iDRY Vacuum Kilns

Sponsors:

Cutting Live Oak on a Band Sawmill

Started by Paul, December 10, 2006, 08:19:40 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Paul

Does anyone have any pointers for someone cutting live oak on a band sawmill?  I have found  a sawmill that will cut live oak for me ( several wouldn't ) but we are having a problem with cutting old (not green )live oak on a band sawmill. The owner of the mill doesn't cut much live oak.  The blade gets caked with pitch and powder causing it to not cut straight.  This man also has a 14" capacity circular sawmill that eats it up but the problem is I have logs this mill won't handle.  I am hoping there is an easy way to cut this hard stuff.  If anyone has any firsthand experience cutting long dead/flint hard live oak please let me know what you figured out.

We cut a log that had been dead for about three years and there were minimal problems. Then we tried cutting one that had been dead for who knows how long and the band sawmill just wouldn't cut straight because of the build up on the teeth and blade.

woodbowl

QuoteThe blade gets caked with pitch and powder causing it to

Paul, I run lots of water. No soap is needed. Diesel fuel doesn't work well either. Set your teeth at .019 and reduce the hook angle. (below 10°) Change blades often. (before they get dull)

It's still gona be tough, but it makes a big difference.
Full time custom sawing at the customers site since 1995.  WoodMizer LT40 Super Hyd.

Tom

There is not "easy" way.  it is difficult to cut, even when green.

I agree.  Lots of water for a lubricant.

The most important thing is a sharp tooth.  The teeth will dull in just a pass or two, sometimes.  It doesn't mean that the blade is beyond use for other woods, It is just too dull for Live Oak.  If the blade doesn't cut, take if off and put on another.

LeeB

I have not had real good luck with drying it either. Lots of degrade to warp and checking. Keep in mind also that it will be just as tough on your wood working tools. All that aside, I do think it makes pretty lumber. LeeB
'98 LT40HDD/Lombardini, Case 580L, Cat D4C, JD 3032 tractor, JD 5410 tractor, Husky 346, 372 and 562XP's. Stihl MS180 and MS361, 1998 and 2006 3/4 Ton 5.9 Cummins 4x4's, 1989 Dodge D100 w/ 318, and a 1966 Chevy C60 w/ dump bed.

Paul

Thank you both  for your replies.  The sharpness concept makes plenty of sense. I will make the recomendation about the setting of the teeth to my sawmiller. I Suggested cutting half way through the length of the log and then cleaning the blade but sawyer said this would not work.  I am going to try using a pressure washer on the blade when it exits the log/cant.  I think this might help.  Thanks again. Paul

Tom


a steady stream of water on the blade as it enter the wood while cutting is the best way.   Then make sure the blade and wheels are clean before you start another cut.

Paul

Okay, So you all have cut live oak before . I see everyone who has had anything to say is from the South. I am in Texas and it is a shame to see these old trees go to waste.  I know of one that is over four feet in diameter and the top of it has been cut off.  How do you handle something like that or do you?   Thanks for the replies. Paul

Perry

I am in South East Texas and we have some nice live oak trees here.  I have found a man with a bandmill who will cut them for me but we are running into problems.  He has not cut many of them because they don't cut easily. Recently we tried cutting a log that had been cut over ten years ago and the blade wouldn't cut straight.  I posted something like this on the guest page and got a few replies on what to do.

What I am looking for is some advice from someone who has actually cut old very hard live oak in wide widths on a bandmill with success.  Our problem was the pitch and dust accumulated on the blade and caused it to drift.

On the other post I was told to use a sharp blade, change it often, run straight water, 0.019", and 10 degree angle.  I will do all this but I am still looking for experience to guide me in the right direction.

My objective is to take old live oaks and mill them into thick benches or mantles.

Has anyone used a pressure washer while a mill was running to blast off the accumulation on the blade?  Thanks, Perry

getoverit

I have milled live oak with my bandmill and havent had problems with any buildup on the blade at all. I cant immagine why you would have any problems with any buildup. For lube on the blade, water or maybe a mixture of water and dishwashing liquid would work. You dont want so much lube that you cause the sawdust to turn into a mush, just enough to lubricate the blade. If sawdust doesnt fly out of the cut on the outbound side, you are running too much lube. When you have too much lube, the rake on the blade cant clear its self of all of the sawdust and will gum up and make a sawdust mush that may cause the problems you are discribing.

