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Re: INSERT TOOTH SAWBLADES

Started by Bro. Noble, February 19, 2003, 08:10:48 PM

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Bro. Noble

UncleBuck,

Welcome to the forum.  We have about a half-dozen guys, maybe more that are very experienced with circle saws.  They will want to know what size and style of bits you have in both of your saws.  Might even be able to find a source of teeth for the 48 inch.

In the meantime look through the old posts if you havn't already you'll find at least one related topic.  We had one recently on inserted teeth.

Ask Jeff if he has any tips on changing teeth.

Noble
milking and logging and sawing and milking

chet

Noble dat's a purty low blow,   ::)  teasing Jeff when he's down.   ;D
I am a true TREE HUGGER, if I didnt I would fall out!  chet the RETIRED arborist

Jeff

I was going to take a picture of my hand all bandaged up and show noble how that even though injured at least one of the fingers works, but the one I wanted to show won't right now. :D
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

chet

I'll bet he gets da message anyways.  :D
I am a true TREE HUGGER, if I didnt I would fall out!  chet the RETIRED arborist

Ron Wenrich

You'll be able to use the 52 inch saw, but you will have to move your saw guide and probably your board splitter.  There should be adjustments for both of them.  If not, you may have to remount them.

To find out what pattern your saw is, look on the shank.  There should be either numbers or letters on it.  The 2" may be a B or F or 2 1/2 or 3 1/2 pattern.

The Disston is a real antique.  They've been out of business for a good 35 years, maybe more.  They had numbers like 33 or 66 or maybe even an ABC.  They make a real nice sign.

Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

sawmill_john

UncleBuck, before you paint that disston blade determine what pattern tooth and shank fit it, Rons right on the money about the antique part, but I've got some disston shanks and some old disston teeth, There should be a letter and number or two numbers or some thing on the shanks that identify the pattern and gauge of the shank.  Let me know, we'll see if we can help you out.

The gauge of the shank would generally follow the pattern for instance B x 8, or B 8
John

UNCLEBUCK

HELLO AND THANKS FOR ALL THE FEEDBACK. I DOUBLE CHECKED THE BLADES TODAY AND THE DISSTON 48 INCH HAS 40 TEETH AND THE SHANKS HAVE A ( c ) STAMPED ON THEM,I HAD THAT BLADE HAMMERED BY RICE BLACKSMITHING IN RICE MN.,A PROFESSIONAL SAW SHOP, FOUND A OLD BUCKET FULL OF TEETH AND WILL PICK THROUGH IT THIS WEEKEND,.  I MEASURED THE BIGGER BLADE AND IT IS 50 INCH AND 52 TEETH AND HAS NEW BITS AND SHANKS AND ALSO HAS BEEN HAMMERED TOO 400 R.P.M., I HAVE NOT TRIED THEM OUT YET BUT WHEN WHEN THE SNOW MELTS AROUND THE SAW SHED I WILL BE SAWING EVERYTHING IN SIGHT,I AM NEW TO COMPUTERS AND THIS SITE BUT FEEL RIGHT AT HOME READING EVERYONE ELSES QUESTIONS AND THROUGH THE WEEKEND I WILL KNOW MORE ABOUT SHANKS AND TEETH RIGHT ! THERE MUST BE SOMEONE WITH A BOX OF BRAND NEW DISSTON TEETH OUT THERE SOMEWHERE .THANKS EVERYONE
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

Fred

I have a Disston 52" never used it because it needed shanks and teeth also..I called ozark machinery they said they had a few boxes but I never got them..thats been several years ago. I used a pacifac hoe 54" F style then sold the mill I do still have a 48" B style..I wonder if a person can get these cut down to a 36" ??
Baker 18M
Woodmaster 718 Planer/ molder

Bro. Noble

Ozark Machinery has a website :  www.ozarkmachinery.com  You can get their e-mail from their website.  I was there Tuesday and could have checked on the bits.  They are sure good people to deal with.

Noble
milking and logging and sawing and milking

UNCLEBUCK

 DOES ANYBODY KNOW IF MY DISSTON SAWBLADE CAN BE RETROFITTED WITH NEW SIMONDS TEETH AND SHANKS, ANY ANSWERS GREATLY APPRECIATED .
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

THANKS FRED FOR THE OZARK WEB,JUST SENT A EMAIL TO ASK ABOUT RETROFITTING MY DISSTON SAWBLADE, I REFUSE TO BUY PAINT AND MAKE A SIGN OUT OF IT YET, HAHA, THANKS EVERYBODY,THIS IS GREAT !
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

crosscut

thanks for that link noble way down here in florida i would prefer dealing with someone closer to me for advice and service help does anyone know of any saw services for hammering ,parts etc closer to my end of the world ??

