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Mini equipment...

Started by Mr Mom, April 25, 2006, 11:01:03 AM

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Mr Mom

     I was looking at some tractors with a friend and saw a mini track-hoe and thought that would be a good thing to have.
     Does any have one or used one??
     I have used a back-hoe on a tractor before.
     I just thought that would be somthing good to have around the house. Dont need a big one.
     Sometimes i need some digging done but it is to small of a job to bring in a full size track-hoe to come and do some work.
     Dont have the money for one right now but just asking now might get lucky and win the lotto that i dont play.


     Thanks Alot Mr Mom.

Tom

I considered one of those mini-track hoes in '85.   I'm glad I didn't buy one.   they  have their place but have no strength.  Plumbers use them a lot and so do some swimming pool people.  For tight places and only digging fairly loose soil, they do good.  They don't compare to a "real" hoe though.

I was watching a plumber dig a ditch for a sewer line the other day.  He had rented a mini and was having a devil of a time.  Oaks had run roots across the front yard.  They were as big as 5" in diameter.  He was hardly scratching them.   I thought at first that he had found another sewer line, but it was roots.  He was fuming and had two of his plumbers/helpers with shovels and axes clearing the ground.  They may as well have just used the shovel for all the good the hoe was doing.  It had a roof on it, so I guess it provided some shade.  :D

I have a Ford 555 rubber tired hoe.  It is about a 60 horse tractor and would have made short work of those roots, albeit a mess if they were pulled up instead of cut.

The track hoes require a trailer to take them anywhere.   That's why I like the rubber tired hoe.  I can drive it to jobs that are within 5 miles of the house and not bother with trailers or towing.  I also have the benefit of a front end loader bucket.  That's worth its weight in gold every day.

I think a track hoe is a good idea in close places or for ponds and pools.  The reason is that they move dirt in a 360° range.  A Rubber tire hoe won't do that.  You have to re-dig.  Still, I would opt for 60 horse power, or better, if I really needed to get something done.


slowzuki

A 5 or 8 ton mini-hoe will out work a backhoe anyday but that is on the big side of things.  You are likely talking a 1-2 ton unit.

A trackhoe will easily outwork even a bigger compact tractor mounted unit though even though they cost similar.

Mr Mom

     Thanks alot guys.
     How about a mid-size track-hoe??
     
     Tom.....My place is too wet for a rubber tire hoe. Kind of damp the ground is very flat.
     When they put in my sepic they shot grade in 300 ft it dropped 1 1/2 inches. water hangs around for a while.


     Thanks Alot Mr Mom

     

Tom

A track  hoe is great if you aren't going to move it off site.   I'd like to have one.

I've just found that the rubber tired hoe is better for general farm type work.  I use it for lifting and grading and as a big wheelbarrow and ....      Having tires gets it around the property pretty quick. 

Once you have used a track hoe and have the capability of moving dirt 360, you get spoiled.   A back hoe doesn't work good in a hole, it is more of a trenching tool.  Though it is good for stumps and stuff too.

IL Bull

I'm with Tom on this.  A mini excavator is nice for some jobs because you can off-set the boom and dig along side of a building.  Most jobs don't require this and a tractor loader backhoe has a lot more uses.  I have even adapted mine (1977 Ford 420) with a skid steer coupler and can use skid steer attachments on the front.  I use a set of pallet forks and move logs and lumber around the yard. 8)
Case Skid Steer,  Ford Backhoe,  Allis WD45 and Burg Manual Sawmill

Mr Mom

     Good points. Thanks alot guys.
     Looks like i will keep my eyes open for a tractor with a loader and back- hoe.


     Thanks Alot Mr Mom

MULE_MAN

A mini Track Hoe would be good for some job's, But I think they require
pretty level ground, Where my Backhoe ,I can pretty well go where I want
I use forks on the bucket to move logs & I have even used the hoe to slide
logs one way are the other to better line up with the Mill.

There kind of like a 4 wheel drive Truck, You wonder how you ever make it with
out one  :D  :D  :D  ;D
Wood-Mizer LT40HDG25 with Simple Setworks, debatker, 580 CASE backhoe

scsmith42

Ditto what the others said.  Forget the mini - get something that will do some real work.

I concur with slowzuki that a trackhoe will outwork a similar sized backhoe any day of the week.  However, on a farm the versatility of a loader/backhoe way outshines the speed of the trackhoe.

If you get a track hoe, get a hydraulic thumb with it - you won't regret it.

If you get a backhoe, if at all possible get a 4WD model.  The quick detach buckets are really great if you alternate buckets and foks frequently, and can spare the extra bucks.  The extend-a-hoe's are also really nice - it's amazing what a difference the extra 4' makes.

Here's my baby...  I've got a separate set of forks for it and it is much easier to use them versus the bucket forks - primarily because I can see the end of the forks.  It's good for picking up over 6000 lbs.


