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Cutting some pretty wood

Started by rvrdivr, December 18, 2006, 03:42:18 PM

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rvrdivr

It's funny you mentioned that. This past summer and just for curiosity, I explored the possibility of using a heavy lift helocopter to extract logs from a lake doing little or no damage to the lakes bottom. There was an incident in the summer of 2000 in Newnans lake (N. central Florida), where a deadheader was blamed for dragging logs accross the lake's bottom and destoying several ancient Indian canoes that were discovered soon after when the lake dried up. http://www.afn.org/~iguana/archives/2000_09/20000913.html

I think it was because of this, all the land locked lakes became off limits to logging. I figured if you could show that it was possible to extract the logs staight up and out, with little or no bottom damage, it might be possible to get the permit.

Just to see, I made many calls and found little in the way of heavy lifting helo's here in Florida. The best I found was a guy flying Black Hawks out of Orlando. He only charges $6000.00 and hour. :o :o  For that much, it's just not cost effective. 
But wouldn't that be fun :D

blaze83

pretty awesome stuff LogDog,  can't wait to see some more pics
I'm always amazed that no matter how bad i screw up Jesus still loves me

Fla._Deadheader


Brian, I MET the guy that was blamed. Turns out that some dippy woman decided that the lake bottom was being ecologically damaged. She made a LOT of phone calls about the guy damaging HER lake. He was simply dragging logs across the dry lake floor, WITH PERMISSION AND PERMITS.  ::) ::) ::) ::)

  News got all twisted ???  ::) ::)  and there was a big search going on. During the search, rotted canoes were found, by the DEP people standing on a "LOG" pile looking over the situation. Turns out, THEY were destroying rotten canoes, standing on and crushing them. The other end of the lake DID have several canoes.  These are dugouts, made with fire and scrapers.

  I'm all for preserving artifacts, but, a burned out log ?????????????????????

  I'm sure they would like to jail Mel Fisher for the one he has rotting down in front of his Treasure Shop in Sebastian ???????????
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

tcsmpsi

rvrdivr

I'd tell you what to do about painting your trim, but it would just get deleted.  :D

Though I've been required to do it from time to time, I just never could quite warm up to taking really fine wood and putting it on the floor.  (of course, my favorite floor is dirt, so what the heck do I know?)   ;D

Aaahhh....but, a ceiling now....
\\\"In the end, it is a moral question as to whether man applies what he has learned or not.\\\" - C. Jung

LOGDOG

Guys ... the rig to get it done is a self-propelled barge with either a small crane on it or knuckleboom loader on it. Get over it. Hook up. Then straight up onto the deck. I make it sound easy there and it's not but it does work with good rigging. Air bags work well too and will lift many tons of weight straight up - once the log is free of the sandbar of course. Helicopters just aren't effective. They eat up all the money. At least in this type of operation and several others. Based on the depths mentioned in previous post a guy could easily get a self propelled barge up there. Wouldn't hurt if it had a couple of spuds on it either.

I'm headed home for the weekend. I'll check back in on the post after the holiday. Y'all have a good holiday and be careful on the highways.

LOGDOG

getoverit

if you are going to paint it..... why not buy some cheap finger jointed trim from the box store?

It always astonishes me to see those home decorators on TV paint all of the beautiful woodowrk and call it progress...
I'm a lumberjack and I'm ok, I work all night and sleep all day

Furby

Quote from: Fla._Deadheader on December 20, 2006, 06:05:49 PM
We are allowed 3 people maximum to work the river per permit. No big barge, nothing big, because "The logs are like gold and you will get rich off the State logs."
I was told that face to face by one of the Govt. Reps. ??


So how big is big?


I see even 2x2 furing strips are finger jointed now. ::) ::)

Don_Papenburg

I was going to ask about useing air bags to lift the logs .   anything has to be cheaper than running a huwey , then you would have some old battleaxe complaining about the waves you were raising and washing the shore and..................
Frick saw mill  '58   820 John Deere power. Diamond T trucks

Fla._Deadheader


  We had a good system with the Pontoon Barge. The 15000# Winch would pull the logs up under the Barge and we would chain them off to the cross beams. Carried lift bags, but, too much trouble to use.

  2 of us doing all phases of finding, raising, unloading, stacking, sawing, transporting lumber and Marketing, was just too much. After nearly 5 years, we just got overwhelmed.

  Furby, sometimes the 24' width of the Pontoon Barge was too big.
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

rvrdivr

getoverit, You know I was just just kidding about painting it, right? :D  Besides, they'll be much better used as 2x4's for my walls! :D  ;D

As for the latter discussion of barge use and size, I have check with DEP and this is there reply; 
"As far as boat size, the only restriction would be the issue of navigation.  The Department doesn't have any set limitations, we just don't want your operations to hinder navigation for other users of the river".

Though they say "boat size", I let them know I was looking into the possibility of using a barge in the St. Johns River.