DanG

CC, there used to be a saw shop in Ocala, that offered all sorts of commercial saw services. I can't remember the name, but they might be worth looking for.
"I don't feel like an old man.  I feel like a young man who has something wrong with him."  Dick Cavett
"Beat not thy sword into a plowshare, rather beat the sword of thine enemy into a plowshare."

Ron Wenrich

For you guys in the South, you can go right to a saw manufacturer.  B H Payne is in East Point, GA.  Here's the website:  http://www.paynesaws.com/   I've run 2 of their saws, and am well satisfied.  They also sell mill supplies and teeth.

Saws can be cut down.  They will cut below the original sockets, then recut sockets with a new style shank and tooth.  It costs by the tooth.
 
I'm not sure how cost effective it is.  Why throw that much money in an old saw?  I've always figured it was cheaper to just buy a new one.
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

mitch

If you click on this link you will receive free a 5 Meg file  from the USDA Forest Service, State and Private Forestry.The booklet is
 "Circular Sawmills and Their Efficient Operation" by
           Stanford J. Lunstrum.
It has a wealth of information on all aspects of the circular saw mill.

http://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/misc/circsaw.pdf

UNCLEBUCK

hello from UNCLEBUCK,   my disston sawblade has not been used in 35 years and is in great shape but teeth and shanks are impossible to find,can anyone tell me if i can retro fit like simonds brand to make it work. its hammered for 400 r.p.m. with a 100 horse tractor and has 40 teeth ,shanks say ( C ) on them,  my 50 inch blade has 52 teeth and new shanks and teeth , just asking if 100 horsepower will be enough, my sawmill is a a.b.farquhar and has corley setworks and a very heavy i-beam framework,just never had time until now to bring it to life, any answers or suggestions greatly appreciated and i look forward to checking the forum every night ,this is a great place,thanks
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

I MEAN THANKS NOBLE, THANKS FRED TOO, I WILL GET THE HANG OF THIS YET !   ITS GONNA BE -20 BELOW TEMP TOMORRW ,HMMMMM FINALLY WARMING UP HERE IN MINNESOTA, FROST IS DOWN SO DEEP SEPTIC TANKS ARE FREEZING UP, GLAD I FOUND THE FORUM TO HELP MAKE WINTER GO BY !
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

Bro. Noble

Unclebuck,

Do a search on Menominee (sp) Saw.  It's the one in Michigan.  They do work on saws.  Ozark Machinery doesn't.

Noble
milking and logging and sawing and milking

Don P


Ron Wenrich

The first mill I ever put in and run was a Fahrquhar.  We paid $1000, since it had new wood.  It also came with a Disston saw, which we never run, since we couldn't find teeth.

Your 100 hp should be plenty of power.  A lot depends on how well you transfer your power to your saw.  If you get too much slippage, you can have some problems.  

You won't be able to get your saw re-socketed to a newer shank unless you cut it down.  Then your saw might be too small to be practical.

Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

mitch

Welcome to the forum UncleBuck:
I agree with Ron. You should have plenty of power. I often saw with a 46" saw with 34  #3 bits. Recently, I sawed 30" to 40" oak with the head saw completely buried (~19") in the log with only a 40 HP GJD. A top saw finished the cut so that I could slice off 24" x 5/4 clear red oak boards. However, it takes sharp bits and good saw/carriage alignment to saw with low power.Some images are at URL
   http://www.shagbarkfarms.com/TopSaw/

