." -John Ruskin

Any idiot can write a woodworking blog. Here's mine.

limbrat

ben

Dodgy Loner

:D I figured someone would say that, but no, it's not a laurel oak.  Getting warmer, though.
"There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey." -John Ruskin

Any idiot can write a woodworking blog. Here's mine.

Radar67

How about devilwood?

Stew
"A man's time is the most valuable gift he can give another." TOM

If he can cling to his Blackberry, I can cling to my guns... Me

This will kill you, that will kill you, heck...life will kill you, but you got to live it!

"The man who can comprehend the why, can create the how." SFC J

Dodgy Loner

Getting cooler again ;).  Remember, devilwood has opposite leaf arrangement.  This specimen has alternate arrangement.
"There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey." -John Ruskin

Any idiot can write a woodworking blog. Here's mine.

limbrat

Well i been calling them backwards. These threads are great.
Its a spinner bait eating tree. Expecialy the ones with the long skinny blades.
ben

Dodgy Loner

No limbrat, the trees you were calling laurel oaks are almost certainly laurel oaks.  The foliage from the two trees is nearly identical, but this is a specimen of a much rarer species.  They don't frequent wet areas, so your spinner baits should be safe around them. ;D  I'll give you another hint: the acorns take only one year to mature on this tree.

BTW, the ones with the long, skinny blades are probably willow oaks.
"There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey." -John Ruskin

Any idiot can write a woodworking blog. Here's mine.

Radar67

"A man's time is the most valuable gift he can give another." TOM

If he can cling to his Blackberry, I can cling to my guns... Me

This will kill you, that will kill you, heck...life will kill you, but you got to live it!

"The man who can comprehend the why, can create the how." SFC J

Dodgy Loner

Closer.  Live oak doesn't like to get its feet wet, and its acorns mature in 1 year, not 2.  But this one is much rarer than live oak.  Another hint: it was named after the location in which it was discovered.
"There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey." -John Ruskin

Any idiot can write a woodworking blog. Here's mine.

Radar67

Last guess, Arkansas Oak or commonly known as water oak.

Stew
"A man's time is the most valuable gift he can give another." TOM

If he can cling to his Blackberry, I can cling to my guns... Me

This will kill you, that will kill you, heck...life will kill you, but you got to live it!

"The man who can comprehend the why, can create the how." SFC J

Dodgy Loner

Around here, water oak and Arkansas oak refer to two different species - Quercus nigra and Quercus arkansana.  That's not a bad guess - Arkansas oak is, indeed, very rare and restricted in its range.  But its leaves are typically obovate, ie. widest above the middle, and its acorns mature in 2 years.

Okay, last hint before I post the picture of the bark: those of you from Georgia and South Carolina are more likely to have seen (or heard of) this tree than anyone else.
"There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey." -John Ruskin

Any idiot can write a woodworking blog. Here's mine.

Radar67

According to the National Audubon Society's Field Guide to Trees, The acorns for Arkansas Oak mature the first year.

Stew
"A man's time is the most valuable gift he can give another." TOM

If he can cling to his Blackberry, I can cling to my guns... Me

This will kill you, that will kill you, heck...life will kill you, but you got to live it!

"The man who can comprehend the why, can create the how." SFC J

Dodgy Loner

I'm sure that's not the only thing the Audubon guide is wrong about.  Check out this page.  It offers a much more detailed (and accurate) description of Arkansas oak.

Remember, two of the defining characteristics of red oaks are the bristle tips and the biennial acorns.  An oak with bristle tips and acorns that mature in one year would be quite the quagmire. :)
"There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey." -John Ruskin

Any idiot can write a woodworking blog. Here's mine.

SwampDonkey

Well is it shingle oak? I think we have pretty well exhausted all the willow oak family.  :D :D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Dodgy Loner

Another good guess, but those leaves are a little too small to be shingle oak.  This is much rarer than shingle oak - I'd be surprised if you've even heard of it up there in the frozen tundra Canada.

You're right about one thing, though - consider the willow/water/laurel oak complex exhausted. ;)
"There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey." -John Ruskin

Any idiot can write a woodworking blog. Here's mine.

WDH

I know but I ain't saying.  I have only ever seen it once.  The hint about the acorns is key :).
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

SwampDonkey

If your not gonna play fair then I ain't interested.  :D :D :D :D :D


Just kidding.  ;D
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

SwampDonkey

Well I got two more 'guesses' ya dodgy bugger.  :D :D

Bluejack Oak Q. incana

BUT I'm pretty sure it's......

Oglethorpe Oak Q. oglethorpensis named in 1940 for Oglethorpe County, Georgia, where it is most abundant. Named in honor of James E Oglethorpe, an English general and founder of the colony of Georgia.

smiley_biggrin01


smiley_bounce smiley_balloon_01 smiley_bounce
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

Lanier_Lurker

Sheesh, SD beat me to it.  :(

What time zone is New Brunswick in anyway?  4:37AM?

WDH

I guess SD was so intent on IDing this tree that he could not sleep.  Either that or he was thinking hexagonal thoughts about that BBQ table ;).
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

Dodgy Loner

Quote from: SwampDonkey on June 13, 2007, 04:37:25 AM
BUT I'm pretty sure it's......

Oglethorpe Oak Q. oglethorpensis named in 1940 for Oglethorpe County, Georgia, where it is most abundant. Named in honor of James E Oglethorpe, an English general and founder of the colony of Georgia.

smiley_hillbilly_tub_base smile_banjoman smiley_fiddler

We have a winner!  Someone was doing some internet research in the wee hours of the morning. :D  Oglethorpe oak was discovered by a UGA dendrology professor and named by Wilbur Duncan, a UGA botany professor.  It was the last tree native to Georgia to be identified.  It's range is tiny, restricted primarily to two small populations of the Georgia and South Carolina Piedmont.  Although the leaves give it the appearance of a red oak (as evidenced by the suggestions of laurel, Arkansas, shingle, and bluejack oak) the bark clearly puts it in the white oak group.

"There is hardly anything in the world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price only are this man's lawful prey." -John Ruskin

Any idiot can write a woodworking blog. Here's mine.

SwampDonkey

Quote from: Lanier_Lurker on June 13, 2007, 08:48:19 AM
Sheesh, SD beat me to it.  :(

What time zone is New Brunswick in anyway?  4:37AM?

Atlantic, we are 1 hr ahead of Boston. I was standing at the table saw for that new barn door at 6:30 am.  :D :D :D Daylight is before 6 am here during summer.  ;)
"No amount of belief makes something a fact." James Randi

1 Thessalonians 5:21

2020 Polaris Ranger 570 to forward firewood, Husqvarna 555 XT Pro, Stihl FS560 clearing saw and continuously thinning my ground, on the side. Grow them trees. (((o)))

WDH

Then, on to the BBQ table after breakfast, huh?
Woodmizer LT40HDD35, John Deere 2155, Kubota M5-111, Kubota L2501, Nyle L53 Dehumidification Kiln, and a passion for all things with leafs, twigs, and bark.  hamsleyhardwood.com

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