ford diesels

[burlman]

hey ff gang, I am in the market for a newer truck.I am driving a ford with a 7.3 turbo diesel, it is a 95 and it is starting to get tired. I see alot of newer fords now with a 6 litre turbo diesel and I'm wondering if any of you have  or know of these engines. I here some rumors that they arn't as good as thir bigger cousins are. seems to be alot for sale so that makes me worried. I love diesels, but with the higher price of the moters and the higher price of fuel, I don't know if thry are woth it anymore. any help, or expieriances would be great.. thanks

[logwalker]

I recently shopped and bought a 1994 turbo-diesel 7.3. The is not a Powerstroke but is a factory turbo IDI motor. I heard and read an awful lot of complaints about the new motors so personally I would stay in the 7.3 family for a few more years. Joe

[Brad_S.]

I went shopping for a new truck last fall. The troublesome 6.0's are being replace by a new engine, 6.4 I think it was. I decided that, besides not wanting to dish out $35K for a chassis, that I didn't want a "deal" on last years 6.0 nor did I want to be a beta tester for the new engine, so I'm hanging on to my 7.3 until the jury is in on this new engine.

[Gary_C]

I have a 2002  7.3 Powerstroke and have not been happy with that stinkin, smokey, diesel guzzling engine, even when it was new. I was going to trade for a 6.0 but I've heard nothing but bad things about them.

I am sure the 6.0 as well as the new 6.4 were made to meet new emissions regs, so it would be best to wait before jumping into a 6.4.

Not sure what to tell you at this point.

[scsmith42]

Steve, I have had three 6.0 Ford diesels (still have two of them), two '03's and one '05.

I've got about 100K miles on the '03 Excursion; my wife's daily driver, and she's towed a horse trailer all over the SE and east cost with it.  No serious issues; it's only been in the shop for a couple of factory recalls and a bad sensor.  I think that we'll keep it to at least 250K miles, if not more.

The '03 F350 never had any unscheduled maintenance, save one recall (computer reprogramming).  I sold it at 45K miles because I had the opportunity to sell it for the depreciated value.  I spoke with the fellow that bought it a few months back - he loves it and has not had any problems out of it whatsoever.

The '05 has about 50K miles on it; has had one unscheduled maintenance item when the oil sensor on the fuel pump died (and left me on the side of the road).  I need to get it back into the dealer for a warranty repair on an oil leak.

Personally, I think that the weak point in the trucks are the trannys, not the engines.  But then again, I routinely pull about 30K lbs behind them, so I'm giving them a good workout.

My brother works for a concrete coring company in Phoenix; every one of their diesels (both Ford and GM) has been in the dealer for unscheduled warranty work.  Their gas engines have not.  Granted that a lot of the items are sensors and electronics, but this still equates to downtime.

I think that it was Harold that said that the perfect truck would be the Cummins engine, Allison tranny, and Ford Chassis.  Have to say that I don't disagree.

One thing to consider... rumor has it that in another year or so Allison will be releasing an 8 speed tranny.  I hope that Ford brings out something similar.  I would love to have a diesel 350-3500 or 450 - 4500 chassis with three overdrive ranges.  This would allow a significant improvement in mileage when towing empty, w/o sacrificing towing capacity.  You'd probably be able to get 20+ MPG empty on the highway (we get 18.5 out of the Excursion at 65mph).

I wish that GM would bring out something that had an interior option similar to the King Ranch, and some front end sheet metal that wasn't so butt-ugly.  If so, my next truck would probably be a GMC.

Without a doubt, the 7.3 is a workhorse; however the 6.0 is much more high tech.  I personally like the quieter ride of the 6.0, but there are tradeoffs...

Hope this helps.

Scott

[LeeB]

D-O-D-G-E 

[highpockets]

I'm on my second 7.3 turbo ford.  Both have been very good so far.  Last year we took a 21 day trip. I'll bet 70% of the camper pulling vehicles were Fords.  I like to watch new engines for a few years and see what they turn out to be.  Someone else can do the beta testing as you mentioned.