UNCLEBUCK

thanks mitch, I got pictures i printed out of your set up and they are hanging on the fridge to give me inspiration, it sounds like my old 100 horse farmall will handle what I got to do, am a old johnny popper enthusiast,grew up driving a R,830,H and 620 john deere but figured its good to blow up the farmall ,haha, anyway great pictures you got and thanks ok, i think i found enough disston teeth and shanks, i knew it was a antique blade but had to ask !
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

thanks everyone again for all the good answers about my disston sawblade, now my other sawblade is a ATKINS 50 inch 52 tooth, question is can I use this blade for sawing hardwoods ! if i can i will because it looks great, i believe it is a 8/9 gauge and my old disston blade i think is 6/7,just worried that the ATKINS might be too thin, 100 horsepower p.t.o. and 400 r.p.m. and hydraulic feed, last time I sawed a log was with this very same mill and unhammered DISSTON blade with a R john deere and long flat belt and smoke flew and blade started banging and got hung and scared me away for 20 years and now I am trying it again after lots of book reading and problem solving and regained interest in it, one old sawyer at the saw shop told me to slowly increase the hydraulic feed control until I cut nice chips instead of sawdust,look for nice chips ! sounds like good advice ! HELP!
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

mitch

Hi UncleBuck:
You have done something that I have always wanted to do... hook an 830 JD to an old circular mill. I sawed for about 20 yrs with the predecessor to the 830, a JD W power unit
      
The old sawyer gave you some good advice "Make saw chips not saw dust". That is good advice provided you have the power to maintain the saw turning at the hammered RPM's. However, in large dead, bone hard white oak logs you may not  be able to have each bit taking a 0.11 inch bite! If you have good shanks, they can usually "clean out" the saw dust.
The second commandment for good sawing should be "never force a log through a saw" even if it is the last log at the end of a long days sawing. At the first hint of sawing difficulty STOP and correct the problem... usually sharpen the bits.
Good luck with your sawing venture. Post some images.  

UNCLEBUCK

HI MITCH, TOOK ALOT OF PICTURES TODAY WITH NEW DIGICAM, DOWNLOADED FOLLOWING ALL PROCEDURES AND SEEMS EASY BUT CANNOT GET PICS BELOW @ 25K SO I THINK I MUST TAKE NEW ONES AND SET DIGICAM ON 2X OR 4X ZOOM, DONT KNOW WHAT ELSE IT COULD BE ! I REDUCED ORIGINALS FROM @300,000K AND START LOSING QUALITY @35K, ANY HINTS. CLEANED 2 ICE CREAM BUCKETS FULL OF TEETH YESTERDAY AND BUILT A WOODBOX WITH SPACE FOR EVERY KIND OF TOOTH I FOUND AND LEARNED ALOT JUST CLEANING UP TEETH,HAHA
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

unclebucks fahrquhar mill almost ready to roll,. I.H. forage chopper gearbox to reverse p.t.o. direction for blade ,bulletproof glass shield for sawyer,corley setworks and replaced most of the wood with heavy steel beams,4 inch grain auger for sawdust removal, disston blade hammered for 400 + rpm, just need to level up and block properly and remove the wheels,hydraulic carriage and 100 horse old farm tractor for power, hope my 1st picture compression turns out ok, not sure but practicing when I can, picture is out there somewhere
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

 :P trying to get saw picture to here,always goes to front page photos area , i better read on and keep practicing compressing,
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

O.K. here is the old farquhar mill and disston blade ,waiting for spring now !                                                                                     thanks mitch, hope i did this correct.
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

D._Frederick

Uncle Buck,
Your blade looks awful dark, I would say that you need to spend some time with some sandpaper, your blade will run cooler if it has no rust on it.  A 52 tooth blade is a little strong for just 100hp., the old timers used to figure about 3hp/tooth. Are you going to use  a belt to drive the mill at 400rpm? Make sure you don't have much slippage.
You did a nice looking job rebuilding your mill with steel, should saw real nice when you get it aligned.

mitch

UncleBuck:
I agree with D._Frederick.
QuoteYou did a nice looking job rebuilding your mill with steel, should saw real nice when you get it aligned.
It looks like it could saw circles around my old "drop dog" Vance mill.
Good luck and keep us posted.