Peterson 10" WPF with 65' of track
Smith - Gallagher dedicated slabber
Tom's 3638D Baker band mill
and a mix of log handling heavy equipment.

HARLEYRIDER

Quote from: slowzuki on April 25, 2006, 12:47:11 PM
A 5 or 8 ton mini-hoe will out work a backhoe anyday but that is on the big side of things.  You are likely talking a 1-2 ton unit.

A trackhoe will easily outwork even a bigger compact tractor mounted unit though even though they cost similar.

I agree. . we just rented a 9000 lb mini, that had a angle blade and hyd. thumb. the thumb was great for picking up rocks and trees...and putting them exactly where you want. I dug a rock out of the ground that is the size of a Yugo.  Its all in the operator....and I'm no pro
Greenwoods Timberworks

David_c

There are many sizes of small hoes. Seems to me the one Tom was talking about was to small for job at hand. I have never used one. But another forum I belong to www.heavyequipmentforums.com there are several over there that do many things with them and seem to like them alot. It all comes down to the right piece of equipment for the job. Also alot like to transport with roll off trucks, no need for trailer.

Dale Hatfield

I rented one to dig a water line from the spring down to the house for  spare water.
Lets  just say it was pretty weak.  I slipped a track into the ditch in the mud.  Had to get Toyota 4x4 to pull it out. Wouldnt couldnt  help its self.
They have their place just no on mine.

Dale
Game Of Logging trainer,  College instructor of logging/Tree Care
Chainsaw Carver

Mr Mom

     Thanks alot all informationis great as always when i ask a question on this fourm.



     Thanks Alot Mr Mom

HARLEYRIDER

bottom line is, the mini mini excavators (under 4000lb) are weak and worthless (unless your just digging dandelions from your lawn. The 8-9000lb excavators can do the work of the big boys...it just takes longer
Greenwoods Timberworks

wiam

I have a 7800# bobcat excavator.  I have been on slopes that I would have been scared in a rubber tired backhoe.   It is not too hard to make flat ground to work from with an excavator. Tracks also give better "floatation" on soft ground.  Off subject but I have run a 25 ton machine and after that a rubber tired machine will drive you nuts and a 50ton excavator with a 10,000lb rock breaker is fun for about 15 minutes.

sprucebunny

I looked into mini excavators a few months ago.

The minis only rotate 130 degrees .
MS193, MS192 and an 026  Weeding and Thinning. Gilbert Champion sawmill

Paul_H



This little excavator has a 12hp diesel but did a good job for $100 per day.We have clay soil and it was a little heavy for the machine sometimes but we needed a machine and it was available.

The guy that owned it wanted $4000 for the machine and I was tempted but decided to pass.We have an older skidsteer that is our workhorse around the property and we would like to find a backhoe attachment for it someday instead of a excavator.
Science isn't meant to be trusted it's to be tested

Mr Mom

     Thanks alot guy.  8)  8)  8)





     Thanks Alot Mr Mom
     

slowzuki

About wet ground, a 2wd industrial backhoe is one of the easiest things to get stuck.  They don't have much clearance and the tires are small.

4wd gets a bit better.  Yes the boom can drag you out but then you have a huge mess that you can't fix unless it dries out.

There are very few industrial hoes used by contractors here now.  My local equipment guy says, "They're no DanG good as a hoe and they're no DanG good as a loader, going to a farmer is the best place for the things"  He sold his last one in the 80's and replaced it with a big loader to match his 3 escavators.

A farm isn't a bad place as tires are cheaper to maintain than tracks and you generally have time to work.

RoadKill

I grew up using my grandfather's backhoe and now have a 16,000 lb excavator so I can compare the way they work.  With 360 degree swivel, the excavator can outdig any backhoe in strength and speed.  I can't speak for the real small ones, but the weight of the machine is a good place to start when comparing what they can do.   Backhoes are pretty good at moving material, since they are wheeled and have a big bucket.  I can work slopes with the excavator that would be dangerous with a backhoe - mainly because tracked vehicles are low to the ground.  Same reason that steep vineyards are starting to use tracked tractors instead of wheeled.  Tracks also give lower ground pressure, are better in wet conditions, and can produce more pulling or pushing force.  Trade off is slow speed and possibly maintenance.  Rubber tracked excavators have almost no maintenance except watching the tension and can travel on pavement without putting down boards, but they are expensive when it comes time to replace them.  Everyone I know in the excavating business is going to excavators to dig and skid steers to move material.  Backhoes are a great general purpose machine if you have the room to use one.
Yah, born in da UP, but 20 yeahs heah neah Baahstin.

Deadwood

Where I live anyway, Backhoes are a thing of the past. I know of one contractor that used to brag up all the benefits of his backhoe and the places he could dig that a excavator couldn't. Now that same contractor has sold his bachoe and runs an excavator just like everyone else.