[Dan_Shade]

the 6.0 had some serious problems. the new trucks are now under a recall.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=v36MCcRPRTc

personally, i'd stick to the 7.3

a dodge diesel is like a hotdog with a turd bun :D

[flip]

Thank Al Gore and all the other "the sky is falling" environmentalists.  The government imposed new emmission regulations on all Light duty diesels.  Some of these new regulations include paticulate filters for the exhaust which is why some of the 6.4s could breathe fire.  The 6.4 can tell when the filter in the exhaust is getting restricted and runs a regen cycle where it puts raw fuel into the exhaust to burn the filter clean.  Unfortunately if an injector breaks and dumps raw fuel in all the time you get what's on you tube.  So far we have seen little trouble out of the 6.4 but due to low sulpher fuels and emmissions erquirements fuel mileage is and will suck for all manufacturers.

If you have a 7.3 or 6.0 keep it, unless you want to see 10mpg unloaded, and yes this goes for Chevy and Dodges too.  Thank your  government for sticking it to diesel owners.

[flip]

On another note, the next diesel Ford puts in a truck will NOT be from International.  We are either getting a Cat or Cummins, not sure of which yet.  Bad blood over the 6.0 and International not wanting to pay their portion of warranty expenses.

[Gary_C]

Ford has always purchased the basic engine from Navistar, now back to International with absolutely no warranty and with their own accessories, sensors, etc. Yes, Navistar or Intl. does assemble the complete engine, but with the Ford parts. Part of the reason is so you cannot go to International dealers for parts and service. Because of this many of the engine problems have been exclusive with Ford, although the 6.0 has been a problem for both.

I do not know about the present, but Ford has had a financial interest in both Cummins and Navistar. That does not mean they do not bicker and fight among the separate companies, but I have heard this engine change story before and Ford has always stuck with International. All engine manufacturers are having trouble with the new emission regs for diesels.

[OneWithWood]

I am very happy with my '05 6.0.  I will be keeping it for a long while.  Now if Ford starts putting a Cummins under the hood I would definately be doing some thinking about trading.

[submarinesailor]

Have a 2003 F250 SD with the 6.0.  Had it for about 3.5 years and it has 126,800 miles on it.  Today on the way home from work, it averaged about 19.9 MPG – a little stop and go.  Gotten as high as 23.3 MPG in it.

The only problem was a bad alternator at about 80K.  Got lucky and found it just before we started a 3,500 mile trip with about 8K behind it in a trailer.

Any one run AMSOIL or an other synthetic in theirs?

Bruce

[Weekend_Sawyer]

I am the proud owner of a new (to me) 06' 6.0 F360 and I love it.
It pulls like a Brahama bull. I tow my 7,000 lb skid steer on my 3,000 flatbed trailer with power to spare. I upgraded from my 96' F350 gasser for this reason. I really like the 5 speed automatic with tow/haul. I spent alot of time over on the ford truck enthusiasts 6.0 forum and decided that it was not a gamble to purchase this truck.

Jon

[submarinesailor]

Jon,

Did Ford change their numbering without letting me know??? ??? ??? ???  An F360???

Love the 5 speed also.

Bruce

[TexasTimbers]

I have a 1999 F350 with almost 270K on it. I have towed mountains, up mountains, over mountains with it. It will leave a hole in the wind and outrun some sports cars. Of course it has a chip. :D
It's my farm truck and I am gonna keep it until it drops dead then maybe put another 7.3 Power Stroke in it like it has now. I don't even want to think about putting a 6.0 in it. That 7.3 is all torque and muscle.

[scsmith42]

Bruce, I run Lubrication Engineers oil (LE) in my trucks.  Supposedly the best non-synthetic oil on the market.

Scott

[TexasTimbers]

Scott, if cummins could figure out how to make their engines quiter than a locomotive I might like to have one. :D

[scsmith42]

Kevin: amen brother.