UNCLEBUCK

hi everybody ! well I guess I better put all my books away and start stacking up the logs and get that first log buzzed up ! I am nervous about it but as with all things once I have done it awhile I will start to enjoy ! I have to save up for a new blade about 48 inch and 36 to 40 teeth and thick and strong! found this mill for 500 bucks ,2 blades included and then put about 3,500 bucks into it ! I suppose a new blade has to cost a couple thousand but will be money well spent once I get the hang of it ! thanks for the compliments,it makes me feel good to know the old farquhar is going come alive again ! quite a few times I was almost ready to forget it all ! the forum rocks !
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

forgot to answer question ! it has been converted to pto but can be run on belt if I choose to but tried that 20 years ago with a R john deere and then a 830 j.d. and it scared me to death and the board man so switched over to p.t.o. and then put a shear bolt in a machined collar between gearbox and arbor, I dont have a slip clutch on the p.t.o. but am hoping the shear bolt will shear if everything goes sour ! from my new reading on the forum seems like everyone suggests a p.t.o. shaft with a slip clutch,have not found anyone yet that just used a shear bolt ! take care !  :P
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

mitch

UncleBuck:
Some useful links:
New saws, resonable priced...I have two of their saws
       http://www.paynesaws.com/

Meadows Mills uses their saws
       http://www.meadowsmills.com/

Complete PTO drives with built in slip clutch
      http://www.surpluscenter.com

That is a fine looking mill....worth investing a few more dollars in.
Good luck.

D._Frederick

UncleBuck,
Have you checked how the saw is hanging since you had it hammered? You may have to shim it to get the dish in the blade correct. Mitch nodoubt can give you more info about this.

Fla._Deadheader

Hey, "D". Didja ever post any pics of your mill on the forum?? I would really like to see it. You have done several things different than the rest of us. There's all kinds of homemade stuff on here. How about adding yours?? :)
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Sawyerfortyish

Unclebuck I got what you been looking for a full box of brandee new style 33 disston saw bits. No I don,t want to sell them. I have a 58" disston I wanted to have cut down and fitted for new style teeth. It aint worth it. Buy a new blade. They gaurantee them to work right. If your just getting set to start sawing a new blade will eliminate some problems you might have right off.
  Someone mentioned sanding a dirty blade. Don,t do it! Ask a saw DR. how to clean a blade he will tell you to use a wire brush. Not by hand but an angle grinder with one works good. Never use sand paper. I got my A$$ chewed out by a saw DR.for doing that.
 22yrs ago I started sawing with a 44" blade and a 70 HP tractor. All big oak and I can tell you it aint enough power I did ok but it takes time to get the feel of the blade the power and the sound of the blade to know when to slow down or shut down and sharpen
 You got a nice looking mill there to start and maybe you can help answer that old question about which mill is better A Frick or a Fraq :-/ :D I run an old Frick now. Started with an American mill just put in the Frick 3 yrs ago. Now I run a 671 Detroit 200+ HP no more power problems. I also run 56" blades I bought one every year for the last 3 years. So now I have enough that one can be worked on. One sawing lumber and one spare. I found that buying used is getting someone elses problem.
 Nice to have you on the forum hope to hear how things are going.

UNCLEBUCK

I log on and check my question about insert teeth and it says I have vad 35 replies and so i click on page 2 and it only shows 25, I cant read what people are asking me ! or telling me ! so I log out and back on and same thing ! last night it says I have 2 new messages so i click on to check and it only shows 3 old messages allready read and responded to ! someday I will be able to answer all when I can see what your saying !
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

Sawyerfortyish

Unclebuck  I never log off I always stay logged on. What I would like to know is why the clock at the left is from 5 to 15 min slow. sometimes it almost catches up.

UNCLEBUCK

ok I made it in and finally got to read responses ! yeah !!!!  well the disston blade hanging on the mill has just come back from saw shop and it was wire brushed and does shine in most parts enough to clearly read the old disston name on it. the shanks are (C) and the teeth are 8 or HH8, I think I found enough after digging through a few pails . I have a 671 motor in the bottom of the truck crane and thought about making the switch but the arbor is not thick enough for that kind of power so I am totally happy with the old 100 horse farm tractor, but if the old disston conks out on me I have a 50 inch ATKINS with new shanks and bits and if that is too much blade then I think I will have to get a new blade and then my troubles are over, I cant say enough how much I appreciate everyone responding to my rooky questions but until I get a couple good days sawing with the new improvements made to this old beater I am full of questions but am happy to get answers from real experienced sawyers and dont know what I would do without you guys now ! I listen to everyone and appreciate it all, I dont think I have been a member for more than a few weeks and allready am starting to feel like a sawyer ! haha
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

SAWYER40, I will stay logged on all the time and then see how it goes,thanks for the tip ! I feel like mitch is my neighbor allready for helping me so much,now I am going to check out payne sawblades ! I also look at everyones profile to see what kind of mills they have or maybe see pictures,its fun to look at someone elses mill and get ideas ! thanks SAWYER40
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