We were once working in a gravel pit and had both a 5 yard Bucket Loader and a 1-1/2 yard excavator. I bet my boss that the excavator could outwork the wheel loader. He lost. That excavator was so quick, I could drop a load of raw earth in the feed hopper, then grab a bucket full of sifted gravel coming off the tail conveyor in mere seconds and all without moving the tracks. My dog loved it. He rode with me everyday and loved how the excavator spent much of its time just swinging instead of bouncing around like on the other machines.

Another great aspect of the excavator, is the learning curve. It takes about an hour to get good at these machines. The controls are just where you would want them to be and where it is natural. Besides, if you don't like which control runs each functions, switching them takes seconds.

Now so far I have typed all about bigger excavators, but I have operated smaller ones too. Most of the smaller ones have blades on them. Please do not make the mistake of thinking these things are a bulldozer. One contractor said he used his that way and had a nasty track repair bill the next year. An excavator has a bucket. His suggestion, and one I pass on to you, is to use it to your advantage. Dig and smooth with it, it's easy to master and allows you to "build a road" for the machine to ride out upon. Get the final grading as close as you can with the bucket, then do as few passes as you can with the blade and you are ahead of the game in time, production and with reduced repair bills.

One final thought. These machines, even the small ones are quite costly. Everytime I crunch the numbers, I have found that hiring a contractor is less epensive than renting or buying one of these smaller machines. A contractor can do so much more, so much faster, that in the end paying them 90 bucks an hour for a big machine with a great operator, is cheaper than renting/ buying a machine that would take you a week to do the same thing.

Just my two bucketfuls...

Ironwood

Good points on renting or hiring. I rent 8000-9000 lbers Track hoes about twice a year. They can really dig. I push over trees in the forest were no backhoe would ever go. I dig a bunch and leave the tree tall to use the weight to push it over. They are awsome for their size. I agree about the small ones being useless. So are small tractor backhoes and buckets, they look good in the literature but get trashed easily in the field working. I also rent a skid steer  about twice a year, usually  the Bobcat 863 size. Great machines, and I DON"T HAVE TO REPAIR, STORE OR PURCHASE THEM.

            Reid
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Mr Mom

     Thanks alot guys i will just hire it out.
     
     The reason i asked is beacuse i have some planes and they include some digging but some of the job does not call for a big hoe.


     Thanks Alot Mr Mom

     

Deadwood

We got a house out on Criehaven, a small Island off the coast of Maine and due to the cost of hauling a barge out there with a bulldozer aboard, we ended up building the runway with a 30 horsepower Kubota.

Thats kind of island way of life, use what you got because the mainland (and running water, and electricity, and phones, and cell service) is 32 nautical miles away. I got a picture of that runway some where. I'll see if I can post again with it.

Ironwood

Deadwood, Did you hear about the barge that got submerged out on one of the islands? They were taking a rental crane truck out to a timber frame job. The barge operator nearly sank the whole "kubutal" luckily they were near the dock when it happened. My brother in law knows the framer and I met them and saw pictures. WOW Luckily no one got injured just hurt wallets$$$$$$. Reid
There is no scarcity of opportunity to make a living at what you love to do, there is only scarcity of resolve to make it happen.- Wayne Dyer

Deadwood

I worked for a company called Cianbro Corp once. A huge company on the east coast, not a bad company to work for, just non-Union. In any case they lost a whole 100 ton crane out on a barge a few years ago. No one was hurt, but they decided it was cheaper to pay the environmental clean-up fee than it was to recover the crane. It's still there if you are looking for a soggy crane.

Also a few years ago, a company working at the Bath Iron Works Shipyard toppled into the river. The crane operator was close to shore and yet the poor soul never made it. Never found the body either.

A good fishing friend of mine out Bremen once lost a crane over a bridge up in Bangor working for Reed and Reed. He was an Urchin Diver and said it saved his life that day. I guess he was trapped in the cab underwater and could not see a thing. The only way he got out was to wait until the presure equalized in the cab by filling up with water, then feeling with his hand which way the bubbles were rising, and then swam for the surface. He said any other crane operator would have been killed because of panic. He was not saying this out of brvado, he was saying this because he had dived so much for Sea Urchins.

Deadwood

Okay it took me awhile to find this picture in my CD Files, but here it is. Taken a few years ago while the island community (12 houses) was working on having a new landing strip put in. The equipment was not much and the land was uncoperative (ledge), but for 50 bucks you can fly into Crienhaven by a Island Airlines.

Oh one more thing. Did you know that there is a special grass seed they use to make grass landing strips safer to land on? It's true!


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scsmith42

Travis - you've piqued my curiousity - what kind of seed is designed for grass airstrips?
Peterson 10" WPF with 65' of track
Smith - Gallagher dedicated slabber
Tom's 3638D Baker band mill
and a mix of log handling heavy equipment.

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