Otherwise, just go slow through the cut and use a good sharp blade that is set to the proper tension for the mill and you should get good straight cuts
I'm a lumberjack and I'm ok, I work all night and sleep all day

Jeff

I have merged Paul's, who is now member "Perry" guest thread with this thread to take benefit of the advice he was getting there.  :)
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Jeff

Quote from: Perry on December 10, 2006, 11:26:37 PM
On the other post I was told to use a sharp blade, change it often, run straight water, 0.019", and 10 degree angle.  I will do all this but I am still looking for experience to guide me in the right direction.

You won't or can't get better advice or more experience then From Tom. He's been at it a long time Hes a million board foot club Wood-mizer member that had a million feet then started counting a million, wore that mill out and went on to buy a big old Baker and he has put more wood through that then any other portable mill guy in North Florida that I know of. Tom knows his live Oak and the cutting characteristics of a bandmill as well as anyone.
Just call me the midget doctor.
Forestry Forum Founder and Chief Cook and Bottle Washer.

Commercial circle sawmill sawyer in a past life for 25yrs.
Ezekiel 22:30

Perry

re Getoverit's reply. I wish I had a sawmill but I don't... right now. The man who cut the log had the water on at a drip. We made a cut in an old log and the blade quickly acquired a layer of sawdust on it that caused it to make a wave type of cut. The resulting surface of the log had a sort of scale of sawdust on it.  The teeth of the blade were not clean but had a layer of stuck on dust.  The sawyer calls it pitch , but it is not like resin out of a conifer.  If you don't clean it off the blade pronto it becomes attached with a vengeance and is difficult to remove.

Before cutting the older log we cut a live oak which had been "topped " three years ago. It was much easier to cut this log.   Unless you own the mill it is difficult to control anything.

getoverit

The drip may have been too much or too little lube for the wood you were cutting. This is one thing that requires experience in knowing just the right amount needed for each cut. I have been known to change lube rates on the same log... more for wider cuts, less for narrow cuts. that is one of the things I fiddle with constantly while cutting.

Sharp blades, proper blade tension, the proper head speed through the log and just the right amount of lube will produce the boards you desire.

I agree with Jeff though... if you get advice from Tom on how to cut your log, you got the best advice one could ask for anywhere in the world.
I'm a lumberjack and I'm ok, I work all night and sleep all day

Perry

Thank you all very much for the advice and I will let ya'll know how it turns out. Perry

Kcwoodbutcher

I've cut very dead /dry oak and what I learned was patience. Use small stream of lube (water) and feed very slow. To fast a feed heats up the blade fast causing it to dull and heat up even more. The stuff you see on the blade may be charred sawdust which is very hard to remove.
My job is to do everything nobody else felt like doing today

Fla._Deadheader


We started out sawing very difficult type woods. Made a mod to the saw, by attaching a small stainless "Toothbrush" type Platers brush, to the outside of the fixed blade guide. It wipes off all stuck-on dust, before it gets mashed tight to the blade going over the band wheels. We wear them down, so, a quick change and we are back to production. I KNOW it saves us from sawdust problems.  There are photos in my Gallery.

  We have sawn dry-hard Live Oak.  Tom even watched us do one old tree. He just smiled.  ;D ;D
All truth passes through three stages:
   First, it is ridiculed;
   Second, it is violently opposed; and
   Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

-- Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)

customsawyer

I don't know about live oak but on very dry red or white oak I usually cut with no lube at all as the lube tends to make the saw dust swell and heat up the blade. Keep a close watch on the blade tension as the cut is made the blade will heat up and the tension will get weak which can cause the blade to wave on you.
The way you said it made one cut and then on the next cut it started to wave on you it might be that you took just enough sharp off of the blade that it wouldn't make the next cut. Tom made mention of having to change the blade after just one or two cuts and I would think this could be the trouble you are facing.
Two LT70s, Nyle L200 kiln, 4 head Pinheiro planer, 30" double surface Cantek planer, Lucas dedicated slabber, Slabmizer, and enough rolling stock and chainsaws to keep it all running.
www.thecustomsawyer.com

Slabs

Me n' CANTHOOK cleaved up a right big Live Oak about a year or better ago.  Had all the problems the other guys have mentioned.  One thing we may have done right was curing it in the shade.  Direct sunlight may aggrevate any tendancy to twist and warp.  I ran one of the scrap stickers  through my edger to clear down to the grain and take-a-look and got what may be a permanent stain on the edger table.  There must be some powerful acid in that wood.
Slabs  : Offloader, slab and sawdust Mexican, mill mechanic and electrician, general flunky.  Woodshop, metal woorking shop and electronics shop.

Thank You Sponsors!