[Captain]

Actually, the new comon rail FI Cummins Diesels are pretty quiet.  This from a DuraMax Fan.

Captain

[Mooseherder]

I asked our mechanic what I could do to improve the fuel mileage on the Cummins.
He recommended using a half quart Transmission Fluid with a full tank fill up.
Not something you have to do all the time. I did it twice and will probably wait till fall to do it again. My mileage improved 2.7 miles per gallon.  From 13.2 to 15.9 average on the Headsup display. Of course, this was after he found a Shop rag restricting the air flow to the Turbo. I talked about that episode in annudder thread. Can't tell which fix should be commended. ;) :D
The only time you really hear the cummins is at a stop light with the music not loud enough. ;D

[Quartlow]

Scott, if cummins could figure out how to make their engines quiter than a locomotive I might like to have one. :D

if its too loud,,,,your TOO old  :D  :D  :D  :D

Actually my Sis and her hubby just got a new 3500 for toting the camper all over. I got the chance to drive it while they where here and it surprised as to how quiet it is.

[TexasTimbers]

Man I have never heard that Xmission fluid thing. I just don't know if I could bring myself to pour Xmission fluid into mu fuel tank.

Makes you wonder how that came about. Billy Bob was hanging around the local ExpressDonuts shop one morning and opined "Hey fellers I'ma gonna poot some tranny juice in mah Cummins and see whut happinz yeehaw!" :D

[isawlogs]

 I have heard of that  a few times . It is said to lub the injection pump , not sure if it helps with gas millage or not .. I put some in there once in a while .. but I use uncolored hydraulic fluid .. that tranny oil could color the fuel and then , well we get checked here once in a while by da fuel police .. they dont take too kindly to having colored fuel in a pick-up ...

[Mooseherder]

I bought the Cummins on the recommendation of my brother Ron who is a diesel mechanic and rebuilt GM Diesels up until a couple months ago. He works for a company that rebuilds Hummers at the Old Loring Air Force Base site in Maine. They stopped rebuilding motors and replace with new Diesels now. Seems the new motors were having problems because they were not being properly torqued at the plant. They gotta redo about 110 Hummers. Had folks from the plant and all that. Now Ron is the kinda guy that can do just about everything and if he don't know how to do something, he'll get it done anyway. ;) He still owns the first used car he bought when he was a teenager and he is 53 now. :D
Through the years he has had a least 3 Workvans make it over 300,000 miles, then he gets a 300 dollar motor and will get another 150,000 on a van. :D
When Carlos our mechanic mentioned the tranny fluid, he was kinda gun shy about recommending it but qualified it by saying what it had done for his Diesel along with another customers Truck. He said it would clean out the Injectors better than any additive on the shelf. When I called Ron about the tranny fluid, he said Carlos is correct. He also mentioned using Tranny Fluid in the Oil Engine of his Van because of noisy lifters on a 300,000 mile Chevy 350 right before a scheduled next day oil change. He said no more lifter noise.

[Dave Shepard]

I don't worry about the noise my Cummins makes, can't even hear it over the 3" straight pipes. ;)


Dave

[Weekend_Sawyer]

The other weekend I did the maintenance on my 6.0. I really like the oil filter. It is a cartridge type and  mounted on the top front of the engine. Before pulling the pan plug you loosen the oil filter cap which lets a spring loaded dran open in the bottomof it. Then you pull the pan plug and be ready because 14 quarts of oil are coming out.

Changing the fuel filters is pretty easy, one next to the oil filter and one on the frame rail. once changed you cycle the keyswitch a couple of times and they are primed. No real muss or fuss.

The other day I was getting on an exit ramp pulling my loaded trailer. I floored it and the back tires broke loose! I was surprized. The next set of tires is going to be a little more sticky.