Thanks Mitch for the new sites to check out and add to my favorites ! why in a few more weeks I might have something intelligent to add to the forum ! haha, maybe not !
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

D._Frederick ! hey there !  no I have not checked anything yet or leveled and aligned but I had the outside collar machined because it had no inside clearance but the inside collar looks like it is flat and smooth. With my book from Lunstrom in hand I will go through everything step by step and the old blades I had fixed up at the saw shop hopefully will do for just a little longer,these blades have not seen action for 20 years .I just cant wait to tell all my new forum buddies that I cut a log. probably is no big deal to most but I am just cranked up and spend the warm days dropping big frozen white oaks, maybe you can tell me more about your mill ok ! it all helps me ! thanks !
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

Paul_H

This has been an interesting thread for me because I've only been around a couple circle mills,and it was just to drop of some logs.I never had a chance to see how they work.

I went back to a older thread that I really liked, that has video clips of sawmills in action

Sawmills in action
Science isn't meant to be trusted it's to be tested

Ron Wenrich

Collars need to have a little bevel on them.  A couple thousands or you'll have problems.
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

UNCLEBUCK

Paul_H  thanks for the thread of sawmills in action ,that is great to watch ! Jeffs mill is awesome and Corley5 is fantastic,I will be cutting just like Corley5 does it ! And to Ron W  I could only have the fast collar machined and the man at rice sawshop here in minnesota said I would have to bring the arbor in and they would sweat the inside collar off and told me as long as it looks good on a straight edge to the eyeball I could bet by with it, I will know as soon as spring arrives here. thanks again everyone ! I made track cleaners in front of each carriage wheel out of box pipe that slides inside another boxpipe and kind of floats along with the carriage ,I tested it on a dry run when I was testing the hydraulic carriage out and seemed to look good but sure makes alot of screaching sounds , any feedback on this would help too ! ok ! I am going to watch sawing movies again,
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

mitch

UncleBuck:
Sounds like you are really putting the mill into top notch condition. Some  additional comments about saw collars:
The "tight" collar should undergo final machining on the arbor shaft. It takes a long bed lathe and just a few thousandths of an inch cut to true it with a slight bevel as Ron suggested. If it is machined off the arbor and then heat shrunk back on some minor distortion can occur.
Good luck.

Jeff

We have a collar grinding machine at work. It uses big tapered grinding stones versus a cutter.  We are talkign about a process that does nto take long because the material being removed is minut. It takes a while to set it up though.

I'll try to get a picture of it when I finally get back to work.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

D._Frederick

Jeff.
Since the saw has a sharp edge against it from the collar being ground with a bevel. does the saw wear a groove at the contact point? Reading over some sawmill books from the thirties, they did not have a bevel ground on the collars. They cut paper rings (washers) so that the collars did not change the way the blade hung from loose to tight arbor nut. This was the way our No. 2 American had the blade set up.

Ron Wenrich

Saw doctors really frown on paper shims.  An old miller showed me how to use them and they work pretty well, but I wouldn't do it on higher RPM mills.

The collars are beveled so that when you tighten the nut, it pulls the collars flat.  Otherwise, the collars will bevel out, and may not meet at the same point.  If your collars are off just a little bit, you will have some problems.

We had our collars turned on the mill.  We found someone to come out to the mill to do the work.  

As for track cleaners, I saw one guy who screwed paint brushes onto his carriage.  It looked strange, but it worked..

What I have done is take a piece of 4x4 piece of steel, and tack it to the carriage.  Inside I put pieces of wood, so that there was wood on top and the sides of the track.  Works great and no noise.

Jackson mills used to have a piece of pipe - about 3" welded to the carriage.  Inside, you would put a piece of round stock.  Then they had a spring on top and put on a cap.  Mine worked better
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

UNCLEBUCK

hey everyone, my dad just recovered from major cancer surgery and he is the one that was the brains behind rebuilding the old Farquhar mill but to give him inspiration tonight I sat him down and we watched Corley5"s sawmill movie and Jeffs huge lightning bolt movie sawing logs and he is smiling from ear to ear and thought it was way cool, thanks ForestryForum ! made his night for sure !
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

good advice on my saw collars, i better have the inside collar machined to match the outside , i did have a paper shim that fell out when i took the blade off to go to saw shop, i will ask for someone to come out or i will take it apart and go to the saw shop who does machining also. thanks for the tip mitch and jeff and ron , i think i will put small wood blocks inside each sliding little box pipe on each track cleaner, i like the paint brush idea too !
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

my last input for the night but as I watched corley5 and jeffs mill I noticed that corley5 had the butt end of the log to the rear of the carriage, I thought the butt end always goes to the front of carriage, any thoughts on this ! thanks again! :P
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