Like LOGDOG said, a barge with a small crane would work great. A while back a friend of mine, who is an experienced deadheader from way back, I will add, purposed getting a barge big enough to have a logging trailer on each side of the crane. When the two trailers were loaded, you could dock and drive them off. Of course you would be limited to a dockage that would work for this, but there is a place not far from 1 of the purposed sites that this could be done.
It was just one idea he thought of as he entertained the though of getting back into Deadheading. It would expensive, though if he wanted to, he certainly had the $ and experince to do it.
 
I think FDH'er had the right idea by keeping it a small operation. Even though it was a lot of work for those two, it was most likely a lot less hassle.

 



rvrdivr

I also wanted to add that there will be a class for the Master DeadHead Logging Certification in Tallahassee FL. sometime in Feb. and is only done once a year.
If your a permit holder and don't have one (like me  ;D) or you plan on getting a permit in Fl, you will need to go.


For information you can contact;
Sara Merritt
Environmental Specialist
Deadhead Logging Program
Department of Environmental Protection
Northwest District, SLERP
160 Governmental Center
Pensacola, FL 32502-5794
(850) 595-8300 x 1290
(850) 324-4734 Cell
(850) 595-8311 Fax


Fla._Deadheader


Tell Sara I said Hello. I'm pretty sure I sent her all the logging reports  ::) ::) :D :D
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Corley5

I spent a very enjoyable day with Harold, Ed and the Governor on the Ocklawaha.  Skidding logs with a boat was something I'd surely never been involved in before  8) 8) 8)  You'll need to hook up with the Governor rvdivr  ;) ;D  I've never seen so many alligators from little fellas 18" or so long to big ones that made big splashes :)  The red wasps were neat too  ;) and it wasn't snake time yet  ;D  Lots of hazards.  There didn't seem to be many logs left on that stretch of river though  8) 8)  Your system sure seemed to work Harold  :)
Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

Fla._Deadheader


Memorable day, EH, Greg  :D :D :D :D :D

  If the logs turned up as easy as Brian's, we wooda made some real $$$$$$

  Sure glad ya got to meet the Guvnor.  He is truly one of a kind.  ;) :D :D :D

  You shoulda been with us, the day we took the AIRBOAT scouting for logs  :o :o :o

  Riding high, The Guvnor would see a log, do a 90° or 180° and nearly pitch Ed and I right outta the boat. Then, he would "Beach" it, in a root wad, and bail out over the front, while the boat was still settling in.  :o :o :o

  Before we could get out, he would have looked the log over and declared it a "keeper" or "Junk". 


  Someday, I oughta write a book  ::) ::) ::) :D :D :D :D
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Corley5

Memorable for sure  8) 8) 8)  That 100hp outboard sure made that jon boat move  8)
Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

Fla._Deadheader


6 cylable Lycoming in the Airboat  ::) ::) :D :D :D
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Corley5

Quote from: Fla._Deadheader on January 02, 2007, 09:08:48 PM

6 cylable Lycoming in the Airboat  ::) ::) :D :D :D

WOW  I can only imagine the ride with the Gov on the stick  ;D  It was pretty impressive what the outboard would skid outta some of those backwater cricks.  I pretty sure the engineers at Mercury never intended them to be used quite like that  ;D
Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

Fla._Deadheader


First ride I ever took with him, was in a 12' Jonboat. Ed stayed in the "Swamp Rat" to do some repairs, and we shoved off up a tiny creek. Had to go over 1 log and under another. I scootched down between the 1st and 2nd seat, and the Guvnor hollered "HANG ON".

  It was slow getting moving and I couldn't get up yet, finally, we moved ahead.

  Found out later that Ed nearly wet hisself laffin. Seems that when we started over the log, the Boat lurched a tad, the Guvnor got his chin hooked on the log we had to go UNDER, and his hand was twistin the throttle, nearly chokin his head off  ::) :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

  We finally made hay, though.  :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D  He never let on about it, neither  :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

Corley5

 :D :D ;D ;D  He sure knows his way around that river and its tribs
Burnt Gunpowder is the Smell Of Freedom

getoverit

Greg, iffn you are in Florida again, you know you are always welcome on the Old Dixie Farm here in Hilliard :D
I'm a lumberjack and I'm ok, I work all night and sleep all day

Ironwood

Have you ever seen the military surplus collapsable fuel tanks used in airplane wings? They should make great "AIRBAGS" for lifting or even to stabilize the boats for lifting. They are HEAVY reinforced rubber. Reid
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Fla._Deadheader


It doesn't take much to raise a log, once it's broke loose from the sandy bottom. I used to pull the 4' X 24' Pontoons down intothe water, sometimes 12". Then you might have to sit and wait for the log to "pop". Other times, you are never sure the log is still hooked  ::) ;D  Large stuff has no place in a boat, especially the size Brian is using.

  Inner tubes can be a handy small storage item. Old timers used to sink barrels and tie onto logs. Then air 'em up and go back later to see if a log has "popped".  Them were all the easy ones. None of the easy ones left  ::) ::)
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

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