From what I have learned from two large diesel forums is that when the 6.0's came out in the latter half of 03' they had problems that continued through build dates into 04'. Throttle body problems, sticky EGR's oil leaks from porly machined surfaces and turbo problems. I also gleaned that Ford worked pretty hard to fix what was wrong.

My truck had 11,000 miles and I have put 5,000 on it since I bought it and am quite pleased with it's performance. It's the best truck I have ever owned and I have owned trucks since I started driving starting with a 62 ford w/3 on the tree.

Hope I am still this happy with it next year.

[kczbest]

I have an '01 F-250 4x4 7.3. Man, I love my truck! With a programmer and 4" exhaust she sounds really good when the turbo winds up. 8) If I have one of my John Deere's on the Gooseneck she will really talk to you. I regularly get 22.5-23 mpg and around 19 mpg in town. My mileage drops 1.5-2 mpg on regular Diesel. I much prefer commercially available Biodiesel.

[thurlow]

He recommended using a half quart Transmission Fluid with a full tank fill up.

I've never used any fuel conditioner in my (1st generation) Cummins , because the manual specifically says not to do so.  However, I've used Dexron in my diesel farm equipment for probably 30 years.  Was using John Deere conditioner, but the shop foreman.............whose judgement I trusted............. said to use the transmission fluid as a conditioner/injection cleaner.

[Lankyloader]

My son bought a 04 Ford with a 6.0 and I drove it up to Lumby from Vancouver (300-350miles) thru the coast range and felt there was no lack of power but he has purchased the Bully Dog chip and tells me I would not believe the performance this did for that motor. The 3 settings (50-75-100hp) he leaves it in No.1. I understand Super chip makes a module that is more user friendly for the 7.3 that sells for around $300 (70-90-110hp) and if one goes on line, you can read the comments from buyers. Driving a 2000-350 with a 7.3, I am considering the Super Chip and will reply when I have tested it. He is working on a job in Grand Prairie, Alberta, and he tells me just about every diesel pickup up there is running with one of these modules. They get their kicks leaving gas buggies in their dust.He is a very serious driver and really looks after his vehicle and when he tells me that there is that kind of performance in just the first setting, I know it must be so. The comments from older 7.3 drivers say it makes a whole new vehicle out of a diesel.

[Handy Andy]

  Our Coop adds about 2% biodiesel for lubrication.  Is that enough or do you still need to add the dextron?  I only have diesel tractors and skidsteer, no diesel truck.

[burlman]

thanks for all  the tips gang really helpful. When you boil it all down they want about $7000 dollars more for a diesel in a used truck, diesel fuel cost more than gas does now , and now you tell me that the mileage sucks with all this pollution protection crap on them, except for missing the lovely noise, does it make anysense to buy a diesel anymore, I here these ford tritons are pretty good for power and economy. just to many decisions. I am having a hell of a time just trying to find a stick shift let alone with a diesel. the only way to get it all is to order a new one, but I can't justify those prices for a work truck that really works, and gets dents, and scratches on narrow bush roads. I got 325,000 kilometers on th ol'95 now and we'll keep it going as a plow truck for as long as the transport federallies say I can with out doing a big makeover on it

[ScottAR]

Welcome Lanky!

You might also look into the programmer from DP performance.  They custom
tailor the program to your exact truck with any and all mods included.  In fact,
you have to fill out a questionaire about your rig.  5 settings included in base
price.   
About  $280 from ITP diesel. 

[Quartlow]

Well for the Dodge and duramax guys, go see this outfit
Diesel Injection of Pittsburgh

Bruce knows how to make a cummins sit up and take notice. He also works with a gentleman named Mark Chappel who is a retired cummins performance engineer. (bet you didn't know Cummins had a high performance division)They also happen to be a Cummins dealer. I drove one a big cam IV cummins for a few years that they set up. The only thing that I ever found I couldn't get around was a pair of V8 cats out of Alabama

[Dave Shepard]

You can find Mark Chappels products at tstproducts.com. I am running a computer from him. I am at 400 RWHP right now.


Dave