Jeff

Quotehe is smiling from ear to ear and thought it was way cool, thanks ForestryForum

Me too. Thanks Buck.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Ron Wenrich

We had a thread before about which way guys like to put their logs.  For me, it doesn't matter, since I'm running an automatic.  

For a hand mill, I would prefer the butt to the back, just because it reduces the number of steps to get to the tapers.  Works real well on long logs.

The advantage of the butt end front is that you have less travel between saw and flare.  It can save some time.

For a good running saw, it really doesn't matter all that much.
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

mitch

I agree with Ron.
QuoteFor a hand mill, I would prefer the butt to the back, just because it reduces the number of steps to get to the tapers.  Works real well on long logs.
I often saw with inexperinced help and I much prefer to set the taper... more accuracy and saves time.

Minnesota_boy

When you saw white spruce and tamarack, saw from the top end of the log to avoid the pinch that sawing from the butt gives you.  With my small circle saw mill, sometimes the spruce would pinch the saw so hard it would push the carriage back.  It might take two or three starts to get far enough into the log to get beyond th pinch.
I eat a high-fiber diet.  Lots of sawdust!

D._Frederick

You guys with hand set mills do you hire help to run them? If so what do you do for workers compensation insurance?

Minnesota_boy

I bought a Woodmizer and avoided the whole problem.   Workers compensation and the lack of workers available when I wanted them were a real headache.
I eat a high-fiber diet.  Lots of sawdust!

UNCLEBUCK

hello everyone, what do you all use to block out the tapered end of your log on the first cut , i dont have no adjustable knees on my 4 headblocks so would a block of wood be safe riding back there, thanks :P
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

D._Frederick,  I have not cut a log yet but am going to use the lumber from my first logs and make my brother-in-law 2 new porches on his house and he is going to be my boardman and I would like to watch and see what others say to your question of insurance ,something definately worth knowing, i am still trying to figure out which way the log goes on,haha ! :P
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

D._Frederick

Unclebuck,
I am sorry to hear about your fathers fight with the big C, we all hope that he will soon see the results of the first log being sawed on your mill.
I hate to say it, but don't hire some one to help saw on a circular mill unless you have insurance, they are just too dangerous.

Sawyerfortyish

I always prefer to saw from the small to big end. You dont have to walk as far to pull the taper or put a block behind the log but when you do use a block you have to watch and make sure it doesn,t fall out and become wedged in the carrige or ways or cable. On my circle mill I and can cut between 8 and 10 thousand feet per day I have two people hired to help and insurance is a bad word  >:( it,s a killer they trippled it after 9/11 we went 3 months without. Trying to find a company that could sell this type of insurance in N.J. was almost impossible I could have paid for a brand new F350 diesel 4x4 and had money left over for what that company wanted to raise our priemeium to :o. But in the end we got better insurance for about the same cost from a different company.

Minnesota_boy

I'm sure that D_Frederick was implying that the sawmill was the dangerous part, but don't discount how dangerous a helper can be also.  If the helper is careless and lets the end of a slab contact the top of the running saw, the slab will immediately become a missile headed directly for your head, possible with the helper as well if there is a limb projecting that catches part of his (her?) clothing.  Make sure any helper understands his obligation to help in keeping the mill as safe as possible.
I eat a high-fiber diet.  Lots of sawdust!

D._Frederick

The sawyer of  one of are local mills had his leg crushed by a slap coming back. He was pinned in place by the log deck, the leg was later cut off above the knee.
We had the carriage on are No. 2 American decked over so nothing would fall through. We always had a 1x4 and a 2x4 riding on the carriage to take care of taper.
I sold this mill because of the insurance problem. The two company that are licensed to sell workmans comp. would not deal with you unless you had full time pay roll.

UNCLEBUCK

D._Frederick,Sawyer40,Minnesota_boy, hey there ! thanks for the feedback, insurance sounds like a real b*&%$.  I like the idea of putting decking down on the mill, pretty convinced I will be cutting from small to big end now too! it just makes sense to do it that way,if I never asked I would have done it the opposite,going to have about 80 big fat white oak and 15 big fat spruce logs to cut . my questions are starting to slow down now as I am getting to really know this old mill during the warm days and hope to cut first log mid-april so now am felling . I think my last question is concerning the splitter behind the blade,in my picture back a few pages you can see it , it is bolted to the original wood husk , all the wood is solid throughout the husk except for the ends where there is really no structural value, the splitter feels like it is bolted to a weak area,i have steel plates and all thread bolts anchoring the husk in many many places but right where the splitter is it doesnt seem to be right structurally,lots of heavy iron under the old wood husk where the plates and all thread anchor too, i would like to cut oak to rebuild the husk with after i cut up my pile of logs , any advice greatly appreciated again, I cant get a bandsaw mill because this mill is kind of like a piece of the farm now , lots of stuff to figure out but seems to be worth it and i like doing this. thanks :P
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

Also if you look at my splitter on page 2 here is it too tall or too vertical ,its got some flex too it if you grab it on top and looks like 1/4 inch steel with a beveled edge , i better take it off and replace the blocking that spaces it from the carriage, maybe thats the instigator, maybe some of you got splitter ideas to share ok !  :P
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

beenthere

I would think you would want to know that the splitter is held pretty straight and tight. You don't want a pointed slab getting in between it and the saw (slab on the carriage side of the splitter) which happens, and if the splitter is a bit loose, it can happen easier. Yours is straight up, rather than curved but I  wouldn't think that would be a problem. Also, it is tall but that protects something coming in contact with the teeth up high. When I was sawing once, the off-bearer dropped a 4x4x 8' white oak onto the back of the saw that had a short splitter. It came by me, and then went through two old apple trees and was picked up about 75' away. Had a saw stripe the full length of one face of the 4x4. Not a pleasant thought even now.
south central Wisconsin
It may be that my sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others

Jeff

Buck, there is nothing wrong with that splitter, and they will flex at the top if you grab it. Also DONT DECK BETWEEN THE TRACKS!  Why? If makes it to easy to do something stupid. Keep a few boards handy to throw up there to work if you need them, but don't deck.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Ron Wenrich

I wouldn't do anything to the board splitter.  It may need to be adjusted.  It has to be straight and I have mine angled just a hair with the back end a little further from the log side.  

You will still have to watch that your slab end doesn't go behind the splitter.  Very important.  When I first started sawing, I wasn't watching.  A rounded end got caught and I kept on feeding.  The slab bowed, and when cut through shot back at me.  Luckily, I had a piece of safety glass up.

If the wood is in good shape, don't try to replace it.  Using green wood is even more of a disaster.  If you want to do a better job of securing the board splitter, fine.  You could run a bolt all the way through the wood and fasten it that way.

Do not run your log past the board splitter when sawing, unless you're ready to dump the cant.  Splitters will flex.  Even if your adjustment's off a little, you can still saw.  If your saw goes off line, your log can be hanging past the splitter.  When you return your carriage and the log is beyond the splitter, you can pull that splitter into the saw.  Many sparks and pieces.

My mill sits about 5 foot above the floor.  I don't have any decking.  Any garbage that falls off the log has a long way to fall before it causes a problem with the carriage.  
Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Sawyerfortyish

Unclebuck when you get ready to replace that husk build one out of steel. Don,t play with wood steel won,t rot like wood is strong and the dimmensions are the same from one end to the other. I rebuilt a husk on my old american mill it would have been quicker to weld one together than mortice one out of wood

Jeff

If your after function I would certainly  have to agree.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

UNCLEBUCK

Well I read the book again by Stanford j. Lunstrom and it all is crystal clear to me now after working on the mill this last week and hopefully everything will go good I guess I am just a fanatic about having everything being exact ! Time to get on with it and get sawing ! thanks everyone again and again !  :P
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

UNCLEBUCK

thanks for the splitter advice and about decking ! I love to hear stories of boards flying because it makes me think of more ways to as safe as possible !  I have run out of questions now and maybe next year I can share some of my misshaps but hopefully I have enough to look out for ! thanks to all my new buds ! I am grateful to all ! :P
UNCLEBUCK    bridge burner/bridge mender

Jeff

Don't disappear on us now, you probably know somethings we may need to know! ;)
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

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